AUS FOOTBALL AFL Grand Final 2023 - Collingwood v Brisbane

Now that I’ve calmed down a bit I can say collingwood were definitely the better team today if not the season. I didn’t feel like the lions were quite up to being the premiers this season in comparison to some previous ones. Haven’t been clutch enough when the going got tough.
 
winslow_wong said:
Now that I’ve calmed down a bit I can say collingwood were definitely the better team today if not the season. I didn’t feel like the lions were quite up to being the premiers this season in comparison to some previous ones. Haven’t been clutch enough when the going got tough.
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Will be interesting to see what happens from here. They are clearly good enough to win it but does this destroy their confidence and they fall back to the pack? It will be really interesting to see what happens to Rayner, Berry, Hipwood and Starcevich from here. There will be a lot of calling for their blood. And if we lose Dev, well that will be very concerning as we still 12 months from our next gun academy mids being available.
 
wow. great game. Collingwood the better team where it mattered. no free at the end playing advantage was rough. Had a great morning at the pub with a good English breakfast
 
Sproj said:
Will be interesting to see what happens from here. They are clearly good enough to win it but does this destroy their confidence and they fall back to the pack? It will be really interesting to see what happens to Rayner, Berry, Hipwood and Starcevich from here. There will be a lot of calling for their blood. And if we lose Dev, well that will be very concerning as we still 12 months from our next gun academy mids being available.
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I think Rayner showed enough this season. Played his worse game in the grand final unfortunately. What do you think his best position is? He can win the ball in the midfield but today he thought he could run through everyone. Berry too is a proven performer in the past but had a shocker today. What about lyons? I thought he made a difference when he came on
 
winslow_wong said:
I think Rayner showed enough this season. Played his worse game in the grand final unfortunately. What do you think his best position is? He can win the ball in the midfield but today he thought he could run through everyone. Berry too is a proven performer in the past but had a shocker today. What about lyons? I thought he made a difference when he came on
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All good questions and I don't know what the answers to any of them are. Rayner really should be our big-bodied mid but he just isn't good enough there and doesn't have the tank for it. He really needs to be a half forward. Berry is just so inconsistent, but wing is his best position. I am kind of hoping though that maybe Sharp might go past him but not sure he will. Madden might be a legit option to replace Starc as he has really had some shockers when the heat is on sadly.

As for Lyons, he made a difference when he came on and the fact he came on so late is on Fagan, that was a mistake. The problem is that in modern AFL, you need players who can run both ways and Lyons can't. The catch 22 there though is that it was clear early that we were a mid short today and Washcroft isn't due back until late next year and even then, he is likely to take time to get back up to speed. I wouldn't mind seeing what Wilmott has in there but who knows.

There are some big questions for Fages to consider moving forward. I wouldn't mind making a play for Paddy Dow from Carlton.
 
I don’t know anything about the lions as a total bandwagon part time supporter, but what I do know is that Eric Hipwood is trash.
 
Sproj said:
All good questions and I don't know what the answers to any of them are. Rayner really should be our big-bodied mid but he just isn't good enough there and doesn't have the tank for it. He really needs to be a half forward. Berry is just so inconsistent, but wing is his best position. I am kind of hoping though that maybe Sharp might go past him but not sure he will. Madden might be a legit option to replace Starc as he has really had some shockers when the heat is on sadly.

As for Lyons, he made a difference when he came on and the fact he came on so late is on Fagan, that was a mistake. The problem is that in modern AFL, you need players who can run both ways and Lyons can't. The catch 22 there though is that it was clear early that we were a mid short today and Washcroft isn't due back until late next year and even then, he is likely to take time to get back up to speed. I wouldn't mind seeing what Wilmott has in there but who knows.

There are some big questions for Fages to consider moving forward. I wouldn't mind making a play for Paddy Dow from Carlton.
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Yeah not sure what happens now, where does the next level come from.. As good as our midfield has been there’s still a lot of basic skill errors in their game. the whole groups actually. So many missed handballs and the dropped catches is still too much. I think back to the days where aker and black could hit our leading forwards on the chest consistently.

At the moment whether it’s entering the 50 or exiting our 50 it’s still just guys blazing away hoping for the best. How many times did collingwood easily go coast to coast without a lion getting close to touching the ball? We rarely do it.
 
Good game to watch, unlucky lions. 30 scoring shots to 21, Collingwood probably deserve to edge it.
 
winslow_wong said:
Yeah not sure what happens now, where does the next level come from.. As good as our midfield has been there’s still a lot of basic skill errors in their game. the whole groups actually. So many missed handballs and the dropped catches is still too much. I think back to the days where aker and black could hit our leading forwards on the chest consistently.

At the moment whether it’s entering the 50 or exiting our 50 it’s still just guys blazing away hoping for the best. How many times did collingwood easily go coast to coast without a lion getting close to touching the ball? We rarely do it.
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I think you've nailed it really. The skills we are accustomed to with this team just totally deserted them today. Hipwood who is normally serviceable just totally went to water and not only could he not catch the thing, he just kept dropping it away from the crumbers. He had an all time shocker and there is just no way to sugar coat it.

Neale, who is normally the cleanest hands in the game just kept fumbling it. McKenna who is normally so good off halfback was just invisible and don't even get me started on Berry who sadly, has seemingly been regressing to becoming not even state league level today.

The reality is, we've had two years in this run where it was all coming up in our favour and we have just gone to water. First one was the GF in Brissy where we really should have won that year and then this one where if all our players simply played to their normal level, we should have romped it in with the heat in our favour too.

Unfortunately too, as good as Fagan has been for the club, he was totally outcoached today by a guy who has been there before, ironically with us, and knew how to handle the GF.
 
Sproj said:
I think you've nailed it really. The skills we are accustomed to with this team just totally deserted them today. Hipwood who is normally serviceable just totally went to water and not only could he not catch the thing, he just kept dropping it away from the crumbers. He had an all time shocker and there is just no way to sugar coat it.

Neale, who is normally the cleanest hands in the game just kept fumbling it. McKenna who is normally so good off halfback was just invisible and don't even get me started on Berry who sadly, has seemingly been regressing to becoming not even state league level today.

The reality is, we've had two years in this run where it was all coming up in our favour and we have just gone to water. First one was the GF in Brissy where we really should have won that year and then this one where if all our players simply played to their normal level, we should have romped it in with the heat in our favour too.

Unfortunately too, as good as Fagan has been for the club, he was totally outcoached today by a guy who has been there before, ironically with us, and knew how to handle the GF.
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Yeah we need to give better ball to our forwards especially Charlie. Too often the ball either goes over his head or straight to his opponent.

Look, If we have a similar squad and they turn up to pre-season hungry then I have no doubts they’ll go deep into the finals again. Just nail the fundamental skills and hopefully adding some key personnel can give us one more shot at glory.

It was hard to watch McRae and Leppitsch celebrating a collingwood win over the lions.
 
winslow_wong said:
Yeah we need to give better ball to our forwards especially Charlie. Too often the ball either goes over his head or straight to his opponent.

Look, If we have a similar squad and they turn up to pre-season hungry then I have no doubts they’ll go deep into the finals again. Just nail the fundamental skills and hopefully adding some key personnel can give us one more shot at glory.

It was hard to watch McRae and Leppitsch celebrating a collingwood win over the lions.
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Yep this trade period becomes so important. I think if we get Doedee, that will be super important. Coffield would be a nice bonus and who knows, maybe there is a mid we don't expect wanting to come to us too. It will be a risk getting Doedee or Coffield though because they are both back from / are long term injured and so they won't be a quick fix and neither will Washcroft, it will be a case of just winning enough until those guys get back.

We really need some internal improvement from Sharp / Tunstill / Lohmann / Brain and I am not sure if that will happen. Losing Dev will really affect us more than people think if he goes to West Coast as expected.
 
Sproj said:
I think you've nailed it really. The skills we are accustomed to with this team just totally deserted them today. Hipwood who is normally serviceable just totally went to water and not only could he not catch the thing, he just kept dropping it away from the crumbers. He had an all time shocker and there is just no way to sugar coat it.

Neale, who is normally the cleanest hands in the game just kept fumbling it. McKenna who is normally so good off halfback was just invisible and don't even get me started on Berry who sadly, has seemingly been regressing to becoming not even state league level today.

The reality is, we've had two years in this run where it was all coming up in our favour and we have just gone to water. First one was the GF in Brissy where we really should have won that year and then this one where if all our players simply played to their normal level, we should have romped it in with the heat in our favour too.

Unfortunately too, as good as Fagan has been for the club, he was totally outcoached today by a guy who has been there before, ironically with us, and knew how to handle the GF.
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You do start to wonder…if that big game “personal” experience does really play part? We were out coached today. Should have won it in the end “bad call” but didn’t deserve it. Are key players outside of a few went to butter….
 
Galah said:
You do start to wonder…if that big game “personal” experience does really play part? We were out coached today. Should have won it in the end “bad call” but didn’t deserve it. Are key players outside of a few went to butter….
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The more I think about it, the more angry I get at Hipwood. His direct opponent goes down super early and despite that, he goes on to have an all time worst final. He will live on in infamy. I just don't know how you come back from that. Today may well break him.
 
Watched it on delay last night - one of those games for the Lions

9 more scores for Collingwood - in a way lucky the margin wasn’t bigger

Every 50-50 bounce or half chance pretty much went their way. We were almost perfect with shots, but just not very good at getting to the forward 50

Hipwood and a few others with games to forget, I think it’s time to move on from Hipwood. He has a few games every season that hints at being elite, but then has stinkers all around them

Hill was just a magnet for them and outside of one instance, he toyed with our defence

Some bizarre calls at times, even both ways that canceled out some, but again the 50-50s tended to go their way

@Sproj can you explain why every bounce or ball up, Oscar or Daniher were standing behind Cox and giving him that advantage? It was baffling at times
 
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