Fight for Fullback

[Porthoz]

It's not whether the tries are amazing feats or easy put downs. Generally, it's fullbacks that finish this type of tries, because they often are there to take advantage of the spoils or broken play. Fact is, Norman was there, Hoffman wasn't, and I mean nowhere near!
And it's not just a couple of random plays, we're talking about 10 tries in a season from a five-eight against 3 from a fullback!

You can accuse Norman of plenty of things, I mean there is a reason I don't want him in the halves to start with. He lacks strategic insight or vision which is an absolute no no as a halve, he is too nonchalant, his defense is suspect, etc... But I'm willing to take those on the chin with him at fullback, because he can be taught to catch bombs better and he can be taught to defend better, or with more urgency. But the one thing you can't teach is instinct, which Hoffman has very little of.

Norman can break the line better, he can pass better, he can kick better, he is more evasive, has better timing and he has the instinct to be in the right spot to provide or conclude support plays. Are you really going to disagree with that?

And yeah, Hodges managed to run that play twice in 20 minutes without any issue, doesn't that tell you anything?

 

[Big Pete]

Generally, it's fullbacks that finish this type of tries, because they often are there to take advantage of the spoils or broken play.

Most of those tries weren't in broken play though. It was either him running it to the line like a half, kicking and gathering for himself or supporting his half - hallmarks of a five eigth.

Fact is, Norman was there, Hoffman wasn't, and I mean nowhere near!

Because those plays were designed for Norman.

The problem is Norman has clearly been spending the off-season trying to improve his skills in the halves and has spent little to no time at fullback. Fullback isn't just a position you can be put in and be able to play out the season for, it requires a lot of time and clearly Norman hasn't had that time and won't have it now that the team is focusing on gelling, maintenance and preparing for other teams.

Are you really going to disagree with that?

Yes, aside from passing and kicking. In fact, kicking is the only part of Norman's game that would be actually handy given how poor his passing game has been.

Right now, it's not even about Hoffman vs. Norman. It's about Norman being a viable 2013 alternative and I don't see it at all. At least for more than one week.

 

[Porthoz]

Okay, if you actually believe that Hoffman does anything, and I do mean anything, better than Norman in attack, we better end the discussion right here and agree to disagree.

Pretty much all the positions in the spine are up for grabs, although we don't really have better than Macca at 9.

We certainly don't have better than Prince in the halves, and Hunt or Wallace are a better choice than Norman to partner him at this point.

Of the fullback choices we have other than Hoffman... Bond and Kahu are unproven, Capewell isn't good enough, Maranta and Kemp would be band-aids and no better than the current holder, and Hodges can't be missed in the centres, especially after Copley's injury. That leaves Norman as the only player with play-making ability to fill the position satisfactorily, despite his shortcomings.

Hopefully Prince will bring some much needed creativity to our spine, but even then, we desperately need a 3rd play-maker on the field if we want to compete at the highest level. Hoffman is not and I doubt he will ever be that option.

 

[Big Pete]

Of the fullback choices we have other than Hoffman... Bond and Kahu are unproven, Capewell isn't good enough, Maranta and Kemp would be band-aids and no better than the current holder, and Hodges can't be missed in the centres, especially after Copley's injury. That leaves Norman as the only player with play-making ability to fill the position satisfactorily, despite his shortcomings.

The coach knows what both Kahu & Bond bring. Kahu will need to spend some time in QCup working on his confidence but certainly has the skills to be a fullback and Bond has shown some good glimpses during the trial period and has been banging on the door for sometime in QCup.

Would much rather give these guys a chance than somebody who hasn't even prepared in the position and has failed on past stints.

 

[Mr Fourex]

Kahu will need to spend some time in QCup working on his confidence but certainly has the skills to be a fullback

I hope somehow this gets fast tracked ....... love to see him get a shot no later than about R8

either centre or fullback

 

[Big Pete]

Three rounds in, what do we make of Norman?

 

[Kaz]

Three rounds in, what do we make of Norman?

Crap.

 

[vertigo]

Obviously you want your fullback to be creating tries but he doesn't posses that ability so I'll give him a pass since he does his job and hasn't screwed up.

 

[Kaz]

I voted other.

Other = Josh Dugan

 

[Big Pete]

At this stage, I just don't think he suits our style. Broncos are playing way too laterally and lack that threat inside their own half or running the ball.

He's the least of our worries, but I can't see Norman lasting the season.

 

[Bucking Beads]

I think Hoffman needs to stay on the wing or in the centres. I think he has been quite good so far this year.

 

[Big Pete]

I agree, we need as much help as we can get out-wide.

With our squad the way it is right now, I reckon Bond would be the way to go if Norman doesn't show any improvement.

 

[Mr Fourex]

Three rounds in, what do we make of Norman?

I don't get the hate going round after this game against the Roosters. Other than a couple poor kicks, just what the **** did he do so wrong??

Tell me what's he done so wrong in these first three games ??

At one stage tonight I thought thank **** we do still have Norman in the side.....he is the only one who still looks like he could threaten.

I've got no issues with Norman at fullback. Things like defence and kick clean ups .....urgency in both depts haven't IMO been an issue. Seems to be roughly where he's supposed to be at all times.

The one single issue I have with him right now is his kicking....he needs to work on it.

 

[Bucking Beads]

We really should go hard at Dugan. We've got to. He is the only player off contract that could give us some real quality.

 

[Bucking Beads]

I don't get the hate going round after this game against the Roosters. Other than a couple poor kicks, just what the **** did he do so wrong??

Tell me what's he done so wrong in these first three games ??

At one stage tonight I thought thank **** we do still have Norman in the side.....he is the only one who still looks like he could threaten.

I've got no issues with Norman at fullback. Things like defence and kick clean ups .....urgency in both depts haven't IMO been an issue. Seems to be roughly where he's supposed to be at all times.

The one single issue I have with him right now is his kicking....he needs to work on it.

Everytime Norman gets the ball when we use the sweeping backline play he dummies then steps inside and gets tackled. He has got no clue.

 

[Big Pete]

I thought his long distance kicking game was actually good tonight. Helped us out of trouble on a few occasions. Short distance was pretty bad but so was practically everything else close to the line.

As I explained earlier, I just don't think we need another playmaker at fullback. What we need, is a weapon and I just don't think Norman has the running game in him to really threaten. He has a bit of foot-work and that's it really.

His work under the high ball and in defence hasn't been flash either.

 

[Mr Fourex]

Everytime Norman gets the ball when we use the sweeping backline play he dummies then steps inside and gets tackled. He has got no clue.

I see that once or twice.......I see a lot more of him making the extra man and passing it.

 

[Dexter]

The sweep play has been largely killed by the obstruction rule change. Also we need to run it as our option play and hit the front runner a bit more, we are telegraphing the move every time we run it.