The Macca Issue

[heartly87]

It comes down to the team identity really. Macca's game is Hook ball and to a smaller degree Bennett ball.
For me this new Broncos outfit should be a tempo and effort team, young fast big forwards getting on the front foot. Then when we finally get a full set of healthy backs we will see a young group of effort players. Bird and Staggs in the centres, Milf at fullback, Oats and ? on the sting is a pretty potent back 5. Our halfs are ? with Boyd still in the mix but if he continues to improve his game he may be able to make it work.

9 is the biggest issue at the moment for Seibs to fix. We need Turps and for me Seggy or somebody like that for this team to roll on and push for a premiership. I don't just say this because their passes are better or their the best playmakers, I say this because they bring energy to the side, they get us going. Turps on both sides of the footy especially.

 

[Big Pete]

We had three games of no McCullough (five if you count last season) and 3 (5) wins. McCullough comes back and we lose three straight and look as lethargic and dogshit as we previously did. Other factors like Dearden aside, it's obvious to everyone, even every other clubs' fans, that we look better without him. The points we scored were enough to win those games, and at this stage that's all that really matters. Turpin and/or Segeyaro are the best options we have currently, so we should use them properly and give them a legitimate shot of cementing their spot/s. I'm not suggesting throwing 3-5 year contracts at them and saying that's job done looking for a hooker after 5 or 6 games, but let them prove they deserve to be the immediate future.

Don't forget how raw Turps still is. His 'regulatory brain explosion' as you put it is typical of someone of his experience. And if anything it comes from over-enthusiasm, which I'm happy to take every day of the week over incompetence. He makes things happen, and really outside of a couple of bad decisions here and there and the 'mare he had v Parra (and what player hasn't had a bad game), he's had a hugely positive impact on the team and how we play and I 100% believe we don't win the games we did if it was only McCullough playing.

Turpin had 29 minutes vs the Knights and we were already down 18-6. Turpin in the halves vs the Sharks, Segeyaro the second half, we get outscored 14-12. With 3 hookers playing, you cannot hold that against them (including McCullough in this case). And we outscored the Warriors during the time Segeyaro was playing, granted not enough to win, but we still played better in that time and we get a point. Out of these games we have one half of football with a legitimate half and we outscore 12-8. Along with Milford doing 90% of the kicking from fullback. So points scored cannot be fairly judged with other games from the first half of the season

It may seem like the pro-Turpin crowd go overboard, but the at-least half-decade of staleness has caused any positive change to be met with overwhelming support.

Honestly I hate this type of bet-hedging post that parades as critical analysis.

It's not about hedging bets, it's about applying the same critical standard to those players. For all this talk about how they've improved the Broncos attack, it hasn' translated into points. In fact, the majority of those points scored have come through other means.

The Broncos still play the same forward oriented brand of football with them on the field and neither add a lot of variety to their play. Sure excuses could be made about how teams have to play around Segeyaro's strengths, but as we saw in Penrith and Cronulla, he can be extremely loose in his play as well.

 

[Allo]

It's not about hedging bets, it's about applying the same critical standard to those players. For all this talk about how they've improved the Broncos attack, it hasn' translated into points. In fact, the majority of those points scored have come through other means.

The Broncos still play the same forward oriented brand of football with them on the field and neither add a lot of variety to their play. Sure excuses could be made about how teams have to play around Segeyaro's strengths, but as we saw in Penrith and Cronulla, he can be extremely loose in his play as well.

So because we haven’t scored ‘more’ points, that automatically means they aren’t better?

Do we win the Roosters game if Segeyaro doesn’t duck under and score? Do we win the game if Turpin doesn’t belt Keary back in to the in-goal? It’s been a while but they’re two things that stand out that McCullough doesn’t or can’t do.

All we have to do is beat the teams in front of us, doesn’t matter if it’s by 1 point or by 30. With Turpin/Segs, we were doing that. They get the ball to the forwards quicker, our runs flow better as players aren’t waiting for a ball to come to them or needing to jump to catch it.

I don’t know how else to disprove whatever argument you’re representing so I’ll present some on your behalf for me to answer:

The team on the whole was under a new coaching structure leading to poor results, McCullough hasn’t played with Dearden/Not Kodi yet, Milf wasn’t at fullback, different team makeups with no Bird, Niko, Roberts etc etc.

All of those are considered and given weight to a degree, but you just have to watch the games. Put aside the different players (most of which are the same middle 3-6 forwards that have been there all season), the tackle and points stats, the fact Macca’s been there for 10 years and that Turpin’s been there for 10 games, and you know we play and look better as a team in general when it’s not McCullough at dummy-half. Even Walters knows this for SOO.

If anything McCullough should be playing halfback, because his short kicking game was actually quite good vs the Sharks. He can probably defend better on the edge too.

Give Turpin (and by extension Segeyaro) the time to be in his long-term position.

 

[Big Pete]

So because we haven’t scored ‘more’ points, that automatically means they aren’t better?

It suggests that they're not travelling as well as some would have you believe. That for all the promise, it's yet to fix the issues in the Broncos attacking structures. The Sydney Roosters game can be considered an exception, but even in that game, Turpin's flaws were apparent.

This isn't about picking a side between McCullough, Turpin and Segeyaro, it's about providing an honest and fair assessment. If I'm going to be critical of McCullough to the extent I was, I'll apply the same standards to the others.

For all we know, all three could be a bad fit for the club moving forward and the Broncos would have been better off looking elsewhere.

 

[Alec]

It suggests that they're not travelling as well as some would have you believe. That for all the promise, it's yet to fix the issues in the Broncos attacking structures. The Sydney Roosters game can be considered an exception, but even in that game, Turpin's flaws were apparent.

This isn't about picking a side between McCullough, Turpin and Segeyaro, it's about providing an honest and fair assessment. If I'm going to be critical of McCullough to the extent I was, I'll apply the same standards to the others.

For all we know, all three could be a bad fit for the club moving forward and the Broncos would have been better off looking elsewhere.

If Turpin or Segeyaro could fix all the attacking issues with the current Broncos side (with the makeshift halves, Boyd at fullback, ordinary back line), they'd have to be probably better than Cameron Smith. They might not be the long term answer, but someone like Dearden or whatever might not end up the long term answer either.

 

[Big Pete]

If Turpin or Segeyaro could fix all the attacking issues with the current Broncos side (with the makeshift halves, Boyd at fullback, ordinary back line), they'd have to be probably better than Cameron Smith. They might not be the long term answer, but someone like Dearden or whatever might not end up the long term answer either.

Just to be clear, nobody is asking that much of them. Just a direct improvement over McCullough which really shouldn't be asking much.

Dearden is at a completely different stage of his career to those players, so that's a poor comparison.

 

[Allo]

So. Much. Rhetoric.

 

[Alec]

Just to be clear, nobody is asking that much of them. Just a direct improvement over McCullough which really shouldn't be asking much.

Dearden is at a completely different stage of his career to those players, so that's a poor comparison.

Well they have shown direct improvement. It not always necessarily showing it on the scoreboard just means the team couldn't always make use of the better service and more creative and energetic play.

 

[Locky’s Left Boot]

Michael Ennis is the one journo who is very critical and exasperated with his play, I love when he comentates our game, Parker has started to get on board too.....have hope folks, the ride is turning!

Ennis’ criticism of Macca holds a lot of weight too considering he is a grand final winning and rep number 9. Surprised we didn’t beat Canberra to the punch and get someone like him working with our dummy halves. Although if he had to work with McCullough, you could bet your bottom dollar Mick would be on Seibs ear saying “your best chance of winning is to start Turpin with Segeyaro getting 20-30 mins in the second half”

 

[Locky’s Left Boot]

I actually thought Macca played better at 7 the other week.

He suits the 7 role better than the 9. He could play a bit like Cronk does for Roosters at the moment.

Change ‘at the moment’ with ‘in the 2018 GF’ and I’ll agree whole heartedly. The less Macca touches the ball in attack the better.

Does Macca even engage the markers? His speed plus this is probably one of the main reasons our forwards don’t get over the advantage line until our better 9’s come onto the field.

 

[Big Pete]

Well they have shown direct improvement. It not always necessarily showing it on the scoreboard just means the team couldn't always make use of the better service and more creative and energetic play.

If it isn't tangible, then I wouldn't consider it a direct improvement. Turpin and Segeyaro may pass the eye test for most, but outside of that run of victories they're not putting forward an undeniable argument. There's holes there and it would be willfully ignorant to turn a blind eye to those figures.

Unless something drastic happens, I can't see the Broncos ridding themselves of that lingering doubt. McCullough will continue to feature in the 17, so the others won't get to put forward a fair sample size to make an effective argument.

Ennis’ criticism of Macca holds a lot of weight too considering he is a grand final winning and rep number 9.

Also carries a slice of 'I told you so'. It prevents him from being an impartial judge, but makes his criticisms more justified considering they worked together.

 

[McHunt]

Unless something drastic happens, I can't see the Broncos ridding themselves of that lingering doubt. McCullough will continue to feature in the 17, so the others won't get to put forward a fair sample size to make an effective argument.

Macca is a septic wound who drains the life force out of this team. If he's still around next year, we should jump ship and follow the Storm. **** a club that runs a halfway house for mediocrity.

 

[broncos4life]

Macca is a septic wound who drains the life force out of this team. If he's still around next year, we should jump ship and follow the Storm. **** a club that runs a halfway house for mediocrity.

Sounds good, you go first and then we will all follow...

 

[Kimlo]

Macca is a septic wound who drains the life force out of this team. If he's still around next year, we should jump ship and follow the Storm. **** a club that runs a halfway house for mediocrity.

I'd rather give Macca a 10 year extension than ever cheer for that shit stain grub club that is a cancer on rugby league. No one has done more damage to league than the Storm with their grubbery.

 

[theshed]

It would be interesting to see how our forwards perform during the time each of our 3 hooking options are on the field.

Avg metres, avg PCM, avg set metres etc

 

[I bleed Maroon]

I would've thought Ennis has every right to have a bit of "I told you so" headwobble about him. He was 3 times the Hooker Macca is and the proof is in the pudding.

 

[Big Pete]

Ennis is entitled to say whatever he wants but there's a bitterness behind his statements. I don't think it's necessarily coming from a place of being a premiership winning dummy half, rather a place of being an ex-Bronco with an axe to grind.

 

[tommy]

Ennis is entitled to say whatever he wants but there's a bitterness behind his statements. I don't think it's necessarily coming from a place of being a premiership winning dummy half, rather a place of being an ex-Bronco with an axe to grind.

Come on Pete, give us your thoughts on Macca and his place in our team. You're way too diplomatic. Is everybody wrong or does Macca have to go?