Next Immortal to be named

[Kaz]

If you think Johns wasn't a freakish player you need to get checked. Also the drugs he used were estacy not steriods.

IMO: I don't believe it was just ecstasy.

I wonder if the rumours about the 1997 GF winning team will ever be written about.

I so want Lee Jackson to write a book.

 

[Mr Fourex]

This. As much as I don't think the criteria is just, the fact is the criteria does say on field deeds only. However, it does have something about the legacy they've left behind, which to me invariably includes off field status and post-career behaviour/deeds.

In my mind it concerns the whole picture. The overall mark left on the game by the player

Johns's career was punctuated with illicit drug use and being a racist.

He has to lose points for that........

 

[Broncoman]

Except he already admitted that he probably couldn't have played without taking it, so does that then become performance enhancing?

He was a freakish player but failed to dominant at Origin Level and failed to dominate at Test level. Basically, he failed to dominate at Rep level like many other superstars of our game did. Therefore, branding someone an immortal when they couldn't even perform on the highest stage does not warrant immortality.

What about his Origin performances In 2002, 2003 and 2005 he was the difference. Also dominated Australian tests sides in the 90's and 2000's. Also did Nash ever see him play?.

 

[Kaz]

The next immortal should be Jamie Goddard, for this alone

 

[Coxy]

Most Tests johns played he played at hooker behind Allan Langer and then Brett Kimmorley

 

[Nashy]

Lolz. 2002 and 2003? Dominated? No dude. Just, no. Not even close. 2005 yes. Give him that one.

He did NOT dominate tests sides in the 90's and 2000's dude. Trust me, he didn't. Just take my word for it dude, you weren't old enough to witness test matches during that time.

Yeah dude!

 

[Big Pete]

Also, I didn't like how Johns held the game to ransom in 2004. Was a dog move yet never got called out on it. Some people might think Lockyer wasn't as good (bastards!) but at least he never did that to the game.

But I'll give him some credit, I thought he did dominate Origin in '03 as well. I can see where Rock is coming from, because before then he never seemed capable of getting the job done. Always had one great game in him a series, but couldn't keep it up when it really mattered. But in '03 he was instrumental in Game 1 and in Game 2 he just blew us off the park in the first half in a typical display. Maybe Game 3 took the edge off of it for some, but the series was well and truly decided before then so I don't hold it against him.

Always find it funny when people hold the current state of his opposition against Lockyer but fail to do the same with Johns. When he was up against teams that had the likes of Hegarty, Carlaw & old man Ikin with inspired positional selections such as TC in the centres, Berrigan at half, Crocker at hooker & Civoniceiva in second row. Would have been interesting to see how he'd do against the current line up. Doubt his record would look as good.

 

[Coxy]

Also, I didn't like how Johns held the game to ransom in 2004. Was a dog move yet never got called out on it. Some people might think Lockyer wasn't as good (bastards!) but at least he never did that to the game.

But I'll give him some credit, I thought he did dominate Origin in '03 as well. I can see where Rock is coming from, because before then he never seemed capable of getting the job done. Always had one great game in him a series, but couldn't keep it up when it really mattered. But in '03 he was instrumental in Game 1 and in Game 2 he just blew us off the park in the first half in a typical display. Maybe Game 3 took the edge off of it for some, but the series was well and truly decided before then so I don't hold it against him.

Always find it funny when people hold the current state of his opposition against Lockyer but fail to do the same with Johns. When he was up against teams that had the likes of Hegarty, Carlaw & old man Ikin with inspired positional selections such as TC in the centres, Berrigan at half, Crocker at hooker & Civoniceiva in second row. Would have been interesting to see how he'd do against the current line up. Doubt his record would look as good.

Agree with all this. Johns was dominant in game 1 and 2 of 2003. Game 3 QLD blew them off the park. Why? They finally got some selections right.

It's interesting to look at Joey's Origin career.

1995: Halfback in game 1 and 2 (NSW lost both). Dropped for game 3 for Toovey.
1996: Hooker in all 3 games (NSW won all 3 - Toovey halfback)
1997: Hooker in game 1 and 3 (NSW won 1, lost 3, Toovey played halfback, dropped in game 2, Toovey played hooker and John Simon played halfback)
1998: Halfback in all 3 games (NSW won 1, lost 2)
1999: Halfback in all 3 games (NSW won 1, lost 1, drew 1, QLD retained series)
2000: Bench for game 2 and 3 (NSW won both, Brett Kimmorley halfback for all 3 games)
2001: Missed the whole series
2002: Halfback for all 3 games (NSW won 1, lost 1, drew 1, QLD retained series)
2003: Halfback for all 3 games (NSW won 2, lost 1, very dominant performance in first 2 games)
2004: Missed the whole series
2005: Halfback game 2 and 3 (NSW won both, Johns dominant)

Never played Origin again after that.
So his record in Origin was 23 games, in which time NSW won 13, lost 8 and drew 2. Of those, he played 5 games at hooker (won 4 lost 1), and 2 games on the bench (2 wins).

So his time as starting halfback was actually 16 games for 7 wins, 7 losses and 2 draws! Hardly "immortal".

 

[Broncoman]

How come Brett Kenny who played with Parramatta from 1980-1993 ever gets mentioned by anyone? :confused:

He was the main pivot in the Eels dominance of the early 80's as he guided them to 5 grand finals and 4 premierships from 1981-1986
Played 265 games for Parra, 17 Origin games for NSW and 17 tests for Australia
In origin games when he was selected in the halves he came up against Wally Lewis 11 times and finished with an win loss ratio of 8-3 and the loses came early in his rep career. He also ran over the top of Lewis to secure NSW the 1985 series. The King never dominated Kenny.
He was also selected ahead of Lewis 3 times on the 1982 Kangaroo tour
He was in the top 100 players of the century and is regarded some of the finest players to play the game.

There isn't many highlights of him online but watch Parra's highlights of the 80's Kenny was a freak and needs to get mention. Don't think his immortal though, just deserves more praise and credit.

 

[Kimlo]

How do you know he was so good?

 

[Nashy]

How do you know he was so good?

Are you serious? How have you not heard of Google?

 

[Alec]

Johns was one of the most overrated Origin players. People remember the 2005 series, but before that he wasn't exactly setting the world on fire in it. Now I know that he's in immensely talented player, one of the best the game has seen, but still.

Mal clearly has to be the next immortal. Possibly the greatest centre the game has seen and the most successful Origin coach the game has seen. Johns was an amazing club player, a great Aussie rep player, and is now an average commentator.

 

[Big Pete]

Somebody has been reading LU...

Convenient Origin record aside, Lewis got the better of him for the majority of Kenny's tenure at Origin and absolutely dominated at Test level. Everyone will disregard his BRL record because y'know if you're a big fish in a small pond somehow that makes you a lesser player but he won two premierships there and he basically made Wynnum into one of the most dominant BRL clubs for a couple of years. Even Bennett basically said beating Wynnum was like beating Melbourne in '06 in his second biography (pre-salary cap bombshell).

Maybe Kenny deserves more recognition? He was a great talent who could take it to Wally. But that's not our problem. NSW doesn't celebrate it's players...at all really. It's like you hear about Dally Messenger, Clive Churchill, Graeme Lanlands, Bob Fulton (massive void) then Andrew Johns. This is why I find it so hilarious when NSW get their panties in a knot when we dare celebrate the careers of Lockyer, Webcke, Tallis, Langer, Meninga, Lewis, Lidner etc.

 

[Broncoman]

Dally Messanger, Clive Churchill, Greame Langlands all played when there was no tv to little so there is limited clips of them and they also played before the Origin era. I think that makes them less known because Origin players are the most known league players in the world. Off topic but who are you're favourite QLD players, that you look up to?. My NSW favourites are Laurie Daley and Brad Fittler. Daley in my view is the greatest NSW captain off all time.

 

[Big Pete]

Clearly you don't read all the comparisons made to those players all the time...

People could care less about the Fittlers, Daleys, Stuarts, Elias', Prices, Pearces, Mortimers etc. of the world.

 

[OXY-351]

Lewis got the better of him for the majority of Kenny's tenure at Origin and absolutely dominated at Test level.

Some would even go as far to say he dictated terms to Kenny

 

[Browny]

Dally Messanger, Clive Churchill, Greame Langlands all played when there was no tv to little so there is limited clips of them and they also played before the Origin era. I think that makes them less known because Origin players are the most known league players in the world. Off topic but who are you're favourite QLD players, that you look up to?. My NSW favourites are Laurie Daley and Brad Fittler. Daley in my view is the greatest NSW captain off all time.

So unknown that they named 2 awards after them

 

[Kimlo]

Dally Messanger, Clive Churchill, Greame Langlands all played when there was no tv to little so there is limited clips of them and they also played before the Origin era. I think that makes them less known because Origin players are the most known league players in the world. Off topic but who are you're favourite QLD players, that you look up to?. My NSW favourites are Laurie Daley and Brad Fittler. Daley in my view is the greatest NSW captain off all time.

Too bad Daley has the intelligence of a gold fish off the field.