[2025 Trial] Broncos vs. Titans

[beaseagull]

And what are you basing that on ?
A dislike for Mariner or some secret information only you know about ? I think Karapani is a chance in front of Shiba .

The fact that Shibasaki has been training there all preseason while Mariner has almost exclusively trained with the reserves, watch closely.

 

[Manofoneway]

I honestly think Mariner is far too (want for a better word) dopey to play consistent football. You need more than just fast and skilful, specifically defending in the centres. I rate Mariner, Piakura and Mam as our biggest let downs in the 2024 season. All of them are a bit dopey in their own right, Madge knows it which is why he is looking elsewhere to fill some starting positions.

 

[Tristan1990]

The fact that Shibasaki has been training there all preseason while Mariner has almost exclusively trained with the reserves, watch closely.

would need to be elevated into the top 30 though

 

[NSW stables]

I honestly think Mariner is far too (want for a better word) dopey to play consistent football. You need more than just fast and skilful, specifically defending in the centres. I rate Mariner, Piakura and Mam as our biggest let downs in the 2024 season. All of them are a bit dopey in their own right, Madge knows it which is why he is looking elsewhere to fill some starting positions.

I think there was an interview where broncos players basically said mariner and piakura were both space cadets.

Reading of the attack is so important in Edge defence, and mariner just did not demonstrate those skills. The nrl is not the greatest place to learn the basics/essentials. That is why the broncos were not successful with the "potential" young players. Yes they could be good, but they have some big holes in their game that first graders identify and exploit.

Previously many centres were introduced to top grade via the wing, and would learn working next to a more experienced centre. This is why I think he is best playing the wing for now (at least defensively).

With regards to mam, In Qcup, mam's defensive reads were terrible, but when in first grade, was positioned next to capewell and herbie who were both pretty good defenders/readers of the attack, and this wall papered over mam's deficiencies, but when they left and he was placed next to mariner and piakura who both had their own defensive issues, the flood gates opened. That was one of my major issues with KW coaching, he did nothing to address the defence on that side.

 

[Big Del]

The fact that Shibasaki has been training there all preseason while Mariner has almost exclusively trained with the reserves, watch closely.

Do you go to training ?

 

[HarryAllan7]

I think there was an interview where broncos players basically said mariner and piakura were both space cadets.

Reading of the attack is so important in Edge defence, and mariner just did not demonstrate those skills. The nrl is not the greatest place to learn the basics/essentials. That is why the broncos were not successful with the "potential" young players. Yes they could be good, but they have some big holes in their game that first graders identify and exploit.

Previously many centres were introduced to top grade via the wing, and would learn working next to a more experienced centre. This is why I think he is best playing the wing for now (at least defensively).

With regards to mam, In Qcup, mam's defensive reads were terrible, but when in first grade, was positioned next to capewell and herbie who were both pretty good defenders/readers of the attack, and this wall papered over mam's deficiencies, but when they left and he was placed next to mariner and piakura who both had their own defensive issues, the flood gates opened. That was one of my major issues with KW coaching, he did nothing to address the defence on that side.

Years ago, Mariner is exactly the type of player you could put on the wing while he got up to speed with a view to shifting him inside eventually. Nowadays, Mariner is too small to produce metres on kick returns and early set hit-ups and so has limited value as a winger. Unless he managed to put it together in the centres (he still might, and I hope he does), I can't really see any other spot for him in the team.

He wouldn't be the first player with plenty of pace to burn and a wicked step who ends up not cracking regular first grade. Most in that boat end up over in Super League and often dominate over there.

We are so thin in the back row we don't have much choice with Piakura. I hope Madge has tasked a forward leader like Patty with being on his back constantly to make sure he's focused and not daydreaming, because he has so much talent but its so obvious sometimes that he's just not thinking or paying attention closely. I'm really hoping we see a renewed focus and intensity from both these guys under Madge.

 

[BroncsFan]

would need to be elevated into the top 30 though

That's a good point... I'd imagine Shiba is on a T&T contract at the moment, which means he can't play until Rd 11.

He'd need to be on a dev deal or top 30 to play from round 1.

 

[BroncosFever]

Do you go to training ?

He lifts more than you do mate.

 

[NSW stables]

Years ago, Mariner is exactly the type of player you could put on the wing while he got up to speed with a view to shifting him inside eventually. Nowadays, Mariner is too small to produce metres on kick returns and early set hit-ups and so has limited value as a winger. Unless he managed to put it together in the centres (he still might, and I hope he does), I can't really see any other spot for him in the team.

He wouldn't be the first player with plenty of pace to burn and a wicked step who ends up not cracking regular first grade. Most in that boat end up over in Super League and often dominate over there.

We are so thin in the back row we don't have much choice with Piakura. I hope Madge has tasked a forward leader like Patty with being on his back constantly to make sure he's focused and not daydreaming, because he has so much talent but its so obvious sometimes that he's just not thinking or paying attention closely. I'm really hoping we see a renewed focus and intensity from both these guys under Madge.

With regards to mariner's size, Sunia taruva is only 1.8m and 88kg (shorter and lighter than mariner), and averaged 165m in 23 and 24.

If mariner doesn't run sidewards, and uses his footwork to try and get between players to get a quick play the ball he could still make metres and be a decent winger until he is able to step up to centre.

Selection options were slim last year, but KW didn't try anything a little out of the box, to mitigate the edge issues I.e.:
-Swapping riki and piakura (given riki is the better defender of the two).
-Having arthars defend at centre and return to the wing in attack or to field kicks.
- Having piakura defend in the middle and carrigan defending in second row position.

As WB and Berrigan showed in 2006, you don't have to remain the same position in defence and attack. It can be quite effective.

 

[davidp]

Several of those players were having enough trouble playing one system - they would not have handled the multiple structures

 

[YeahNahMate]

With regards to mariner's size, Sunia taruva is only 1.8m and 88kg (shorter and lighter than mariner), and averaged 165m in 23 and 24.

If mariner doesn't run sidewards, and uses his footwork to try and get between players to get a quick play the ball he could still make metres and be a decent winger until he is able to step up to centre.

Selection options were slim last year, but KW didn't try anything a little out of the box, to mitigate the edge issues I.e.:
-Swapping riki and piakura (given riki is the better defender of the two).
-Having arthars defend at centre and return to the wing in attack or to field kicks.
- Having piakura defend in the middle and carrigan defending in second row position.

As WB and Berrigan showed in 2006, you don't have to remain the same position in defence and attack. It can be quite effective.

They both pretty much weigh the same, (google says Mariner is 1kg heavier), but Turuva is shorter than Mariner which means he's much stockier. Also a difference between us and panthers is they are usually on the front foot through their defence so their back 3 are getting the ball on their own 30/40m line most of the time.

Can Mariner do a good job on the wing? Yeah. But Ideally I'd rather Cobbo & Arthars gettting it out of our own end than Mariner. I also do think Mariners footwork/running style more suits him running out of dummy half like he would in centre instead of just charging back like Cobbo and Arthars can do from wing. Still young though, small sample size so I'll give him that, last year was pretty much his first year as an established first grader in the team in a year in which we struggled so yeah

 

[theshed]

I think there was an interview where broncos players basically said mariner and piakura were both space cadets.

Reading of the attack is so important in Edge defence, and mariner just did not demonstrate those skills. The nrl is not the greatest place to learn the basics/essentials. That is why the broncos were not successful with the "potential" young players. Yes they could be good, but they have some big holes in their game that first graders identify and exploit.

Previously many centres were introduced to top grade via the wing, and would learn working next to a more experienced centre. This is why I think he is best playing the wing for now (at least defensively).

With regards to mam, In Qcup, mam's defensive reads were terrible, but when in first grade, was positioned next to capewell and herbie who were both pretty good defenders/readers of the attack, and this wall papered over mam's deficiencies, but when they left and he was placed next to mariner and piakura who both had their own defensive issues, the flood gates opened. That was one of my major issues with KW coaching, he did nothing to address the defence on that side.

Yeah it was moronic to play Piakura (21, >25 games), Mam (21, ~35 games), Cobbo (21, ~ 4 games at centre) on one edge last season.

Moving Cobbo to be on the more experienced right edge, in his more familiar position is a step in the right direction. Replacing him with Mariner would just make the original issue even worse.

Hunt being there on the left helps, but putting your 5/8 between Piakura and Mariner, and expecting anything but wet paper defence is silliness.

Our depth sucks in those areas though which is why names like Gosiewski and Shibasaki is the best we have in regards to alternatives

 

[BroncsFan]

Yeah it was moronic to play Piakura (21, >25 games), Mam (21, ~35 games), Cobbo (21, ~ 4 games at centre) on one edge last season.

Moving Cobbo to be on the more experienced right edge, in his more familiar position is a step in the right direction. Replacing him with Mariner would just make the original issue even worse.

Hunt being there on the left helps, but putting your 5/8 between Piakura and Mariner, and expecting anything but wet paper defence is silliness.

Our depth sucks in those areas though which is why names like Gosiewski and Shibasaki is the best we have in regards to alternatives

Think I would still like to see Cobbo on the left... would just like to see him get used to playing that side, because it benefits his left hand carry, etc.

I know he started last season at left centre, but he chopped and changed across the backline, so I think some consistency playing the same position week in week out would be beneficial to him... especially when it's a position that plays to his strengths.

 

[Sproj]

Are we sure Arthars is also a lock for the other wing? He had an amazing GF in 2023 but like so much of the team, a pretty mediocre 2024. I imagine he will get first go at the spot but I don't think he should feel too comfortable about having a mortgage on the spot.