NEWS How do you rebuild an NRL club if you can't sign – and keep – players?

[badyon]

The NRL has one of the highest percentages for different teams to win the competition, in the 21st century, of any professional sporting league anywhere in the world.

It's something like 75% of teams in the comp have won the competition since the turn of the century.

Compare NFL at around 35%.
EPL, I think only 5 teams have won it this century.
AFL is around 50%.

Pretty much if you can't win in the NRL you're doing something really wrong.

On the flipside, it also speaks to the lack of loyalty in the game, and the "flukiness" of the game in general has become. Fouls can cruel possession and outcomes much more than other games.

 

[Marty Deutschmann]

you can't force players to want to play for you, it is as simple as that ... and no matter what system is in place, there will be team some players won't go to ...

IMO, the premise of this article is flawed ... he talks about going after players that would be a quick fix for these bottom 8 teams, but for some teams (like the Titans) a quick fix is not realistic...

They shouldn't be throwing money at the elite of the game and hope they can pull the club out of the mess they are in ... the problems with doing this is that you'll only really attract the mercenary type players that will jump ship the second you don't significantly outbid the competition and you can't build a clubs culture with those sorts of players ... it will also leave you short of funds to fill the other position you desperately need to fill.

the solution isn't to go for the quick fix, it is a longer term proposition ... go out and throw money at the best recruiters in the game ... have them search high and low for players talent rookies and give them a shot (i'm talking about who Arrow/Mitchell were several years ago) ... then use a money ball style system to surround them with under-valued veterans who can help lead these young kids and build/re-build the clubs culture ...

you won't win a comp this way, but you will transform your team into one that elite players want to play for and won't ask you to pay massive overs to get them

Funny thing was.. Titans were doing just that until Hayne arrived.

Coach didn't want him as it didn't fit their new culture.. but the money hungry board members forced the coach into taking him on because Hayne would "put bums on seats"

Hayne eventually eroded and burnt up all the good will and spirit that team had at the time.

Now, he's gone, coach fired because of him and now they're another coach through, their superstar no where to be seen and their other was languishing on the sidelines battling poor confidence and pure lack of will to play.

They severely fucked up a good thing. The whole "bums on seats" now is something they were building towards ironically prior to Hayne because they were winning..now, they're at risk of having their licence to play NRL revoked.

 

[tommy]

Funny thing was.. Titans were doing just that until Hayne arrived.

Coach didn't want him as it didn't fit their new culture.. but the money hungry board members forced the coach into taking him on because Hayne would "put bums on seats"

Hayne eventually eroded and burnt up all the good will and spirit that team had at the time.

Now, he's gone, coach fired because of him and now they're another coach through, their superstar no where to be seen and their other was languishing on the sidelines battling poor confidence and pure lack of will to play.

They severely fucked up a good thing. The whole "bums on seats" now is something they were building towards ironically prior to Hayne because they were winning..now, they're at risk of having their licence to play NRL revoked.

Perhaps Hayne will leave a legacy afterall. As the guy who burned RL on the GC once and for all.

 

[I bleed Maroon]

What do we all think of a relegation system similar to what the Super League do? Rather than just tossing the baby out with the bath water as the NRL often does, the Titans can be relegated to Queensland Cup until they can rebuild themselves and fight their way back in.

Of course the same would apply to NSW cup as well, and I understand that an NRL experienced team suddenly taking on reserve grade sides will more than likely lead to a few smashings, but that's the idea. It works as a confidence booster for the rebuilding NRL club and also gives these reserve grade players a taste of what they will be up against in NRL. Also hopefully it will give said NRL side a break from media scrutiny so they can focus entirely on fixing their issues.

Sort of like "perpetual trial matches", if you will.

 

[Wolfie]

What do we all think of a relegation system similar to what the Super League do? Rather than just tossing the baby out with the bath water as the NRL often does, the Titans can be relegated to Queensland Cup until they can rebuild themselves and fight their way back in.

Of course the same would apply to NSW cup as well, and I understand that an NRL experienced team suddenly taking on reserve grade sides will more than likely lead to a few smashings, but that's the idea. It works as a confidence booster for the rebuilding NRL club and also gives these reserve grade players a taste of what they will be up against in NRL. Also hopefully it will give said NRL side a break from media scrutiny so they can focus entirely on fixing their issues.

Sort of like "perpetual trial matches", if you will.

It works in super league because its a genuine 2 tier competition. We dont have that because of the split between QLD ISC and NSW ISC. I reckon it could work if we split the NSW and QLD ISC comps, but then you are going to have a couple of issues there. Firstly, there will be a backlash from some of the ISC clubs that will inevitably get cut, and secondly you have the issue that a lot of the ISC sides are either feeder clubs or reserve sides for NRL clubs.

 

[1910]

The issue for the titans is how few juniors they get. If you look at their squad, half their team are past broncos, and then the titans buy them off us at an inflated cost (Taylor, Jai Arrow, Wallace etc.). Now, whilst Arrow went to another level at the titans, he has never struck me as a particularly loyal player and was always going to follow the money, and success. From reports, Titans and Rabbitohs offered him similar money, but at the rabbits he will be more likely to succeed.

The titans need to stop buying players from other clubs. They have Ash Taylor, peachy, Boyd, Cartwright, Wallace, Proctor all on big money that they have bought from another club. Who are their juniors? do they have any? Because arguably two of the best forwrds in the game (Haas and Fifita) and one of the more promising halves (dearden) all went to school about a 20 minute drive from their stadium.

Arrow is a Coast Junior- Bears. Haas and Fifita are from Ipswich and only went to school on the coast commuting every day from Ipswich. Dearden is a Mackay junior and moved to the Coast. None of those three are Coast juniors.

I agree though that Coast kids is their biggest weakness, that's how you tap in to an identity and get people going and caring about games. Titans haven't done that well at all they've bought players that people don't identify with at all.

 

[Morepudding]

Arrow is a Coast Junior- Bears. Haas and Fifita are from Ipswich and only went to school on the coast commuting every day from Ipswich. Dearden is a Mackay junior and moved to the Coast. None of those three are Coast juniors.

I agree though that Coast kids is their biggest weakness, that's how you tap in to an identity and get people going and caring about games. Titans haven't done that well at all they've bought players that people don't identify with at all.

Thing is they still all went to school on the gold coast for at least 2-3 years.
Just in recent years (since titans formed), these players went to PBC/Keebra.
PBC NRL Players
Cody Walker, Kevin Proctor, Jordan Rapana, Tom Dearden

Keebra NRL Players
Jordan Kahu, Bodene Thompson, Ben Teo, Kenny Edwards, Isaac Liu, Corey Norman, Payne Haas, David Fifita, Jai Arrow, Sam Moa, TauTau Moga, Blake Leary, Marion Seve, Te Marie Martin, Ben Murdoch Masilla

probably others as well, and more from other local schools too. That's some quality they missed out on just in the local area.

 

[1910]

Thing is they still all went to school on the gold coast for at least 2-3 years.
Just in recent years (since titans formed), these players went to PBC/Keebra.
PBC NRL Players
Cody Walker, Kevin Proctor, Jordan Rapana, Tom Dearden

Keebra NRL Players
Jordan Kahu, Bodene Thompson, Ben Teo, Kenny Edwards, Isaac Liu, Corey Norman, Payne Haas, David Fifita, Jai Arrow, Sam Moa, TauTau Moga, Blake Leary, Marion Seve, Te Marie Martin, Ben Murdoch Masilla

probably others as well, and more from other local schools too. That's some quality they missed out on just in the local area.

You have to discount the ones that were placed there by their NRL club. They're not just all kids 'at the school.' Clubs have had relationships with the school the Tigers did for a while and they put kids there.

I agree though, they're not taping into that side of development. Tweed are the national champs and how many of those MM kids are going to play for the Titans? Tweed are their feeder- that's more worrying than schools I think.

Broncos have four from that Tweed side. They have Sexton who is promising but should have more than him.

 

[BroncsFan]

What do we all think of a relegation system similar to what the Super League do? Rather than just tossing the baby out with the bath water as the NRL often does, the Titans can be relegated to Queensland Cup until they can rebuild themselves and fight their way back in.

Of course the same would apply to NSW cup as well, and I understand that an NRL experienced team suddenly taking on reserve grade sides will more than likely lead to a few smashings, but that's the idea. It works as a confidence booster for the rebuilding NRL club and also gives these reserve grade players a taste of what they will be up against in NRL. Also hopefully it will give said NRL side a break from media scrutiny so they can focus entirely on fixing their issues.

Sort of like "perpetual trial matches", if you will.

In the current system I just cannot see how a relegation promotion would work purely because of cash.

The NRL currently provides $13m to each team. If you get relegated from the NRL comp I'd imagine that funding goes with it.

What happens to all the players under contract to a team that just got relegated... 90% of NRL clubs run at a loss so they won't be able to pay the $10m of player contracts.

Even if they somehow could pay the full salary cap worth of contracts, there would be an exodus of the playing talent anyway because they won't want to play in the lower division for a year.

All the sponsorships that team has would also be lost because they'd no longer be on national TV.

Basically the first team(s) to be relegated would end up being 5-10 years behind the remaining NRL teams due to loss of cash, sponsorship and players... I could see it basically killing whichever club drops first.

In the years following the first drop it would just end up being a constant cycling of whichever ISC team gets promoted just getting relegated again the next year, because they would be so far behind the NRL teams that they just wouldn't be able to compete

 

[Thelmus]

The problem with the relegation system is the league can't support some of the clubs as it is now. Imagine throwing a few more in that can't rely on TV incomes to survive.
At current, despite their grand history, the ISC and Metropolitan cups are little more than NRL reserve grade sides. They live and die, not by their results, but by their ability to bring juniors through the ranks.
If they have to compete to succeed, a lot will change. Certainly, some players might get loaned out to lower teams, but it would be at the lower teams discretion, and with no commitment to necessarily play him as the Big club wants. Imagine someone like Dearden playing hooker to fill a gap, or perhaps a forward playing wing because that's where they need him. Furthermore, you couldn't just take them back week to week as we do now. It would soon become apparent that the team of non-loaned players would be much better off thank to not losing their halfback, hooker or fullback week to week.
Since fringe players getting to play in spine positions is core to their development, it would definitely take some adjustment. What happens to the club loaned a halfback whilst they linger in div 2, only to find themselves promoted and playing the side they borrowed him from? Or would a club promoted face a mass exodus of players as the senior club takes its players back?
What if a have borrowed from a div 1 team get suspended playing his own side?

 

[broncos4life]

Funny thing was.. Titans were doing just that until Hayne arrived.

Coach didn't want him as it didn't fit their new culture.. but the money hungry board members forced the coach into taking him on because Hayne would "put bums on seats"

Hayne eventually eroded and burnt up all the good will and spirit that team had at the time.

Now, he's gone, coach fired because of him and now they're another coach through, their superstar no where to be seen and their other was languishing on the sidelines battling poor confidence and pure lack of will to play.

They severely fucked up a good thing. The whole "bums on seats" now is something they were building towards ironically prior to Hayne because they were winning..now, they're at risk of having their licence to play NRL revoked.

Yet we constantly hear what great administrators Frizelle et al. are, give me a break.

 

[Kooly87]

You have to discount the ones that were placed there by their NRL club. They're not just all kids 'at the school.' Clubs have had relationships with the school the Tigers did for a while and they put kids there.

I agree though, they're not taping into that side of development. Tweed are the national champs and how many of those MM kids are going to play for the Titans? Tweed are their feeder- that's more worrying than schools I think.

Broncos have four from that Tweed side. They have Sexton who is promising but should have more than him.

This should be ringing alarm bells for the prospective Brisbane expansion proposals as well. We have a team on the Gold Coast who has barely scratched the surface of ingraining itself in the local competitions, schools and local clubs, some of which as you've said are amongst the best in the country.

It's a 'Gold Coast' club, that could arguably move to Perth or the Central Coast tomorrow and it would make virtually no difference to their player recruitment strategy or makeup up to this point. They''re failing to capitalise on the biggest single advantage they currently have: being located on the Gold Coast with access to so much talent, if only they can find a way to harness it for themselves.

If we repeat that mistake with a proposed Brisbane/Ipswich/Redcliffe side, it will prove to be just as disasterous and unproductive. If we are putting a new side into Queensland, it should be to grow the game and participation in that region, not just provide a cushy, high paying home for surplus players from Sydney clubs to get a pay day.