POST GAME [Round 18, 2022] Broncos vs Titans

[Big Del]

But if you are tackled onto your back you’re more than welcome to just spin over and score a try

No prob if the arm carrying the ball hasn`t touched the ground ...

 

[Cult]

No prob if the arm carrying the ball hasn`t touched the ground ...

That isn’t the only prerequisite for a tackle to be finished.

 

[Big Del]

That isn’t the only prerequisite for a tackle to be finished.

You are wrong .
No amount of splitting hairs is gonna change the rules . It`s not just an opinion , it`s in the rule book .

 

[BroncosFever]

No you! You meanie

 

[Wolfie]

They are currently on the Seibold path (all money in forwards with a young and experienced spine)

although they are attempting the Kevvie path next year, however they'll be attempting it with Foran instead of a leader like Reynolds

I think Foran will do a similar job in a lot of ways if he can stay fit. I dont think on the field he will have quite the same influence Arey does though.

 

[theshed]

I think Foran will do a similar job in a lot of ways if he can stay fit. I dont think on the field he will have quite the same influence Arey does though.

He’ll be massive for Sexton. Sexton has a lot of upside but it was negligent to put so much pressure on him by ditching Fogarty. If Foran stays fit and plays a more dominant role at 6 it will do a lot for Toby. They just need a good hooker. Brimmo is a solid fullback.

Let the Dolphins have Fifita and try to get Cook or something.

 

[Cult]

You are wrong .
No amount of splitting hairs is gonna change the rules . It`s not just an opinion , it`s in the rule book .

Haha ok but explain how tackle can be called whilst players are standing upright, or why coaches put such an emphasis on defenders putting their opponents on their backs and held is called without the ball carrying arm touching the ground?

I know you think you’re right, but you’re not. Unfortunately the weird grey areas are very confusing for the average punter. Luckily there’s a few people here who understand the rules well enough to explain them to you, champ.

 

[Lockysillegitimatechild]

He’ll be massive for Sexton. Sexton has a lot of upside but it was negligent to put so much pressure on him by ditching Fogarty. If Foran stays fit and plays a more dominant role at 6 it will do a lot for Toby. They just need a good hooker. Brimmo is a solid fullback.

Let the Dolphins have Fifita and try to get Cook or something.

I think foran will be great for the titans, but they are delusional if they think it will have the same turn around we have.
His experience, attitude and toughness will be great for them on and off the field. However, the titans have a cultural problem ingrained over years, with plenty of players with poor attitudes. We needed to get rid of a lot of that as well as recruit another couple of "attitude and effort" type players (capewell, James, lee). Reynolds was also a top 3 halfback whos main strength is unloading other players to help them play better, foran is maybe a top 10 (?) 5/8th who plays off the back of sustained pressure with toughness.
Additionally donaghy and ikin have completely unloaded Walters so he can just coach, and with his winning mentality surrounded by experience on and off the field to help him together with his broncos passion and DNA it has made our turn around so quick.

Titans need an identity. Tino is starting to give them one, but meninga and tallis were shocking for them. Set them back in this regard. I've never seen so much fake passion in my life. It was completely grown out of their hatred for the broncos more than anything. Meninga still lives in Canberra ffs haha tallis hardly talks about them now that his mate coaches the broncos lol. They need to stop trying to compete with the Broncos and just play their own game. I'd cop a loss ok fifita. He will likely have a great year outside of foran and with his mum pressuring him to get another big contract but he represents everything that is wrong with the club. Ship him off to the titans, they'd pay the majority with their desperation and he/his mum won't care unless he gets paid. I've never seen sadder looking player on the field, both parties need to cut their losses.

 

[Huge]

If he did, its probably because he is actually an established NRL and Origin player and has to actually make tackles.

He's even got a higher tackling efficiency than Kennedy. Odd that.

It's weird you mentioning Carrigan's tackling efficiency! I mean, it's not really relevant right?
The stats only matter when they suit, right?
Like, Kennedy having a better tackling efficiency than James, averaging over 80metres a game to James's terrible 53. In fact RK's efficiency shits on most but like Carrigan's efficiency, so what? Another good game from RK, our good luck charm, when he plays we win.

 

[Wolfie]

It's weird you mentioning Carrigan's tackling efficiency! I mean, it's not really relevant right?
The stats only matter when they suit, right?
Like, Kennedy having a better tackling efficiency than James, averaging over 80metres a game to James's terrible 53. In fact RK's efficiency shits on most but like Carrigan's efficiency, so what? Another good game from RK, our good luck charm, when he plays we win.

I pretty much ignore stats. I prefer the eye test.

 

[Cult]

It's weird you mentioning Carrigan's tackling efficiency! I mean, it's not really relevant right?
The stats only matter when they suit, right?
Like, Kennedy having a better tackling efficiency than James, averaging over 80metres a game to James's terrible 53. In fact RK's efficiency shits on most but like Carrigan's efficiency, so what? Another good game from RK, our good luck charm, when he plays we win.

Half of Kennedy’s tackles are flops after the tackle is already made. Pretty hard to **** that up, yet he does by giving away penalties within moments of coming on the field. Why won’t you discuss this, Huge?

 

[Organix]

Just when you think the NRL has used up every excuse to do us over they come out with Hosking's try touching the grass on the way to the try line!!!

The rule about double movements is called a double moement because it involves two distinct movements where the second movement further promotes the ball. Last night Hoskings made one movement reaching out for the line, simples.

There is no way that would have been even scrutinised if it was a Sydney team scoring the try. The killer for me was when the ref asked Reyno to move his kick back about 4 cms to the 'correct' spot. Talk about nit picking!

Fair no try. It was a technical double movement, it doesn't matter whether it's one motion or two.

The ONLY thing that matters, is if the arm was promoted after the point of the ball touching the grass, which it was, you can see from his shoulder that he moved his arm after the point of the ball touching the grass. There is no requirement for "momentum" to stop, then move after that, the only time momentum matters is if they hit the ground and momentum bounces them over without them moving their arm forward.

But as far as the try goes, ball hits the grass, after that point, he moves his arm forward which is a promotion of the ball without momentum, so it's a no try. It's a technicality but it's absolutely the right call.

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I often wonder why more plays aren't made in the Billy Slater "dropkick" fashion.
Just drop the ball and toe it and say it was a dropkick, regardless of whether you're perpendicular to the posts.

Also, why not ground the ball with the torso more and take the hands out of the equation, á la Jamie Lyons.

Unfortunately, the rules are perhaps a little unfair in this, but as someone else mentioned, passing off the ground is the same. Ball playing arm scrapes the ground, it's a tackle.

Didn't Tohu Harris score a try against us in similar fashion to Hoskings no try? I believe he was with Melbourne at the time, I remember losing my shit when they awarded that as a try because it was clearly double movement. Maybe my memory's fucked

If it did, I wouldn't be surprised.

Haha ok but explain how tackle can be called whilst players are standing upright, or why coaches put such an emphasis on defenders putting their opponents on their backs and held is called without the ball carrying arm touching the ground?

I know you think you’re right, but you’re not. Unfortunately the weird grey areas are very confusing for the average punter. Luckily there’s a few people here who understand the rules well enough to explain them to you, champ.

Well, the forward momentum has stopped. The referee declares held. Simple. Otherwise the players would just stand there for an eternity. Defending players are coached to put players on their backs precisely to stop the ball-playing arm from touching the ground and instantly effecting the tackle, thus slowing the ruck, allowing the defence to set. In these cases, the ref determines when the tackle is complete.

What should happen with the try attempts, when a player is on his back, as soon as their elbow with the ball touches the ground, it's called held. If they do it all in one spin, and get the ball down, it's a try.

I don't understand why you are saying Big Del and Kimlo are wrong. How do you watch the game and not scream at the ref every time the ref calls held when the player isn't moving forward?

Hosking just got unlucky in scraping the ground and then reaching out further. It's a stickler rule, but if it happened against us, I'd be sighing with relief at the stupid rule. Shit happens.

 

[john1420]

It was a fair enough call. The ball touched the ground before he promoted it. As soon as it touched the ground, the tackle is completed. They had to take it off him.

If he didn’t promote it, he likely still would have made it so he should have just let momentum take the ball over the line.

Except if momentum would have carried the ball over the line then the rule says it's still a try, double movement doesn't apply.
"...it will not be a double movement if the ball would have finished over the goal line regardless of any subsequent movement of the ball or the arm carrying the ball"

 

[john1420]

Fair no try. It was a technical double movement, it doesn't matter whether it's one motion or two.

The ONLY thing that matters, is if the arm was promoted after the point of the ball touching the grass, which it was, you can see from his shoulder that he moved his arm after the point of the ball touching the grass. There is no requirement for "momentum" to stop, then move after that, the only time momentum matters is if they hit the ground and momentum bounces them over without them moving their arm forward.

But as far as the try goes, ball hits the grass, after that point, he moves his arm forward which is a promotion of the ball without momentum, so it's a no try. It's a technicality but it's absolutely the right call.

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Hey @Kimlo love your posts mate but I have to disagree with you here.
You say the only thing that matters is if the arm was promoted after the point of the ball touching the grass, and that momentum only matters if the arm doesn't move forward.
But the rule that you quoted clearly says the opposite.
"It will not be a double movement if the ball would have finished over the goal line regardless of any subsequent movement of the ball or the arm carrying the ball."

 

[Culhwch]

Careful Del. You know what they say about opinions….

On BHQ it's, 'Mine is right, yours is wrong.'

 

[McHunt]

Except if momentum would have carried the ball over the line then the rule says it's still a try, double movement doesn't apply.
"...it will not be a double movement if the ball would have finished over the goal line regardless of any subsequent movement of the ball or the arm carrying the ball"

Hey @Kimlo love your posts mate but I have to disagree with you here.
You say the only thing that matters is if the arm was promoted after the point of the ball touching the grass, and that momentum only matters if the arm doesn't move forward.
But the rule that you quoted clearly says the opposite.
"It will not be a double movement if the ball would have finished over the goal line regardless of any subsequent movement of the ball or the arm carrying the ball."

This is why Pereira's try was allowed. The player's forward momentum continued after the grounding allowing him a second attempt. In other words, if a player is continuing to slide or roll he can get another shot.

 

[Sproj]

Except if momentum would have carried the ball over the line then the rule says it's still a try, double movement doesn't apply.
"...it will not be a double movement if the ball would have finished over the goal line regardless of any subsequent movement of the ball or the arm carrying the ball"

Would it though if he hadn’t promoted it? I don’t think so because he was basically stopped to the point he had to reach out.

There is no doubt he didn’t deliberately do a double movement but once the ball hit the ground, continuing the movement is a double movement regardless of intent as he was held. He mistimed the arm movement, good lesson to learn.

 

[Sproj]

This is why Pereira's try was allowed. The player's forward momentum continued after the grounding allowing him a second attempt.

That and the important fact he wasn’t held which makes any subsequent movement fine. No question of a double movement.