THE COACH Kevin Walters

[Foordy]

For sure there is Tiers I would argue it's more like 4 tiers though, Titans, Raiders and Warriors especially are beyond our team, look at who they are playing and the results they are getting. Of course it could change over the course of the season but it's how I see it now.

Tier 1: Panthers, Storm, Rabbitohs, Eels, Roosters

Tier 2: Knights, Raiders, Warriors, Titans

Tier3: Sharks(Maybe good enough for 2), Dragons, Broncos and Tigers

Tier 4: Bulldogs, Manly, Cowboys

Finals Footy for the bottom 2 Tiers is not going to happen, unless a miracle run at the end of season happens.

you're massively over-rating the knights, Titans and Warriors ... not to mention that the Knights lost to the Tigpies last week

 

[Mustafur]

you're massively over-rating the knights, Titans and Warriors ... not to mention that the Knights lost to the Tigpies last week

Not really, every team will lose a game they are expected to win, I would bet the knights would best them if they played the week after.

Titans and Warriors are all Surprior teams to us ATM it doesn't take a genius to see that.

 

[Foordy]

Not really, every team will lose a game they are expected to win, I would bet the knights would best them if they played the week after.

Titans and Warriors are all Surprior teams to us ATM it doesn't take a genius to see that.

completely disagree

 

[Mustafur]

completely disagree

That's fine but I think it will become apparent when we play those teams, they have all strengthened their squads from last year.

 

[Big Pete]

For sure there is Tiers I would argue it's more like 4 tiers though, Titans, Raiders and Warriors especially are beyond our team, look at who they are playing and the results they are getting. Of course it could change over the course of the season but it's how I see it now.

Tier 1: Panthers, Storm, Rabbitohs, Eels, Roosters

Tier 2: Knights, Raiders, Warriors, Titans

Tier3: Sharks(Maybe good enough for 2), Dragons, Broncos and Tigers

Tier 4: Bulldogs, Manly, Cowboys

Finals Footy for the bottom 2 Tiers is not going to happen, unless a miracle run at the end of season happens.

I think we'll see further divisions as the competition goes on but currently, I have three tiers.

Tier 1 is Penrith, Melbourne, Sydney, Canberra, Souths and Parramatta.

Canberra belong in here, they've been among the best teams in the competition for the past few seasons now and they've got the systems in place now to bring through quality talent when they need them. They play with finals intensity most weeks which is a gear a lot of the middle teams don't have.

Tier 2 is Newcastle, Cronulla, New Zealand and Gold Coast.

These are the teams that have the structures in place and have some combinations forming but either the cattle isn't quite there or they're not as good as the top tier teams.

Tier 3 is Wests, Manly, St. George, North Queensland, Canterbury & Brisbane.

Struggling teams still trying to find themselves and they'll completely lose the plot and get bullied when things don't go their way. A couple of them may join Tier 2 by season's end but right now it is what it is. The sad thing is, in most competitions, you usually only see one maybe two teams in this position. I haven't seen something like this since 2007.

 

[ivanhungryjak]

Some interesting stats re margins.

 

[Jason Simmons]

I know people don't want to hear this ...

but after 4 games this season we literally fell only 20 minutes short of being 3-1 this season.

against Para we had a 15 minute period where they scored 3 tries to take the lead while we had only 1 man on the bench. although we need to keep that hush hush, as the media only care of that injury toll happens to the Roosters.

against the Titans, we went to sleep for 5 minutes just before half time, letting in 3 tries. for the other 75 minutes of that match we outscored the new "giants" of QLD rugby league.

It doesn’t make the slightest bit of difference if it’s 10 minutes, 5 minutes or 2 minutes. It’s the points we are conceding. 4 tries last night. 3 tries each against the Tits and Eels.

We just crumble under pressure like wet paper. Our defence, ordinary at the best of times, becomes non-existant, our shoulders slump and any form or resilience, mental toughness whatever you want to call it, completely evaporates.

We concede 20 plus points in that timeframe and that’s the game. We’re cooked.

The good teams go on with it and it ends up a rout, as we saw last night and will see over the next few weeks.

For all Kevvie’s talk of working on defence in the off-season. They’ve achieved 2/5’th of f*ckall in improving that or any other area of our game...

Same arm grabbing, same ball watching, same lack of line-speed and zero communication, at least until the inevitable try is scored and then we see our gallant “leader” give the ever inspiring ‘one set’ cry which is (usually) entirely ignored, if they were even listening to him in the first place...

 

[BroncsFan]

I think we'll see further divisions as the competition goes on but currently, I have three tiers.

Tier 1 is Penrith, Melbourne, Sydney, Canberra, Souths and Parramatta.

Canberra belong in here, they've been among the best teams in the competition for the past few seasons now and they've got the systems in place now to bring through quality talent when they need them. They play with finals intensity most weeks which is a gear a lot of the middle teams don't have.

Tier 2 is Newcastle, Cronulla, New Zealand and Gold Coast.

These are the teams that have the structures in place and have some combinations forming but either the cattle isn't quite there or they're not as good as the top tier teams.

Tier 3 is Wests, Manly, St. George, North Queensland, Canterbury & Brisbane.

Struggling teams still trying to find themselves and they'll completely lose the plot and get bullied when things don't go their way. A couple of them may join Tier 2 by season's end but right now it is what it is. The sad thing is, in most competitions, you usually only see one maybe two teams in this position. I haven't seen something like this since 2007.

Yeah I think I agree with your tiering the most, but it's also very sensitive. A team can quite quickly drop tiers because of injuries (look at manly without Turbo... how far do Easts drop without Keary and a young spine).

Last year I would probably have Melbourne and Easts as the top of tier 1 when fully fit. This year I'd say Easts were easily my top tier on their own, because Melbourne lost CS9. However, the loss of Keary brings them way back.

Souths join the top of tier 1 because of the immense talent they have across their squad and they probably have the best spine in the comp.

Melbourne are a little bit of an unknown, primarily because they lose CS9's composure, but Grant legitimately looks the top 1 or 2 hooker in the comp and their structure is holding up... although fatigue and speed of play may catch up to them in the end

However, without Keary how far down the list do Easts now suddenly fall?

I think Canberra, Parra and Penrith are a tier below those 3. Penrith and Parra had a lot of advantages due to covid last year... I think Penrith didn't leave NSW until round 17 last year (hello lack of FIFO) and to me they were easily beaten if not smashed in the GF by Melbourne... they had some very dubious calls go their way and scored their last try with no time on the clock to bring it within 4 or something.

In the next tier New Zealand to me are very susceptible to dropping to the lower level... for whatever reason they are remaining competitive with basically only Kodi and RTS as competent players in their spine, so do they all of a sudden fall in a heap if something changes mentally. AFB was a massive pick up, but I think they're playing well above their weight at the moment.

I also think tier 2 is closer to tier 3 than they are tier 1... and by that I mean a tier 3 team is closer to beating them than they are to beating a tier 1 team.

Overall I just think the comp is closer to an EPL system with how disproportionate the quality is between the tiering than what a salary cap is meant to be delivering and I think players will lean towards going to a higher tier team than a lower if salary is the same.

That is not a good thing for the NRL and unfortunately the Broncos are on the wrong side of the ledger at the absolute worst time in their history

 

[Mustafur]

Honestly 10th to 12th at end of season is a big pass mark for kevvie, we have jack all experience and leadership which is crucial for performance in top tier league sides.

 

[Dexter]

Was just listening to Brad Thorn speak after the Reds big win over Rebels. We need to get him involved somehow. He spoke briefly about his philosophy including mateship, accountability, etc. Very impressive.

I like Thorn but what's he taken? 5 years to get the reds going. We just arent that patient as a club or a fan base.
Unfortunately unless we accept that time frame we will be at the bottom .

 

[theshed]

I know people don't want to hear this ...

but after 4 games this season we literally fell only 20 minutes short of being 3-1 this season.

against Para we had a 15 minute period where they scored 3 tries to take the lead while we had only 1 man on the bench. although we need to keep that hush hush, as the media only care of that injury toll happens to the Roosters.

against the Titans, we went to sleep for 5 minutes just before half time, letting in 3 tries. for the other 75 minutes of that match we outscored the new "giants" of QLD rugby league.

I am aware of this and I think I may have been the first person to point this out. It’s a glass is half full outlook for sure but Seibold’s record looks significantly different if you remove the worst 10 minutes of each game too. Actually that would be a fun thing to look into.

 

[ivanhungryjak]

I like Thorn but what's he taken? 5 years to get the reds going. We just arent that patient as a club or a fan base.
Unfortunately unless we accept that time frame we will be at the bottom .

Well this is his fourth year and he got them going alright last year.

 

[I bleed Maroon]

I like Thorn but what's he taken? 5 years to get the reds going. We just arent that patient as a club or a fan base.
Unfortunately unless we accept that time frame we will be at the bottom .

I'm sorry to say but we are gonna need to accept the reality that 4-5 years is exactly the timeframe we're looking at right now to get back into the fight. That is just the size of the crater that Seiplod and the board that hired him and won't give Kev any breathing space have created.

 

[Alec]

There are so many variables when it comes to tiers, injuries, talent, points scored and conceded. This can all easily change week by week too.
I'd honestly break it down to about 16 tiers. If only we could come up with a table or something to keep track of it.

 

[Foordy]

Well this is his fourth year and he got them going alright last year.

So basically he started going well once he didn't have to play the South African and NZ teams

I am aware of this and I think I may have been the first person to point this out. It’s a glass is half full outlook for sure but Seibold’s record looks significantly different if you remove the worst 10 minutes of each game too. Actually that would be a fun thing to look into.

Seibolds record looks much better if you take out the last 75 minutes of each game, lol

IMO, the biggest difference so far between Seibolds Broncos and Kevvies Broncos, is that Kevvies Broncos haven't given up yet. Seibolds teams always seemed to quit on him (a bit like Paytens Cowboys)

 

[theshed]

So basically he started going well once he didn't have to play the South African and NZ teams



Seibolds record looks much better if you take out the last 75 minutes of each game, lol

IMO, the biggest difference so far between Seibolds Broncos and Kevvies Broncos, is that Kevvies Broncos haven't given up yet. Seibolds teams always seemed to quit on him (a bit like Paytens Cowboys)

They definitely quit against the storm.

 

[Foordy]

They definitely quit against the storm.

I don't agree that we quit ... the 55% possession the Storm had didn't help us

 

[theshed]

I don't agree that we quit ... the 55% possession the Storm had didn't help us

Sorry but I think if you’re blaming that score line on 55% possession I think you are really grasping at straws for an excuse