Origin 2014 Chat

[Big Pete]

Looking at the Bird penalty...

Can't hear what Hayne calls the penalty for. Wasn't offside so can only assume the Maroons were pinged for taking the ball off Bird after the tackle was complete but that would be extremely harsh.

 

[Cult]

Farah is a grub and I can't stand the bloke.

Also throws more forward passes than an NFL quarterback.

 

[Charmamba]

Looking at the Bird penalty...

Can't hear what Hayne calls the penalty for. Wasn't offside so can only assume the Maroons were pinged for taking the ball off Bird after the tackle was complete but that would be extremely harsh.

You talking about the one where Pigeon pretty much just let go of the balls and we got penalised for it?

 

[Big Pete]

That's the one.

 

[CaptainHook]

Having reflected on the game, here are a few of my thoughts:

I think this was the year that complacency finally crept into the Maroons camp. After eight years of unprecedented success, I'm amazed that it hadn't happened earlier. The preparation for Game 2 in particular left a lot to be desired. I can't help thinking even a few years ago, DCE would have been ruled out early on and we would have gone with Ben Hunt. It turned into a bit of a shambles, tbh. Ben Hunt trained all week and we should've went with him.

Picking 20, 30, 40 man squads is nonsense at this level. Yes, they are great players and should be given every opportunity but in Origin we need 17 able bodied guys, not superstars on one leg. The fact that DCE only completed one session and was the preferred option just smacks of a "she'll be right" attitude and a real sign of disrespect to our opposition.

As others have commented, the refereeing was terrible. There was SO much grubby stuff from both teams. I know Origin is different but geez, that was bad even by Origin standards. Having said that, it's not the reason we lost. We should have known that the 50/50 calls, hell even the 90/10 calls in our favour, weren't going to go our way and we needed to brace ourselves for it.

Perhaps the worse thing is that NSW did a QLD on Queensland. They were the team that earned repeat sets, respected the football, gained field position and did the little things right. It was like the teams wore the wrong jerseys out. We were guilty of the "all or nothing" play and squandered what little attacking opportunities we had. Here's a hint, boys: If it's not on - just roll it in goal and start again. At the very least, you'll tire them out and maybe gaps will appear. QLD looked to panic which is surprising considering their wealth of experience.

Interesting times ahead for the Maroons. We pride ourselves on loyalty, mateship etc but the cold, hard reality is some of our players are getting on and they are not the players they once were. Yes, we only lost by 4 and 2 points respectively but that is a bit deceiving. The way we have lost, injuries or no, points to poor preparation. Maybe it was the loss we had to have to clear the air and get down to business. There's been a lot of talk about dropping players left and right like Gillett, Guerra, Teo etc but by and large I think we do have the best players available. With some players already ruled out though, I'd like us to look to the future and choose some rookies and not recall guys to "do a job." We need to take this opportunity to plan for the future, not look to the past for a face saving win.

 

[Huge]

That's the thing. Refereeing should appear and be impartial. Someone should have told Qld before the game that new rules were in place

 

[Big Pete]

The preparation for Game 2 in particular left a lot to be desired. I can't help thinking even a few years ago, DCE would have been ruled out early on and we would have gone with Ben Hunt. It turned into a bit of a shambles, tbh. Ben Hunt trained all week and we should've went with him.

The preparation was far from ideal but I think it was a real lose/lose situation for the Maroons.

Benny Hunt has made tremendous progress, but he's still got a lot of facets to his game to work on before he can perform at this level. To rest all your hopes on him would have been just as bad.

I'm glad we gave Daly Cherry-Evans every opportunity and while it didn't work out, I thought he really put in despite the extra attention.

Picking 20, 30, 40 man squads is nonsense at this level. Yes, they are great players and should be given every opportunity but in Origin we need 17 able bodied guys, not superstars on one leg. The fact that DCE only completed one session and was the preferred option just smacks of a "she'll be right" attitude and a real sign of disrespect to our opposition.

Well, a 23 man squad because there were question marks over 5 players. Again, I'd rather see them give the likes of Billy Slater, Greg Inglis, Corey Parker, Josh Papalii and Daly Cherry-Evans every opportunity than decide half-way through 'oh shit, better call such and such in' The chances of them putting in a Brett Finch Origin I 2006 performance is remote.

I generally agree with everything else. It's hard to swallow that we lost the Shield based on this second game but when you factor in Origin I then it's pretty easy to swallow. I just felt like in the second game, a lot of elements conspired against the Maroons and the NSW were able to capitilise on it.

 

[CaptainHook]

That's the thing. Refereeing should appear and be impartial. Someone should have told Qld before the game that new rules were in place

Agreed but it's not a new thing. Look at last year's decider and some of the rubbish calls that went against us. It's a miracle we held on.

 

[Cult]

Benny Hunt has made tremendous progress, but he's still got a lot of facets to his game to work on before he can perform at this level. To rest all your hopes on him would have been just as bad.

You don't know that though. Hunt has been the form halfback this year (And yes there is proof of this), he also trained with the team and was fit, unlike DCE. The reason we lost was because we did not select the best possible players in each position. Origin teams should not be picked on who played last year. If a player is outplayed by another player available, they should not be in the team.

 

[Big Pete]

You don't know that though. Hunt has been the form halfback this year (And yes there is proof of this), he also trained with the team and was fit, unlike DCE. The reason we lost was because we did not select the best possible players in each position. Origin teams should not be picked on who played last year. If a player is outplayed by another player available, they should not be in the team.

Ben Hunt has a couple of strong elements that have paid off for him at club level and I'm very happy that he's apart of the Broncos but areas such as his kicking game (which is improving) and his passing game (still needs a fair bit of work) have let him down and to expect him to perform in that type of environment would have been premature.

Daly Cherry-Evans has experienced the intensity of these do or die games before at club and has a premiership and a Clive Churchill medal to show for it. He had to be given every opportunity and while we didn't get the result that we wanted, he didn't let the Maroons down.

I also cannot agree with basing selections on form. If that was the case, we would have cycled through halves each and every game for the past 8 years.

 

[Cult]

Ben Hunt has a couple of strong elements that have paid off for him at club level and I'm very happy that he's apart of the Broncos but areas such as his kicking game (which is improving) and his passing game (still needs a fair bit of work) have let him down and to expect him to perform in that type of environment would have been premature.

Daly Cherry-Evans has experienced the intensity of these do or die games before at club and has a premiership and a Clive Churchill medal to show for it. He had to be given every opportunity and while we didn't get the result that we wanted, he didn't let the Maroons down.

I also cannot agree with basing selections on form. If that was the case, we would have cycled through halves each and every game for the past 8 years.

Which Queensland halves have played better than Cronk and Thurston every year for the past 8 years? DCE didn't play badly but he was definitely not 100% and look how it ended up. Hunt deserved the spot over an injured DCE.

 

[Big Pete]

You misunderstood.

In the past 8 years where Queensland have had Darren Lockyer, Johnathan Thurston, Cooper Cronk & Scott Prince the form varied up and down where you could argue that Prince or Cronk should have come in for either Lockyer/JT but the selectors stuck firm for good reason.

Form is temporary, class is permanent. Finding the balance between the two is difficult.

You're entitled to feel that way, but either way, it was a tough situation and I agreed with the Maroons selectors. Had to give a player of DCE's track record and ability every opportunity to play.

 

[CaptainHook]

Daly Cherry-Evans has experienced the intensity of these do or die games before at club and has a premiership and a Clive Churchill medal to show for it. He had to be given every opportunity and while we didn't get the result that we wanted, he didn't let the Maroons down.

Fair point, there. It's a real shame DCE wasn't 100%. It was a lion-hearted performance and with his exerience we may have just snuck home. Oh well....what if...

Slighlty off topic, Pete - do you buy into the fact that QLD's age is a factor? Individually, Slater, Smith, Thurston, Hodges, Tate etc are all outstanding players but can we afford to carry all of them? I think there were some times in Game 1 where there were definitely opportunities to score but we always seemed to be a fraction of a second too late. Is it more due to Cronk's injury that disrupted the rhythm of the team? It's hard to tell for mine. Would love to hear your take on it.

 

[Alec]

Yeah, DCE playing didn't really work out (though you can't fault him for not trying), but I do think it was the right call at the time. I think it's as far from the ideal game for Hunt to make his debut as well.

 

[Big Pete]

Yeah, I definitely think it was at play.

Slater & Hodges are missing a yard of pace, Tate & GI are both playing out of position and it certainly hurt in Game I.

In Game II, I didn't think it was as big an issue, there were other problems for the Maroons but I'll get a better idea when I watch through a replay. Was planning on spending my afternoon checking it out, but the game was still too raw.

 

[Mr Fourex]

A major factor...other than crucial injuries, Cronk game 1 & Scott game 2, was that JT played like shit in both games.

I'd even go so far as to say Cameron Smith has been a bit off in both games.

There's no way I could blame DCE or think that Hunt would have made a difference on Wednesday night. Thurston & Smith is where our creativity comes from

and we just haven't had it from them this series....

 

[Porthoz]

A major factor...other than crucial injuries, Cronk game 1 & Scott game 2, was that JT played like shit in both games.

I'd even go so far as to say Cameron Smith has been a bit off in both games.

There's no way I could blame DCE or think that Hunt would have made a difference on Wednesday night. Thurston & Smith is where our creativity comes from

and we just haven't had it from them this series....

Don't agree re Smith, I though he was very good last Wednesday, but with DCE underdone and Thurston just that little bit off, a lot of our creativity was lost.
Having said that, they had friggin Hodgkinson and Reynolds in the halves, and we totally annulled Hayne, while still maintaining the overhand in the forwards even after Scott's injury. We were the most likely team for 75% of the match, until that brain fade from Taylor, but even then, were it not for surgical decisions by the refs, we would have been far enough on the score to take the series to a home decider.

No one can convince me the refs weren't the decisive factor in this game!

 

[Mr Fourex]

I think Thurston was a lot off ......not just a little bit.

I hate using the referees as an excuse. That said, I'm still struggling to come to terms with why Thaiday's no-try wasn't play on after Hayne slapped it out of his hands

and why the video refs didn't inform the on field refs that they'd missed the ball touching Woods before it went over the dead ball line.

Our ball.....steaming the NSW line for the last 7 mins

We would have scored...I'm certain.