COMPLETE NOT NEW!! - Herbie Farnworth signed one year extension

[McHunt]

Not hearing TMM being mentioned here. Does Herbie know something we don't?

I'm not sure that's even possible.

 

[Jedhead]

My biggest concern with moving anyone other than TMM to fullback next season is that we finally have some consistency in the spine (Adams fitness aside).

I would rather we extend Martin for 2 years and not shift him unless someone gets an opportunity through injury and demands to keep their spot. How good would a whole preseason be with a settled spine instead of the shambles at the start of this year.

I’d rather know now that next year our spine will be:

1. Martin
6: Gamble
7. Reynolds
9. Paix + whoever

Rather than:

1. Martin/Herbie/Cobbo
6. Gamble/Martin/Mam
7. Reynolds
9. Walters/Paix

You make a good argument here.

 

[theshed]

We looked good in the first half vs Penrith until Tesi went down. A flick was switched before TMM.

What's TMM actually done for you to want to lock him in for next year? Is it purely a consistency thing or do you think he's the guy who can lead us to a premiership because we have a window until Adam retires which we'd be crazy to waste.
In 5 games 2 try assists, 0 trys, and averaging 76m. Those stats are especially poor when we've been romping teams so his stats should be inflated.

I see an argument for TMM 6 but Gamble has been good at 6 and improving.

I don’t think TMM is an amazing fullback by any means but he’s made about 6 more try saving tackles than Isaako Niu ever have.

Our defence has looked far more organised with him at the back and a number of players immediately commented on how much of an influence he has had for them defensively with his calmness and communication - Capewell being the most notable. Our points conceded halfed the minute he came into the team, I’m not willing to use half a game against Penrith as proof that that is purely coincidence.

His stats aren’t great but either were Boyd’s at most points in his career, even when he was good. TMM is an experienced player who plays very intelligently and actually reminds me a lot of Boyd. He doesn’t need to make metres when Oates, Cobbo, and Herbie are all making 100+ per week.

I just don’t see any reason to move Martin out of fullback for a player who has unknown fullback potential. Sure, flick him if a RTS or some other established option comes along, or if one of Cobbo or Herbie blow him out of the water at some point in the future but I don’t see anything but risk.

 

[007]

We looked good in the first half vs Penrith until Tesi went down. A flick was switched before TMM.

What's TMM actually done for you to want to lock him in for next year? Is it purely a consistency thing or do you think he's the guy who can lead us to a premiership because we have a window until Adam retires which we'd be crazy to waste.
In 5 games 2 try assists, 0 trys, and averaging 76m. Those stats are especially poor when we've been romping teams so his stats should be inflated.

I see an argument for TMM 6 but Gamble has been good at 6 and improving.

There are many things a good fullback does, which are not reflected in stats.

Football intelligence, level head, reading the opposition, herding the cattle, directing and being on and around the ball.

Tesi does none of the above.

 

[Lockysillegitimatechild]

There are many things a good fullback does, which are not reflected in stats.

Football intelligence, level head, reading the opposition, herding the cattle, directing and being on and around the ball.

Tesi does none of the above.

I agree with this comment massively but tbf niu improved being in and around the ball immensely since his debut games.. all the other things you said he is very, very weak in..

I don't get fans sometimes. Sure it's nice to fantasise about premierships and what we need to do to get there with a gun fullback or something. But ffs we have won 5/5 with TMM at the back. Why is this even a suggestion while we are still winning? Loss and he plays poorly then we chat about it

 

[007]

I agree with this comment massively but tbf niu improved being in and around the ball immensely since his debut games.. all the other things you said he is very, very weak in..

I don't get fans sometimes. Sure it's nice to fantasise about premierships and what we need to do to get there with a gun fullback or something. But ffs we have won 5/5 with TMM at the back. Why is this even a suggestion while we are still winning? Loss and he plays poorly then we chat about it

The evidence would only be clear to Kevvie and the team. If the players are working well and giving internal feedback that hes making a difference, then you don't change it.

 

[McHunt]

My biggest concern with moving anyone other than TMM to fullback next season is that we finally have some consistency in the spine (Adams fitness aside).

I would rather we extend Martin for 2 years and not shift him unless someone gets an opportunity through injury and demands to keep their spot. How good would a whole preseason be with a settled spine instead of the shambles at the start of this year.

I’d rather know now that next year our spine will be:

1. Martin
6: Gamble
7. Reynolds
9. Paix + whoever

Rather than:

1. Martin/Herbie/Cobbo
6. Gamble/Martin/Mam
7. Reynolds
9. Walters/Paix

I'd be happier if Gamble and Paix are our 6 & 9, when our regular 6 & 9 are away on Origin duty.

 

[theshed]

I'd be happier if Gamble and Paix are our 6 & 9, when our regular 6 & 9 are away on Origin duty.

Meh

 

[Mustafur]

We looked good in the first half vs Penrith until Tesi went down. A flick was switched before TMM.

What's TMM actually done for you to want to lock him in for next year? Is it purely a consistency thing or do you think he's the guy who can lead us to a premiership because we have a window until Adam retires which we'd be crazy to waste.
In 5 games 2 try assists, 0 trys, and averaging 76m. Those stats are especially poor when we've been romping teams so his stats should be inflated.

I see an argument for TMM 6 but Gamble has been good at 6 and improving.

What about the defence? alot of the defence structure can be attributed to the fullback who sits behind the line, the best fullbacks are in constant talk to fill in the holes.

I think try assists are not a clear stat to look at, otherwise can you confidently say Moses is the best in the competition at setting up tries?

Alot of assists that set up tries don't get counted because more then one pass after the setup play happened.

 

[Brotherdu]

We looked good in the first half vs Penrith until Tesi went down. A flick was switched before TMM.

What's TMM actually done for you to want to lock him in for next year? Is it purely a consistency thing or do you think he's the guy who can lead us to a premiership because we have a window until Adam retires which we'd be crazy to waste.
In 5 games 2 try assists, 0 trys, and averaging 76m. Those stats are especially poor when we've been romping teams so his stats should be inflated.

I see an argument for TMM 6 but Gamble has been good at 6 and improving.

I don't see us winning a premiership with Gamble at 6. TMM improves that position, we should definitely sign him, it'll be cheaper than bringing someone else in (unless Mam is ready), good halves are tough to find. Question is whether we can find someone to replace him with that doesn't weaken FB.

 

[Johnny92]

Thing is TMM isn't a fullback and I think if he got offered a spot in the halves here or elsewhere next year I think he'd jump at it.
I like him and he's doing well but our whole team has stepped up a gear and are playing for each other now which makes Martin's job alot easier. You can't put our improvement in defence down to 1 man at fullback.
Round 1 you could see improvement and Issako was at the back, Tesi came back and we had patches of good defence in games now it's all finally clicked it looks like.
Martin does things Tesi and Issako didn't do but that's not the fullback in him that's the footballer in him. Reynolds, Gamble, Capewell even Payne would be doing the same things if put at fullback.

For this season TMM is working so we shouldn't change that unless we go to shit but he's not the long term option.

 

[Kimlo]

What about the defence? alot of the defence structure can be attributed to the fullback who sits behind the line, the best fullbacks are in constant talk to fill in the holes.

I think try assists are not a clear stat to look at, otherwise can you confidently say Moses is the best in the competition at setting up tries?

Alot of assists that set up tries don't get counted because more then one pass after the setup play happened.

The whole team improved from that first half vs Penrith, it was evident. Go back and watch it, that first half we looked as good as we have the first 5 weeks, that was the start of our change.

I'm not bagging TMM, I just think he's being a bit overrated. TMM isn't the reason Staggs has been defending like an absolute beast, or Herbie pulling off try savers, or our general line speed being markedly better. He has been excellent defensively and he has pulled off awesome try savers, I gave him credit for that and I'm probably Tesi's biggest critic so don't take this as a I want Tesi back, no fucking way see you in Redcliffe champ, it's simply an argument for Herbie replying to @theshed saying he wants TMM at fullback for a solid 2 years. After 2 years Reynolds is probably retiring and our premiership window is firmly shut unless Ezra can be that player but I have my reservations about him being our spine leader.

It's simply a case of do I think TMM can take us to the promised land? And it's a no from me, he's reliable and that's really good and maybe that's all we need but having 1 star in our spine isn't going to cut it against the best teams. Reynolds can't carry 3 average players in the spine, we need more either from fullback or 5/8 to take the pressure off him.

I think Herbie can be that everywhere man at fullback and I have no reason to believe his defence would be an worse. Can he organise the team from the back? No idea.

 

[Kimlo]

The evidence would only be clear to Kevvie and the team. If the players are working well and giving internal feedback that hes making a difference, then you don't change it.

That's probably the most important point here which none of us on BHQ are going to be privy to. I'm not saying TMM should be moved from fullback, I'd want him there at least this year or if we start playing shit again. For as long as we're winning and winning as well as we are, no one's spot should be questioned.

 

[theshed]

The whole team improved from that first half vs Penrith, it was evident. Go back and watch it, that first half we looked as good as we have the first 5 weeks, that was the start of our change.

I'm not bagging TMM, I just think he's being a bit overrated. TMM isn't the reason Staggs has been defending like an absolute beast, or Herbie pulling off try savers, or our general line speed being markedly better. He has been excellent defensively and he has pulled off awesome try savers, I gave him credit for that and I'm probably Tesi's biggest critic so don't take this as a I want Tesi back, no fucking way see you in Redcliffe champ, it's simply an argument for Herbie replying to @theshed saying he wants TMM at fullback for a solid 2 years. After 2 years Reynolds is probably retiring and our premiership window is firmly shut unless Ezra can be that player but I have my reservations about him being our spine leader.

It's simply a case of do I think TMM can take us to the promised land? And it's a no from me, he's reliable and that's really good and maybe that's all we need but having 1 star in our spine isn't going to cut it against the best teams. Reynolds can't carry 3 average players in the spine, we need more either from fullback or 5/8 to take the pressure off him.

I think Herbie can be that everywhere man at fullback and I have no reason to believe his defence would be an worse. Can he organise the team from the back? No idea.

I get your point but maybe I’ve misrepresented my thoughts. I don’t want TMM to have a lock on the fullback position but I think it should be his to lose going into next year. Of course this is assuming he re-signs on a good value deal ($350k?). If one of the other guys step up then he can either move to 6 or be great spine depth for the rest of his contract.

I don’t think I’m overrating him. I’ve said I think he’s quite average in a lot of regards but he has brought a lot to the team that is already full of fire power and star athletes. Much like 2015 Boyd, their is enough fire power elsewhere to allow him to just do a solid job at the back.

I think your final sentence highlights my argument perfectly. TMM’s biggest strength has been his ability to organise from the back, and in a team that has had many weaknesses over the last few seasons, I believe this has been the biggest (or equal to having no organising half). It also happens to be the biggest strength TMM has displayed.

“Can Herbie organise the team from the back? No idea”

This is the exact concern. We know Martin can. If Herbie (or Cobbo) shows they can do a better job of this than Martin that’s great. I haven’t seen it though.

 

[ZTop]

Question, did we think te Marie Martin was going to be any good when he was first named at fullback? Don't overcomplicate this

 

[Mustafur]

The whole team improved from that first half vs Penrith, it was evident. Go back and watch it, that first half we looked as good as we have the first 5 weeks, that was the start of our change.

I'm not bagging TMM, I just think he's being a bit overrated. TMM isn't the reason Staggs has been defending like an absolute beast, or Herbie pulling off try savers, or our general line speed being markedly better. He has been excellent defensively and he has pulled off awesome try savers, I gave him credit for that and I'm probably Tesi's biggest critic so don't take this as a I want Tesi back, no fucking way see you in Redcliffe champ, it's simply an argument for Herbie replying to @theshed saying he wants TMM at fullback for a solid 2 years. After 2 years Reynolds is probably retiring and our premiership window is firmly shut unless Ezra can be that player but I have my reservations about him being our spine leader.

It's simply a case of do I think TMM can take us to the promised land? And it's a no from me, he's reliable and that's really good and maybe that's all we need but having 1 star in our spine isn't going to cut it against the best teams. Reynolds can't carry 3 average players in the spine, we need more either from fullback or 5/8 to take the pressure off him.

I think Herbie can be that everywhere man at fullback and I have no reason to believe his defence would be an worse. Can he organise the team from the back? No idea.

Yeah we looked good in attack but to be fair Niu was having a blinder, that said typical last year broncos being blown off the park in the second half happened so can we really take too much out of that, since TMM it's the second halfs that have taken a massive upswing which is the most noticeable improvement, there have been times last year where we have been in games for a select amount of time against good opposition only to be blown away eventually as well.

Personally I don't like this whole can we win X with X player thing while we are playing well, 2 of the players in question people talk about such as Martin and Gamble yet they have something alot of players don't they communicate and are steady players which bodes well for big games.

We do still need to play a Storm, Penrith and even the Cowboys with how we are now to get an idea where we are at against quality opposition but I'm not convinced they are not up to it.

Especially when we have a stupid amount of quality in non spine positions like the Middle and the edges.

 

[BroncosFever]

TMM's evolution as a fullback should be used to make sure Tesi gets on top of his injuries. Tesi was looking quite good before he went down and people are very critical of him, given he's only 20 years old

TMM isn't a long-term option, ideally we want him at 5/8 because I think in that situation we'd have quite a damaging halves combination

 

[theshed]

TMM's evolution as a fullback should be used to make sure Tesi gets on top of his injuries. Tesi was looking quite good before he went down and people are very critical of him, given he's only 20 years old

TMM isn't a long-term option, ideally we want him at 5/8 because I think in that situation we'd have quite a damaging halves combination

We finally got rid of Isaako, please don’t make me live through any more Niu.