Should There be a Salary Cap / National Draft?

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It is. If you a drafted you go to the team that drafts you. Thing is we are talking about a rookie draft here, as in the guys getting drafted are 17/18/19 so fairly unlikely to have a family that they would be uprooting etc. Once a player is off their rookie contract they are a free agent so can sign with anyone/anywhere.

The other consideration is that teams meet with prospects they are considering drafting. In those talks if a player made it clear that they wouldn't want to relocate to their area it is unlikely they would be drafted by that team.
But they still could be. Family or not, it means nothing. These lads may not want to move. Drafts are shit.
 
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It is. If you a drafted you go to the team that drafts you. Thing is we are talking about a rookie draft here, as in the guys getting drafted are 17/18/19 so fairly unlikely to have a family that they would be uprooting etc. Once a player is off their rookie contract they are a free agent so can sign with anyone/anywhere.

The other consideration is that teams meet with prospects they are considering drafting. In those talks if a player made it clear that they wouldn't want to relocate to their area it is unlikely they would be drafted by that team.
The ARL tried a rookie draft once ... got taken to court by Terry Hill and lost their case ...

In fact since high court overturned the draft system, that has now become precedent in the event a player doesn't want to go to a club that they were drafted to (and challenges it in court) or a club loses out on a player they desperately wanted (and challenges it in court)
 

I bleed Maroon

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I hate the salary cap as much as anyone. It's designed to shackle success and reward mediocrity off field. Unfortunately however, it's a necessary evil. Abolish the cap tomorrow and at least 4 clubs are extinct within 2 years. Cronulla, Gold Coast, Manly and Wests would all be immediately dragged beneath the waves as the value of one marquee player they can't afford to lose is suddenly worth more than the entire club.

Who cares I hear you say. Well normally I would agree (certainly in the case of Cronulla), but 4 clubs going bankrupt in quick succession because of the abolition of the cap would definitely be spun by the vultures in the media as a catastrophic mistake by the NRL, not to mention the immediate dominance of the likes of Brisbane, Easts, Melbourne and South Sydney would see those clubs constantly vilified as selfish vandals who put their own success above the success of the sport as a whole (far from untrue in the case of Melbourne).

The bottom line is, if the salary cap is ever to be a thing of the past, or at the very least made a lot more robust, then the onus is on the NRL to make all clubs financially stable. And the solution to that is not simply to pack the clubhouses wall to wall with more pokie machines. Get more out of the TV deal, see to it that every club is actually spending their share of the money wisely (if Manly can't be bothered to actually make Brookvale Oval an at least somewhat professional establishment, frankly they can be left to starve), actually get a clue in regards to crowd attendance and memberships....

This stuff is not rocket science, but this current administration couldn't even light a fire with a fresh piece of flint, let alone get 16 clubs healthy enough to make the talent properly well shared. And while we're on the subject, what the fuck happened to putting value into domestically nurtured talent? Who from the current reigning premiers squad of any worth actually came up through their own nursery? Because without doing the homework myself, I can tell you right now it would be farrrrr from the majority.

Personally I think it actually emphasizes why expansion is well past due. If the comp is expanded to 18 clubs, suddenly a couple of deaths from natural causes to drop back to 16 wouldn't be such a huge deal. If West Coast and Brisbane 2 are kicking around fine in their infancy and showing steady growth, nobody is going to give a shit when perennial no-hopers like Cronulla and Manly meet their maker.
 
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Dash

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It is. If you a drafted you go to the team that drafts you. Thing is we are talking about a rookie draft here, as in the guys getting drafted are 17/18/19 so fairly unlikely to have a family that they would be uprooting etc. Once a player is off their rookie contract they are a free agent so can sign with anyone/anywhere.

The other consideration is that teams meet with prospects they are considering drafting. In those talks if a player made it clear that they wouldn't want to relocate to their area it is unlikely they would be drafted by that team.
They're not actually free agents though. AFL teams retain ownership of any players they draft unless they decide to trade them. You don't become a free agent until a minimum of 8 years service. If you want to move clubs earlier, you have to go back into the draft again.
 

broncos4life

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But they still could be. Family or not, it means nothing. These lads may not want to move. Drafts are shit.
If they don't want to move then they won't play NRL. How do you think the AFL, NFL, NBA etc etc. handle it?

As I said earlier too, the players can make teams aware that they would not be prepared to move to their team so if they are good enough they can back themselves to be drafted by a smaller pool of teams. I mean how is that any different then now? Warriors call up a Brissie kid and offer him a contract, he doesn't want to move so he takes his chances of getting a contract from the Titans or the Broncos.
 

broncos4life

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They're not actually free agents though. AFL teams retain ownership of any players they draft unless they decide to trade them. You don't become a free agent until a minimum of 8 years service. If you want to move clubs earlier, you have to go back into the draft again.
I am more talking about the NFL draft system.
 

broncos4life

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The ARL tried a rookie draft once ... got taken to court by Terry Hill and lost their case ...

In fact since high court overturned the draft system, that has now become precedent in the event a player doesn't want to go to a club that they were drafted to (and challenges it in court) or a club loses out on a player they desperately wanted (and challenges it in court)
I am aware of that because I am older than 15 and it has been mentioned in this thread alone 10 times.

That was under a different regime, doesn't mean we couldn't try it again.

The salary cap is not working and in any case a salary cap was designed to be run in conjunction with a draft, not by itself.
 
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If they don't want to move then they won't play NRL. How do you think the AFL, NFL, NBA etc etc. handle it?

As I said earlier too, the players can make teams aware that they would not be prepared to move to their team so if they are good enough they can back themselves to be drafted by a smaller pool of teams. I mean how is that any different then now? Warriors call up a Brissie kid and offer him a contract, he doesn't want to move so he takes his chances of getting a contract from the Titans or the Broncos.
Move or career over? Listen to what you're saying man. How is that fair on these young guys?

Imagine being told if you want to make it, you need to head to another state in the hope you make it. It's crap, I'd be surprised if even you would be happy if your boss came in and said "You're moving Melbourne. Oh, don't like it, you're done with IT forever, go be a chef"
 
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That was under a different regime, doesn't mean we couldn't try it again.
did you also read the part about the high court also setting a precedent? that therefore means that essentially there is no point, because the second someone challenges the draft, the draft be scrapped again. there is no point spending money to fight a guaranteed losing battle
 
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did you also read the part about the high court also setting a precedent? that therefore means that essentially there is no point, because the second someone challenges the draft, the draft be scrapped again. there is no point spending money to fight a guaranteed losing battle
That's not how it works. Under new bargaining agreements, changing the terms of the draft etc. means it could be a completely different concept, while still being a draft. The courts didn't come out and say "All drafts no more ever forever ever ever never". They only said "What you've come to us with, is not allowed".
 

broncos4life

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Move or career over? Listen to what you're saying man. How is that fair on these young guys?

Imagine being told if you want to make it, you need to head to another state in the hope you make it. It's crap, I'd be surprised if even you would be happy if your boss came in and said "You're moving Melbourne. Oh, don't like it, you're done with IT forever, go be a chef"
If you answer my questions I will answer yours, is that fair? lol

How is it any different to players that need to move to another state for an opportunity?

If the draft was dropped tomorrow, yes it would seem unfair that people had to move. If it were something that was introduced correctly with advanced warning it would just be what it is. For example, say the NRL announce they are moving to a rookie draft in 2024. The next wave of players coming through would understand that is the reality of their sport (like most other professional sports/players do) and would just deal with it.

To the example you used, it's much the same as I said above. If all of a sudden my career in IT was dependent on moving then yes that wouldn't seem fair but ultimately I would have a choice to make. If however in this scenario an announcement was made that in 5 years time a draft system was being implemented in the IT field and all IT graduate jobs would be subject to the businesses that drafted them then that would be fine. I would know that this is the requirement of the IT field and if I was unwilling to move then I would seek a different career path.
 

broncos4life

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did you also read the part about the high court also setting a precedent? that therefore means that essentially there is no point, because the second someone challenges the draft, the draft be scrapped again. there is no point spending money to fight a guaranteed losing battle
I did read what you said there but chose to ignore it because it was wrong but given the many times you have claimed this it is a cemented opinion with you that I know you will not budge on.
 
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If you answer my questions I will answer yours, is that fair? lol

How is it any different to players that need to move to another state for an opportunity?

If the draft was dropped tomorrow, yes it would seem unfair that people had to move. If it were something that was introduced correctly with advanced warning it would just be what it is. For example, say the NRL announce they are moving to a rookie draft in 2024. The next wave of players coming through would understand that is the reality of their sport (like most other professional sports/players do) and would just deal with it.

To the example you used, it's much the same as I said above. If all of a sudden my career in IT was dependent on moving then yes that wouldn't seem fair but ultimately I would have a choice to make. If however in this scenario an announcement was made that in 5 years time a draft system was being implemented in the IT field and all IT graduate jobs would be subject to the businesses that drafted them then that would be fine. I would know that this is the requirement of the IT field and if I was unwilling to move then I would seek a different career path.
They can choose to stick around in the lower grades of a club to work their way into that club, without the threat of the league coming in and saying "Fuck off to Melbourne of your career is over". It's a stupid system no matter which sport it's in.

What benefits does it bring that bring transparent with pays wouldn't bring? None. But it could bring some player resentment and certainly fan resentment.
 

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Move or career over? Listen to what you're saying man. How is that fair on these young guys?

Imagine being told if you want to make it, you need to head to another state in the hope you make it. It's crap, I'd be surprised if even you would be happy if your boss came in and said "You're moving Melbourne. Oh, don't like it, you're done with IT forever, go be a chef"
Teachers and nurses deal with it all the time. Not other states but guess what you're moving to Roma.
 
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Teachers and nurses deal with it all the time. Not other states but guess what you're moving to Roma.
It just wouldn't be a thread about footy without you showing up to an argument without reading mate.

With that, what's your point? It happens in other industries so that make's it completely fair? No.
 
They can choose to stick around in the lower grades of a club to work their way into that club, without the threat of the league coming in and saying "Fuck off to Melbourne of your career is over". It's a stupid system no matter which sport it's in.

What benefits does it bring that bring transparent with pays wouldn't bring? None. But it could bring some player resentment and certainly fan resentment.
I've gotta disagree with you on this one.

The system works flawlessly in the NBA, nobody complains if they get drafted to a team on the other side of the country, getting drafted is an achievement. The teams look after you, they're your employer and they essentially organise your life for you for the first few years after you've been drafted, it'd be a MASSIVE positive for a lot of kids to be drafted, especially the ones coming out of the poor households. They wouldn't have to worry about finding a secondary job to pay the bills whilst they try and peruse their dream of making first grade, or worry about not having a roof over their head during that rough age of 18-21 that a lot of current fringe first graders go through. If for whatever reason it doesn't work out during their 3 year rookie contract (Which every player drafted would receive, and a base salary which scales based on where you were drafted, the higher you're drafted the higher your rookie salary is) and they don't get offered a second contract, tough cookies, move home and get a real job, think of it is a nice 3 year paid vacation to go play footy.

It's not like you'd get drafted, move to Western Sydney and then get told by the team that drafted you, "Hey, you're on your own now, go find a place to live and be at training at 6:30 on Monday morning", which seems to be what a lot of people on here think it's like.

Edit: With all that being said, I don't really want an NRL draft, I think the system is ok at the moment, we just need more policing on the salary cap, make all contracts public. (Like the NBA!)
 
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38,108
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I've gotta disagree with you on this one.

The system works flawlessly in the NBA, nobody complains if they get drafted to a team on the other side of the country, getting drafted is an achievement. The teams look after you, they're your employer and they essentially organise your life for you for the first few years after you've been drafted, it'd be a MASSIVE positive for a lot of kids to be drafted, especially the ones coming out of the poor households. They wouldn't have to worry about finding a secondary job to pay the bills whilst they try and peruse their dream of making first grade, or worry about not having a roof over their head during that rough age of 18-21 that a lot of current fringe first graders go through. If for whatever reason it doesn't work out during their 3 year rookie contract (Which every player drafted would receive, and a base salary which scales based on where you were drafted, the higher you're drafted the higher your rookie salary is) and they don't get offered a second contract, tough cookies, move home and get a real job, think of it is a nice 3 year paid vacation to go play footy.

It's not like you'd get drafted, move to Western Sydney and then get told by the team that drafted you, "Hey, you're on your own now, go find a place to live and be at training at 6:30 on Monday morning", which seems to be what a lot of people on here think it's like.

Edit: With all that being said, I don't really want an NRL draft, I think the system is ok at the moment, we just need more policing on the salary cap, make all contracts public. (Like the NBA!)
There is a massive issue with people comparing our sport to US sports. Our sport is tiny. Our sport has next to no money. Our sport is full of useless unprofessional clubs. If I was being handed a contract worth hundreds of millions, it changes things slightly too.
 

1910

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It just wouldn't be a thread about footy without you showing up to an argument without reading mate.

With that, what's your point? It happens in other industries so that make's it completely fair? No.
I did read it, but just so I am sure you’re against a draft because the poor footballers can’t be expected to be moved from home?

I expanded and added other jobs that expect it- I would have thought you’d then back up your idea with yeah but footballers are different and give your reasons why you think they can’t be moved.

Sort of how a conversation goes.
 
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