POST GAME Round 8 - Rabbitohs vs Broncos

[bb_gun]

Wayne inherited that team, yes, barring a few players he let go and brought in some new ones, but he got the best out of that team that was underperforming from 2012-2014 and made them great. I'm sure Wayne changed the way things were done, implemented new structures, new defensive structures etc. and the team bought in right away, making a grand final and almost winning it. My point is - we have gone backwards with Seibold. Why is this happening? Obviously the team isn't buying into the changes Seibold is bringing in, why is that?

This isn't a Wayne v Seibold thing, I'm simply making valid points and asking questions because at this point, I could care less who's coaching us because regardless, we are better than what we are dishing up currently and there's your positive statement from me, btw.

Fair point, understood.

Seibold made that Rabbitohs squad, they never won last year. They bowed out early mate.

Shouldn't we afford him (Anthony Seibold) the freedom to do the same here? If we follow your logic, we need to reassess our progress next season, right? Not right now, not after a season and 8 games into it.

 

[Morepudding]

I'm not going to criticize any post you write. Tipping in 3 grand earns you the right to write what you want and be left in peace !!!

Been doing it for 15 years. It just sucks seeing this. Im not mad with the young players, im mad with the management and the lack of leadership from senior players.

I love the footy and obviously a huge fan, but for some people and a lot of kids, footy is everything for them and the performances just aren't okay.

Seibold should take the whole squad down to the starlight foundation and get one of the kids to start crying because the team is so useless. Maybe that would make some of these players take their job seriously.

They are on huge incomes, even the first years get more than most people earn, and they just have no accountability. I can't think of many professions that allow multi year deals for hundreds of thousands of dollars that don't have performances clauses. As far as im concerned, if you're on 500k+ and you don't make the 8, the club can terminate you.

 

[tommy]

Souths first try: Do the refs even know the rules or am I wrong? That has always been a knock on hasn't it? He lost it into our player, what happens after that is moot right?

 

[PNG Broncos fan88]

Out coached.. the hype around seibold was clearly a mistake.
He was a miserable coach before the season last year at south's and to be honest his year at south's really was built off a 3 Burgess barrage and then damien cook scooting and then a left edge sweep. Was found out against the roosters in the finals last year.

Looking at the game I was trying very hard to find a pattern or a game plan. We had 1 option and it was a sweep to the left or a bomb to Corey oates wing on the last. Really poor plan and a real poor use of his bench again tonight. I am not sure why you bother picking carrigan if you play him for 10 minutes?? am still confused as to why there is no Milford or someone with pace not pushing in and around the ruck following our forwards..

Anyway enough of seibold and his master bluffing for a 5 yr deal...con job.

Pangai - plays for himself and not the team. Isaako bluffed everyone last year and he has been found out. Boyd is on his last legs. Roberts wants out and you can clearly see it. Offa has also been found out as well, he is dog shit.... there are some others who are ordinary as well
As for the young kids in the middle, you can't criticise their effort however they clearly lack experience of playing 80 minutes against hardened opposition and a real glaring thing for me is the lack of skill also. Just crash and bash, limited footwork and no ability to play into or through the line.
I have plenty more to rant about but I need a break...

This

 

[Thelmus]

I feel for Macca
He is what he is. Gives you 50-60 tackles a week, works hard, reliable. An old school hooker, but that’s not what today’s game is about.

I’ve said before that he offers zero attacking threat which puts all the pressure on the 6 and 7 and pushes all the play sideways. He doesn’t engage any defenders meaning they all push hard from the inside, knowing that he’s not a threat. We need spark from 9 but we don’t have anyone coming through.

Staggs is my choice as I’ve said before but it would be a huge job to get him there quickly.

Wasnt he actually one of the few that broke South's line? You can whinge about his service but to what point?
Seriously, this constant moaning is ridiculous. The forwards made 60 or 70 metres early on and for what? We got bundled into touch, dropped the ball, or put Luke warm, predictable bombs up. That is on Milford and the blokes who stuffed up. Blame Macca if you feel like it, but it won't matter who our hooker is with last play options like that.
We need to think about being patient and applying pressure against a big pack. Did we do that? Was there even 1 repeat set that has mattered when a game has been in the balance?
We need more than one kicker in general play. We need options on our opponents line. That young half is already showing more enthusiasm than I've seen in 3 seasons from our halves.
Did anyone notice his dummyhalf play gave Macca a chance to make a break for the first time sine: we had a player helping at dummy half.
It's simple: get Macca or whoever else plays there a rest and they become more dangerous. Who would have thought.
As for Milford, he needs to be the player he's being paid to be. If he can't then why is he still here? He kicks every set of 6, but every set ends the same. How can siebold think this is viable as a strategy? If we have two halves that kick: get them BOTH kicking. Change the angles. Maybe even plan what to do come 6th tackle, because if there was one, it either isn't working or is not being followed. Lastly, keep things simple. Leave the fancy plays for the offseason when we know who our backline is from 1 to 7. Play to a position, set to kick, chase hard, repeat.

 

[Dee]

Fair point, understood.

Seibold made that Rabbitohs squad, they never won last year. They bowed out early mate.

Shouldn't we afford him (Anthony Seibold) the freedom to do the same here? If we follow your logic, we need to reassess our progress next season, right? Not right now, not after a season and 8 games into it.

Mcguire made that Souths squad, not Seibold.

Things take time, sure, not every new coach will come in and straight away get the team performing really well, I understand that. What I'm saying is we are better than this. We shouldn't be performing this horribly, new coach or not.

 

[bb_gun]

Mcguire made that Souths squad, not Seibold.

Things take time, sure, not every new coach will come in and straight away get the team performing really well, I understand that. What I'm saying is we are better than this. We shouldn't be performing this horribly, new coach or not.

Fair point, maybe you're correct. I'll wait for improvements, I'll give it a season.

FYI, I do no care about whatever MacGuire did. He was long gone by then. You're not affording Anthony Griffin the same pass are you?

 

[bazza]

Boyd was definitely swimming in a pool of shit tonight. Time to shift him to the wing and then phase him into retirement.

 

[Dee]

Fair point, maybe you're correct. I'll wait for improvements, I'll give it a season.

FYI, I do no care about whatever MacGuire did. He was long gone by then. You're not affording Anthony Griffin the same pass are you?

I'm not because Griffin didn't get the best out of the Broncos, he had 4 years but failed. 2011 was good though. McGuire got the best out of Souths immediately, semi finals every year and eventually won the premiership.

 

[unnerv1ng]

Bird to fullback, staggs to centre, Shibasaki to the wing.

 

[Rookie Alan]

Well here goes nothing:

1. Boyd - Well done on your 300th, that's all the positivity I have. Terrible defense once again to let in those first two tries through a lack of urgency. Of course, TPJ was equally at fault but it doesn't absolve the captain of responsibility once again. He is bare minimum serviceable these days and that is not what you pay a bloke 750k+ a year to do. Move him to centre or tap him on the shoulder, he is done and has been for a while sadly. 4
2. Oates - Tonight summed up the big fella perfectly. Made his usual fantastic runs and scored another fantastic try off Milf as a running second rower. Not sure what to do with Corey given how valuable his metres are and just how good a footballer he is because he bombed a sitter and just ran towards the sideline twice. Granted, he is not getting very good quality passes from his centre but he is dropping the ball as much as anyone in the comp at present, not good enough from an origin winger. 6
3. Roberts - I am actually quite mad at him to be honest. Tonight was pathetic from him, no effort at all until it was very much too late. He was caught out of position on a number of defensive plays because he simply didn't bother getting back in line. He has checked out mentally and I thought that last week after not celebrating at all after scoring his try. 3
4. Bird - This will be controversial but because I was such a vocal critic of his signing, I've been trying to be as objective as possible and can see why people like what he is offering BUT his defense is not great. His energy is fantastic but his passing is also not great and boy does he love running sideways (and no, this is not always a bad thing). That said, he is a symptom of some really bad recruitment and retention decisions, no player is worth 700k+ for energy. His defense is not as good as it has been hyped up to be and his passes are regularly rubbish to Oates, not to mention the tries he has bombed so far this season. Not sure what to do with him other than put him as bench utility, go with it. 6
5. Isaako - Well, he didn't seem to play as poorly as he has in recent times but he wasn't great either. Definitely not one of the worst tonight but certainly not at last year levels. 6
6. Milf - He tried his butt off tonight, just nothing was coming off for him. I can forgive the intercept pass, at least he was trying. He needs to vary his kicking game though, for a kid that was a pure x-factor excitement machine, to become the predictable, one-dimensional player that he has become is just sad and in my opinion, has to be put down to bad coaching. 6
7. Dearden - He did not do a whole lot that screamed man of the match BUT that didn't matter. He showed why he is so highly touted. He did not look overawed at all, put in a great chase on Reynolds on the intercept try and made a very nice line break. His defense looked pretty decent too. A lot to like from his debut. 7
8. Haas - This kid is fantastic. He is certainly not shirking his role in the middle and is doing everything he can without having a break out game so far. I love what he can do and what he will be able to do in the future. Yet another really good game. 8
9. Macca - I am one of his biggest critics but I thought he was really good tonight. He was his usual tackling machine self but he looked very dangerous in attack at times, he was taking some really good options and making some good decisions. He has definitely been improving in the last couple of weeks and tonight was better. That said, he gave away some really stupid penalties at the end of the game. Not bad though. 7
10. Lodge - He was once again quite good but like a lot of players tonight, was a little down on usual. I'm worried this might be starting to become a trend because he hasn't been great the last few weeks, though his average is still better than most others' average. He needs to step up again and be as good as he usually is next week. 6
11. Glenn - He needs to be replaced by Fifita in the starting side. It isn't that he is bad, he isn't, he just isn't as good as Fifita currently is or will be. That left side needs some glue and though I'm not sure Fifita would fix that, he deserves a chance to try. 6
12. Gillett - He is starting to get there and I am happy to see that. He did a lot of good defensive work as always and is starting to get a bit of his old attacking flair back. Hopefully Siebs can figure out how to use him better moving forward but I'm not yet sold on Sieb's ability to do anything. I am still willing to give him time though. Gillett is such an important player in this side moving forward. 7
13. TPJ - Absolute rubbish. This is why he shouldn't be high up on the priority re-signing list. His best is breathe-taking. His worst, like tonight, is head-shakingly bad. He was partly responsible for at least two tries being let in and because of how good his best is, others look to him as a barometre of performance and unfortunately, he isn't consistent enough for that. The fact he turned up stops him getting a zero. 2

15. Fifita - Let the guy start! I cannot believe that Siebs is using him the way he is, it just makes no sense. The kid is good enough to play 80, using him for 15-20 mins is pointless, especially when he is coming on with the game already over and all the forwards out on their feet. He needs to be used better. 6
16. Flegler - I love this kid. I thought he would have started to trend backwards by now but nope, he continues to perform admirably well. To be honest, he'd be an origin smokey in my opinion. I love what he offers form the bench. He rarely ever gets put on his back, it is a great skill to have. 8
17. Joffa - Yeah he made some mistakes but I thought he bought some good energy off the bench. Unfortunately, that energy didn't make up for the below par efforts from most other forwards out there. He needs to get back to his best fast. 5
18. Carrigan - He didn't really do a whole lot that made him stand out but what he did do, he did well. He made some decent runs and not once did I see him get put on his back. He needs to start because he is an Arrow-style workhorse, not a Flegler-style impact player. 6

I rank Gillet and Joffa a bit lower than you did, other than that, 100% agree.

 

[rnabokov]

Wasnt he actually one of the few that broke South's line? You can whinge about his service but to what point?
Seriously, this constant moaning is ridiculous. The forwards made 60 or 70 metres early on and for what? We got bundled into touch, dropped the ball, or put Luke warm, predictable bombs up. That is on Milford and the blokes who stuffed up. Blame Macca if you feel like it, but it won't matter who our hooker is with last play options like that.
We need to think about being patient and applying pressure against a big pack. Did we do that? Was there even 1 repeat set that has mattered when a game has been in the balance?
We need more than one kicker in general play. We need options on our opponents line. That young half is already showing more enthusiasm than I've seen in 3 seasons from our halves.
Did anyone notice his dummyhalf play gave Macca a chance to make a break for the first time sine: we had a player helping at dummy half.
It's simple: get Macca or whoever else plays there a rest and they become more dangerous. Who would have thought.
As for Milford, he needs to be the player he's being paid to be. If he can't then why is he still here? He kicks every set of 6, but every set ends the same. How can siebold think this is viable as a strategy? If we have two halves that kick: get them BOTH kicking. Change the angles. Maybe even plan what to do come 6th tackle, because if there was one, it either isn't working or is not being followed. Lastly, keep things simple. Leave the fancy plays for the offseason when we know who our backline is from 1 to 7. Play to a position, set to kick, chase hard, repeat.

I like what you say.

Seems to me we over-compensated for Dearden by giving way too much kicking - and shape and structures, to and via Milford. I reckon Seibold ought to have trusted Dearden more and given him more responsibility with kicking and organizing. In attack, if you throw a rookie in the deep end, you give him flippers not floaties.

With Knik not there also showed for mine. You lose your regular half back, it must have an effect on the side.

Then, there was the confidence sapping bad luck with the early very lucky tries to Souths and the bloody frustrating try bombing by Oates, defensive lapses by Boyd and TPJ, huge penalty count against us: 9-3 I think, Roberts's pathetic defensive reads, Isaako's regular every-game errors which inevitably lead to points against us, and so the plot unravelled.

For mine Souths were very lucky to win by the margin they did although we did contribute with piss poor defensive reads on our goal line and as I said, bombing try scoring opportunities.

What really worries me is the lack of starch and urgency of our defence on our goal line and that is something Seibold MUST address ASAP.

Other than that, a new half really impacts a team and I for one am going to be patient although not so patient with our defence - especially on our goal line.

 

[Mr Fourex]

I’m sure that old prick is all smiles tonight.

 

[ivanhungryjak]

Our completion rate was 68% and only one forward ran for over 100 metres.

 

[bb_gun]

I'm not because Griffin didn't get the best out of the Broncos, he had 4 years but failed. 2011 was good though. McGuire got the best out of Souths immediately, semi finals every year and eventually won the premiership.

You're straying further and further from every point you're making. Afford our coach the same leeway. Seibold still has time to make the semifinals, even if he doesn't, you're not allowing him the same time you afforded any other coach.

You want to win this season, next season and every other season until the end of time. Not possible.

He's making the required changes necessary for a premiership and all of it takes time. Just like it did for fucking MacGuire.

 

[Allo]

So I was on catch-up replay, but knew the halftime score before I started, so expectations of a win were tempered

We didn’t really do a lot wrong tonight, Souths were just good enough to make us pay every time.

In the same breath, we didn’t do a lot right when it mattered.

Kick out on the kickoff. How is this still a thing we do?

Some pathetic sets trying to get out of our end, mostly saved by Milford’s kicking. So many times working it out from Isaako’s corner there is no one there taking a hitup. Dearden was in dummy half, looks up and no one is there to pass to.

Pangai and Roberts ... genuine game breakers on their day, total passengers when they aren’t. It’s no use running back to chase a kick (Pangai) to then not even try and get the ball, regardless if Boyd is within 2m of it. You can’t rely on him. Tonight both them were a net negative.

Still not impressed with some of the forward pack. Joe O is still hot and cold, Lodge too but less so. They’re putting in the effort but not having much impact and aren’t dominating anyone. Carrigan is getting belted every time he plays - I hope he gets better (sorry Wolfie). Still a lot of one-out running. We need multiple bodies in motion. Give opposition defences something else to think about

The second row is invisible in attack. Gillett was more involved in hitups tonight, but he’s mostly a defensive player now. Glenn is there, doing his understated efforts (that’s not a compliment either) but we need one of them to do something sometimes. Particularly if the middle forwards are having a tough night.

Haas is very good, and Fifita needs to be playing more often than not. 25-30 mins is not not enough. Pangai is impact and nothing more - put him on for 15mins bursts and let him go stupid. Hopefully he can focus his positive actions into that smaller time. Flegler was a good cog without being exceptional.

We are still getting pushed back and around, whereas other teams seem to get the rolling momentum through the ruck bullshit (walking, crawling, rolling off the mark etc). We need someone to become the ‘hard ****’ of the team: the hit-and-stay-hit/ bumping off tacklers for fun way.

I will lighten all that criticism by saying the Bunnies pack is always tough, and in a home ground with a few 50-50s going their way, we were always going to need to be on point and we weren’t.

Boyd. You’ve reached 300, and comparative to other efforts in recent times, didn’t have a bad game. Bounces didn’t go your way, which you really need nowadays, but please get out my team.

McCullough. Tonight is your new base level. Wasn’t terrible, did some good things. Played a fair bit of first receiver, even if it was just a pass along the line. Still need a benchie though.


Oates and Bird. I’m willing to give them benefit of the doubt, but there’s a lot of errors between both of them still. We went to them far too often, or at least in the style we went to them.

Roberts I kind of covered, dude is just not into it it seems. I don’t think he’ll last the season unless something changes. All at sea for Turner’s try.

Isaako, still shaky, still can’t make metres. Not sure if he can improve without being on the end of the team flat-tracking someone.

Milford was good, kicking was on point most of the time. Couldn’t do too much more tonight. Looked much better not having to worry about splitting possessions with Kodi.

Dearden had a wonderful, no-frills debut. Was excellent in defence, only missed one tackle late from marker up in Souths’ half. Showed glimpses of what he can do, very happy with how he went. Fell into formation with Milford very well.

Overall, some positive signs in places, but it’s coming back to keeping possession and making the most of it. We kept trying to go around them and they just slid all day.

We persist with this team until Round 12 bye, and focus on ball security and in-game adapting/ plan B execution. If we hit round 12 with anything under a 4-7 and the positional issues are still present, ring in the changes for guys like Boyd, Roberts, TPJ, bench hooker etc and build towards 2020.

This was a lot longer than I anticipated

 

[Dee]

You're straying further and further from every point you're making. Afford our coach the same leeway. Seibold still has time to make the semifinals, even if he doesn't, you're not allowing him the same time you afforded any other coach.

You want to win this season, next season and every other season until the end of time. Not possible.

He's making the required changes necessary for a premiership and all of it takes time. Just like it did for fucking MacGuire.

Lol okay mate. Who even said I'm not giving Seibold a chance? The teams not buying into his ways, at the moment and that's a fact. We are 2 and 6. That may change, we'll see.

 

[rnabokov]

Our completion rate was 68% and only one forward ran for over 100 metres.

Can't argue with that. The shape and structures were all wrong