Darren Lockyer set to be named 9th immortal

[OXY-351]

After he got inducted, it lost all of it's credibility.

The criteria was on & off field deeds, then they changed it to not include off field deeds.

I don't really have an opinion on whether off field deeds should or shouldn't be included, but I think if players of yesteryear were subject to as much off field scrutiny as current day players, then some of them may not be remembered as fondly as they are.

 

[Kaz]

Don't think the other Immortals were drug takers.

Yes they got into strife, but to my knowledge they didn't take illegal substances that IMO were covered up.

 

[Huge]

Don't think the other Immortals were drug takers.

Yes they got into strife, but to my knowledge they didn't take illegal substances that IMO were covered up.

I've taken illegal drugs, hundreds of times but that doesn't define me. A person is not just one thing. That said, I would never have considered Johns as an immortal. My reasons would be different to yours. You do know that you can have taken illegal drugs in your past and still be a good, even great person. History is littered with such people.

 

[tommy]

I've taken illegal drugs, hundreds of times but that doesn't define me. A person is not just one thing. That said, I would never have considered Johns as an immortal. My reasons would be different to yours. You do know that you can have taken illegal drugs in your past and still be a good, even great person. History is littered with such people.

I agree with this. I said in another thread maybe a week ago that as long as Johns wasn't taking the field while high then there's no problem.Taking the field while high would be cheating. Adults should be able to do what they like as long as it isn't hurting anyone else.

 

[mitch222]

The Hall of Fame is more worthy for players to get into

 

[Mr Fourex]

I've taken illegal drugs, hundreds of times but that doesn't define me. A person is not just one thing. That said, I would never have considered Johns as an immortal. My reasons would be different to yours. You do know that you can have taken illegal drugs in your past and still be a good, even great person. History is littered with such people.

Sure....but were they sports people?

I don't think so.

 

[Huge]

EDIT: Defamatory

 

[Smartseal]

EDIT: Defamatory

 

[Huge]

Sure....but were they sports people?

I don't think so.

No, Mr Fourex, I actually didn't name anyone. I didn't infer any particular team, I didn't even name a sport. In the seventies, players from some Sydney clubs were using anabolic steroids under the supervision of the clubs. That's rugby league I'm talking about. Steroids were around everywhere and it was common knowledge people were using them to gain advantage. A person would be naive to think that if one club, Parramatta had a player using steroids and he was doing so under their supervision, that other clubs would not be doing the same thing. In the late seventies it wasn't technically illegal because the abuse was in its infancy but it continued or many years after until testing started to finally catch up.

Players miraculously gained massive amounts of muscle and it all pointed to drug abuse. Naturally, it wasn't confined to rugby league as it was throughout the olympics and world sport generally. The long and the short of it is this. Teams that have won titles in the following years very likely ( it is not certain or proven but ) had players who had used steroids during the season or off season. If you need a source you only have to look up Graham Olling. During the off season of 77/78 he took steroids and in the season following gained muscle mass and ended up playing for Australia !!! He started at the Roosters and moved to Parra for five seasons. He played for Australia in 77, took steroids in the off season and then played for Australia again in 78. The doctor who administered the course of steroids was associated with Sydney City Tattersals .

Source: Sun Herald, Ian Heads 21/06/1998

 

[Nashy]

Have you got a link to that article Huge, would love to have a read.

 

[Huge]

Have you got a link to that article Huge, would love to have a read.

I'm not real flash with the computery thingys ! It's newsstore.fairfax.com.au if that's helpful.

[h=2]Risk vs reward[/h] Author: IAN HEADS Date: 21/06/1998 Words: 489 Publication: Sun Herald Section: Sport Page: 111

TWENTY-ONE years on, Graham "Shovels" Olling understands the temptation factor that leads footballers over the edge and into the world of steroids. In 1978, the Australian prop made history and the headlines when he revealed that he had undertaken a course of anabolic steroids.In rugby league, he was the first. "I don't condone it," he said yesterday. "With the rules as they are now, they are risking careers. "But with the rewards that exist in rugby league today, I can understand some blokes weighing it all up - the health risks, the cheating aspects of it - and deciding to take the chance. "There's such a lot on offer in sport today - money, prestige - that it will keep happening." Olling, the former Easts, Parramatta and Australian prop forward, has looked on with a quizzical eye at league's growing drugs storm during the week. Now living in Brisbane, he had an inkling that his phone might ring one day and he would be pitchforked back into the news. By today's standards, as footballers confront a bewildering range of "supplements", some OK, some not, some borderline, Olling's was a modest affair. Under strict medical supervision he undertook a six-week course of steroids in the off-season of 1977-78, five milligrams a day. Olling did nothing illegal: steroid use was not banned in league then. "I didn't understand it at the time, but knowing what I know now, I realise that I was only on therapeutic doses," Olling explained yesterday. "It was just something I tried. A lot of people try different things through life." The program, supervised by a doctor associated with Sydney's City Tattersall's Club, went hand-in-hand with an intensive six-week training program. In 1978 he had the best season of an admirable, hard-working career, playing four Tests, two of them on the Kangaroo tour where he proved a fine team man and strong performer. Olling has no idea what effect the steroid program had on him and his career. "I honestly don't think it did too much for me," he said. "I put on a little bit of weight. "But I was training six days a week then, and I'm inclined to think that anything I got, I reckon I got through the work I did." Olling believes he suffered no health after-effects of the comparatively light steroids program. Today, while understanding the mind-set of players who do stray in the '90s, he counsels them against it. "With the way the game is today, with interchange, if blokes do the right training they will have the endurance to do what has to be done," he said. Olling is still bemused at the fuss his own actions caused. "It was just something I did," he said. "I didn't think it was any drama. "Honestly, I thought it had all blown over by now." SUNDAY SCOREBOARD NRL LADDER P W D L F A Pts Melbourne 15 12 1 2 373 202 25 Newcastle 14 12 - 2 330 187 24 Parramatta 15 12 - 3 306 202 24 St George 14 11 - 3 311 232 22 Sydney City 14 10 - 4 366 231 20 Brisbane 14 9 - 5 396 204 18 North Sydney 15 9 - 6 382 269 18 Canberra 14 8 - 6 314 251 16 Balmain 15 8 - 7 277 252 16 Cronulla 15 8 - 7 244 243 16 Illawarra 15 7 1 7 313 314 15 North Qld 15 7 - 8 259 332 14 Canterbury 14 6 - 8 266 252 12 Auckland 14 5 - 9 221 301 10 Penrith 14 4 - 10 310 359 8 Manly 14 4 - 10 220 335 8 Wests 14 4 - 10 252 387 8 Adelaide 15 3 - 12 193 403 6 Gold Coast 15 3 - 12 172 416 6 South Sydney 15 2 - 13 203 336 4 TOP TACKLERS L. Ricketson (Sydney City) 406 J. Goddard (Gold Coast) 405 S. Bonetti (Sydney City) 378 L. Swann (Auckland) 367 T. Norton (Canterbury) 359 J. Schloss (Souths0 359 M. Stimson (Balmain) 356 MOST OFF-LOADS R. Kearns (Melbourne) 53 S. Kearney (Auckland) 51 D. Pay (Parramatta) 47 P. Harragon (Newcastle) 44 Ken McGuiness (Wests) 41 D. Furner (Canberra) 41 A. Johns (Newcastle) 38 MOST HIT-UPS R. Howe (Melbourne) 278 M. Bai (Melbourne) 269 C. Smith (Illawarra) 261 C. Schifcofske (Parramatta) 242 P. Carige (Parramatta) 237 C. Pearson (St George) 236 R. Kearns (Melbourne) 234 MOST LINE BREAKS D. Lockyer (Brisbane) 21 T. Brasher (Souths) 19 S. Jones (Auckland) 19 S. Renouf (Brisbane) 18 M. McLinden (Canberra) 17 S. Menzies (Manly) 16 J. Ainscough (St George) 16 Statistics correct after Round 14 I&T League Stats.

 

[Huge]

EDIT: Awaiting staff approval.

 

[OXY-351]

EDIT: Quoted a modded post

 

[Big Pete]

Folks unless you've got a credible source please steer clear of making drug allegations.

That includes speculating about drug usage in relation to abnormal performances.

Thank you for understanding.

 

[Huge]

I just read an interesting article which had Brian Smith as its focus. He was discussing his belief as a coach that the code had a problem with drugs. This was the late 90's when Howe was caught in the act. When you consider Ollings case 20 years before it's easy to start wondering if those two decades had a lot of doubt about them. I firmly believe that the records of those decades has to be viewed with some scepticism. Naturally most players and coaches would have been clean but still there must have been quite a few who 'got away with it' primarily due to testing being problematic.

 

[Mr Fourex]

No, Mr Fourex, I actually didn't name anyone. I didn't infer any particular team, I didn't even name a sport. In the seventies, players from some Sydney clubs were using anabolic steroids under the supervision of the clubs. That's rugby league I'm talking about. Steroids were around everywhere and it was common knowledge people were using them to gain advantage. A person would be naive to think that if one club, Parramatta had a player using steroids and he was doing so under their supervision, that other clubs would not be doing the same thing. In the late seventies it wasn't technically illegal because the abuse was in its infancy but it continued or many years after until testing started to finally catch up.

Players miraculously gained massive amounts of muscle and it all pointed to drug abuse. Naturally, it wasn't confined to rugby league as it was throughout the olympics and world sport generally. The long and the short of it is this. Teams that have won titles in the following years very likely ( it is not certain or proven but ) had players who had used steroids during the season or off season. If you need a source you only have to look up Graham Olling. During the off season of 77/78 he took steroids and in the season following gained muscle mass and ended up playing for Australia !!! He started at the Roosters and moved to Parra for five seasons. He played for Australia in 77, took steroids in the off season and then played for Australia again in 78. The doctor who administered the course of steroids was associated with Sydney City Tattersals .

Source: Sun Herald, Ian Heads 21/06/1998

Thanks Huge.

My earlier comment was in reference to yours, regarding the use of recreational drugs, not PED's.

Whilst it's true that many a great/famous mind has been very successful in their careers whilst fully engaging with recreational drugs.....I don't think you will find sports people in amongst them. The demands of physical activity and commitment that is required to play any given sport at the highest level, is IMO too great to have recreational drugs as a fall back lifestyle.

You and I can smoke our pipes, snort our lines and pop whatever pill we like and still run around on the weekend and kick a ball. We aren't bad people, but we aren't elite sports people either. Andrew Johns supposedly was.......