[Split] Bennett in Newcastle

[Cult]

No I agree. But ultimately he picks the team and he has cut a lot of players and signed lots of questionable ones. Having done that I think he stands to cop far more criticism compared to if he just came to the Broncos and worked with what he had. With or without Boyd, we have one of the best teams in the comp and if, after all his cutting and signing of players he can't get a title then to me, it shows his recruitment was shit, and he is going to cop the blame for a lot of it.

u say that the coach is often at the end of the list when it comes to accolades. I can't disagree more. When saints won it was all about Bennett. He got the best from Soward, he brought darius to them. Bennett this, Bennett that. But when Newcastle went shit, it was Alex McKinnon, bad roster etc. it might just be his loyal fans and the courier mail writers, but Bennett seems pretty much immune to blame, yet somehow gets all the accolades.

The league community as a whole (especially fox and courier mail) have a raging boner for Bennett. As i said in my earlier post, if u are going to give the coach credit for success, u have to blame him for losses, but the media never, ever has done that. He can do no wrong. It seems he has earnt such respect from past achievements he can do no wrong nowadays. It baffles ,e a bit, but that's how the media is I guess.

Yeah but the media are a bag of dicks and we all know this. I might be wrong but if you ask a Dragons fan about that premiership they should be able to rattle off a hundred reasons why they won. But us Broncos fans, the Broncos fans in the media still want to take credit for it. Us "Bennecolytes" can see his faults. We just don't need to bring them up because they more than likely have already been stated.. A lot. A fair amount of blame will go on him if we are to not win a premiership.

To be fair, the McKinnon accident and the roster was kinda terrible. It's a lot easier to get good players to come to Brisbane and get their full pay than it is to get players to go to Newcastle. But they aren't excuses. It just kinda actually happened. Not even Bellamy or Hasler could coach that team to a premiership. Not that they'd ever try.

 

[Ari Gold]

Re: The Wayne Bennett Super thread!

To be fair, the McKinnon accident and the roster was kinda terrible. It's a lot easier to get good players to come to Brisbane and get their full pay than it is to get players to go to Newcastle. But they aren't excuses. It just kinda actually happened. Not even Bellamy or Hasler could coach that team to a premiership. Not that they'd ever try.

Is the Knights roster that Bennett inherited really any worse than the one that Hasler took over from at the Dogs? If it is, I don't think it's by a lot. Unless you mean geographically, in which case, yeah the Knights are a lot harder. I have no qualms with labelling Bellamy as a player who needs stars to work with, but Hasler is completely different. I mean, did anyone really rate the 2012 or 2014 Bulldogs squads at the start of those seasons?

 

[Cult]

Re: The Wayne Bennett Super thread!

Is the Knights roster that Bennett inherited really any worse than the one that Hasler took over from at the Dogs? If it is, I don't think it's by a lot. Unless you mean geographically, in which case, yeah the Knights are a lot harder. I have no qualms with labelling Bellamy as a player who needs stars to work with, but Hasler is completely different. I mean, did anyone really rate the 2012 or 2014 Bulldogs squads at the start of those seasons?

Yes I would definitely say they are better than the Knights team. Yeah Hasler has had it harder than Bellamy but definitely hasn't had it "Bennett at the Knights" hard.

 

[Big Pete]

Decided to split this off into it's own thread since I wanted to comment on it without disturbing the rest of the Bennett thread.

I'll be as clear as I have to be: Bennett's stint at the Knights was a failure.

Fans can make all the excuses in the world but at the end of the day, figures don't lie and Bennett ended up with one of the worst win percentages in Newcastle history.

I don't even buy into the excuses.

Bad roster - He inherited a roster that basically finished the season in similar circumstances as the Brisbane Broncos did this year. They barely scraped into 8th and were about to get stronger with the acquisition of Darius Boyd when he was still considered one of the better players in the game, Kade Snowden who was a Test prop around that time among others. Fans can make the excuse that he had to deal with players like Waddell, Quinn, Newton, Fa'alogo, Cuthbertson, Dobson....but guess what? He brought those players in! It was his decision to bring back a host of old Knights players in the twilight of their career to help get the community behind the team but he went too far with it and it ended up backfiring on him as they failed to qualify for the finals twice and barely scraped in the other time. In fairness, they did do well in that 2013 finals campaign but they were sitting ducks for the Sydney Roosters and were always just making up the numbers.

Bad management - I don't think there is a club in the sport that hasn't had to deal with that and some have even gone onto win a premiership. Manly always seem to be at odds with one another yet somehow they seemingly pull through.

Alex McKinnon - A tough loss and I'm sure it was a bitter blow for all involved but clubs have had to deal with similar career ending injuries in the past too. Look at the Broncos & Jharal Yow Yeh and with all due respect, Yow Yeh was a more valuable player than McKinnon.

Injuries - Again, every club has to deal with them. Penrith had a horrific toll yet somehow managed to make it as far as the prelim and weren't far off from qualifying for the finals. They certainly weren't just making up the numbers like the Knights did the year before.

I think Bennett bit off more than he could chew. He put together a short term plan and a long term plan. When things didn't go his way and it got too hard for him down there, he realised he wasn't capable of getting the job done and chose to leave the organisation and head elsewhere. Things are different at the Broncos and I don't think he'll be as ambitious as he was at the Knights because he doesn't have to be but I think he has to accept that his stint at Newcastle was a black mark on his career.

In saying that, Bennett doesn't get enough credit for his work with the 20s. Since their inception, the Knights bread and butter was their juniors yet in recent times they had struggled to really develop anybody of any note. It seemed like one of the first things Bennett did was make a concerted effort to bring these juniors up to speed and we're starting to see the fruits of that labor as they won the 2014 minor premiership and they've been developing a lot more junior reps as of late.

 

[Broncoman]

Perfectly said Pete I could'nt have said it any better myself. It was just media talk that Newcastle would be the team to beat in 2012 when Bennett himself (probably) and those close to the club knew that there was a lot of work required.

His recruits flopped and it's dissapointing to see where Boyd, Uate and Snowden are now when compared to their form in 2011. I love Danny Buderus but dropping De Gois for him when Bedsy was past his prime was a poor move and Bedsy got overrated by the media who pushed for him to play for NSW in 2012. It was a bit of a dissapointing end to an outstanding career.

Disagree 100% with people that say he had a bad roster. Any roster with Uate, Boyd, Snowden, Gidley, Mason, Tahu, Mata'Utai, Gagai, Mullen, McManus and Smith isn't anything to turn your nose up at.

 

[Huge]

He had an average roster and had average results. Shit in shit out. He could have done better but I don't know what went on behind the scenes. Live long enough and you will always have some regrets and I would say WB wishes he could have done more. Those anti Bennett Bronco supporters must show their grace and give him 18 months to show he is on the right track. They did for the two underachievers before his second stint.

 

[Anonymous person]

Lol @ people blaming newcastles roster when Bennett was directly responsible for recruiting half of them, and the other half had all played rep footy in the last 3 years. If they had a shit roster its because Bennett put together a shit roster.

He took over the knights, brought in all his own players and staff, and they went backwards under his leadership. You cant deny that. His stint there was a failure. The people of Newcastle wanted him gone, and they wanted his love child gone too. You don't often see players get booed by their own home crowd, but Boyd copped it all the time.

It's just the same old people making the same old excuses for old Wayne, cause nothing can ever be his fault. Everything from the roster to injuries to the tidal patterns will be blamed before Bennett if the Broncos miss the 8 or don't win a premiership under him in the next 3 years.

 

[Bull Shark]

Lol @ people blaming newcastles roster when Bennett was directly responsible for recruiting half of them, and the other half had all played rep footy in the last 3 years. If they had a shit roster its because Bennett put together a shit roster.

He took over the knights, brought in all his own players and staff, and they went backwards under his leadership. You cant deny that. His stint there was a failure. The people of Newcastle wanted him gone, and they wanted his love child gone too. You don't often see players get booed by their own home crowd, but Boyd copped it all the time.

It's just the same old people making the same old excuses for old Wayne, cause nothing can ever be his fault. Everything from the roster to injuries to the tidal patterns will be blamed before Bennett if the Broncos miss the 8 or don't win a premiership under him in the next 3 years.

what, and you won't be on this forum after every loss, every injury and every time you find a hair in your quiche to blame Bennett for that and every evil that's ever occurred since the beginning of time ?

GTFO

 

[Anonymous person]

what, and you won't be on this forum after every loss, every injury and every time you find a hair in your quiche to blame Bennett for that and every evil that's ever occurred since the beginning of time ?

GTFO

This is for a few of you who keep saying stuff like this - what have I ever blamed Bennett for that he wasn't actually to blame for?

 

[OXY-351]

This is for a few of you who keep saying stuff like this - what have I ever blamed Bennett for that he wasn't actually to blame for?

When have you ever praised him for something he actually deserved praise for? It's all pretty subjective really isn't it?

Anyway, you're entitled to your opinion. This place would be more boring that a Raiders-Sharks match if everyone shared the same opinions.

 

[Harry Sack]

In saying that, Bennett doesn't get enough credit for his work with the 20s. Since their inception, the Knights bread and butter was their juniors yet in recent times they had struggled to really develop anybody of any note. It seemed like one of the first things Bennett did was make a concerted effort to bring these juniors up to speed and we're starting to see the fruits of that labor as they won the 2014 minor premiership and they've been developing a lot more junior reps as of late.

Enjoyed your whole post but particularly this. He didn't have the success in the top grade that he'd hoped for and as such, I think you have to consider his time at Newcastle a failure for the most part. What he's put into motion in the lower grades though will bear fruit in the coming years.

 

[Anonymous person]

When have you ever praised him for something he actually deserved praise for? It's all pretty subjective really isn't it?

that doesnt answer my question. not praising someone isnt the same as being accused of blaming them for unrelated things, which ive seen a few people do recently, and i want to know why. if noone can provide any direct examples, maybe they should stop trolling.

@Big Pete/ @Harry Sack - what exactly did he do in the under 20s etc? do we know for a fact that he took over them? doesnt sound like something the first grade coach does.

 

[OXY-351]

that doesnt answer my question. not praising someone isnt the same as being accused of blaming them for unrelated things, which ive seen a few people do recently, and i want to know why. if noone can provide any direct examples, maybe they should stop trolling.

You say people don't blame Bennett enough when he fails and go looking for excuses for him, but when he does do well, it's all Bennetts doing. But then you also do the same when it comes to the opposite points of view. When Bennett does do well, you go looking for excuses as to why he should have done that well anyway, and when he fails, it's all Bennetts doing.

You thinking everything you blame him for is actually his fault is purely subjective based on your very one sides view of Bennett, just as is you not praising him when others thinks he desevres praise.

 

[Anonymous person]

EDIT: Spam

 

[Big Pete]

Well, let's knock one of those statements on the head. I never said he took over them, he didn't coach each and every single Newcastle team but apart of the work he did at the Knights was to bring their local juniors up to speed.

That was widely reported at the time, that one of the reasons why Tinkler brought Bennett in was because he was prepared to help introduce those teams the structure they needed to go the whole way.

He hired the Cowboys NYC assistant coach Mick Crawley wto take charge of the Knights NYC side during Bennett's tenure.

He brought through a number of their players as reports came out that Bennett would call them personally and offer them a contract.

It isn't a coincidence that the Knights won the U/16s.

Not a coincidence that they've managed to develop more Australian Schoolboys.

And certainly not one that they managed to finish with a minor premiership, especially when they were such a poor side for such a long long time.

Bennett should take full responsibility for the senior squad, in fact, he already does, the man said so himself so I don't know why people try to defend that. However, he also deserves some share of the credit for the junior development in which he played a role in and to say he only brought duds and has-beens to the club isn't true.

 

[Cult]

Lol @ people blaming newcastles roster when Bennett was directly responsible for recruiting half of them, and the other half had all played rep footy in the last 3 years. If they had a shit roster its because Bennett put together a shit roster.

He took over the knights, brought in all his own players and staff, and they went backwards under his leadership. You cant deny that. His stint there was a failure. The people of Newcastle wanted him gone, and they wanted his love child gone too. You don't often see players get booed by their own home crowd, but Boyd copped it all the time.

It's just the same old people making the same old excuses for old Wayne, cause nothing can ever be his fault. Everything from the roster to injuries to the tidal patterns will be blamed before Bennett if the Broncos miss the 8 or don't win a premiership under him in the next 3 years.

Again it's all about giving him a fair amount of blame. You honestly can not dispute that there were issues that caused their season to spiral. They didn't do too bad the previous years but this year was terrible and he failed. He left them in a worse place too. But good, **** the Knights. **** the Dragons. The only team I care about is the Broncos and Bennett probably feels the same. Bennett wasn't out there playing the game for 80 minutes every week. He can't take all of the responsibility and that is why you argument is ridiculous.

 

[Ari Gold]

The good work WB has done at the knights - is it really success as a coach? Changing the organization and the way the juniors improved. Isn't that more of a technical directors function?

Not saying it wasn't a good thing for the Knights, but is it really a coaching success or a success achieved by a coach?

 

[Big Pete]

Splitting hairs there Ari.

Bennett gets knocked for his work with the first grade side which is fair but that was only one slice of the pie. He made it clear that he was looking to change the culture of the club from the top grade side to the reserves and on the latter, he achieved considerable success.