Should There be a Salary Cap / National Draft?

There is a massive issue with people comparing our sport to US sports. Our sport is tiny. Our sport has next to no money. Our sport is full of useless unprofessional clubs. If I was being handed a contract worth hundreds of millions, it changes things slightly too.
You don't need hundreds of millions of dollars to survive as an 18 year old playing footy for a living, if you've got a guaranteed roof over your head you could survive off less than $50k a year, unbelievably comfortably. Also, rookie contracts in the NBA are peas comparatively to the contracts you're talking about, 96-98% less than the highest paid players in the league in terms of a yearly salary.
 
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You don't need hundreds of millions of dollars to survive as an 18 year old playing footy for a living, if you've got a guaranteed roof over your head you could survive off less than $50k a year, unbelievably comfortably. Also, rookie contracts in the NBA are peas comparatively to the contracts you're talking about, 96-98% less than the highest paid players in the league in terms of a yearly salary.
And? Life isn't all about being paid a wage and having a roof. For some it's also about their roots. It's about being home. It's about Mum being a 5 minute drive away. Hell, maybe your favourite bar and best mates are here, there doesn't need to be a reason to want to choose where to live, and I don't think we should be forcing ANYONE to live anywhere.

I imagine the $50k and the houses in Canberra will keep you warm at night, and keep shoes on your feet. But you're still in the absolute shit hole that is Canberra.

I still haven't seen a decent valid reason as to why we even need a draft. The argument comes up from time to time, and it's usually just yank sports fans who think yanks do everything great, and see how successful their sports are, and that's that, it has to be the draft, it will fix everything else.

I did read it, but just so I am sure you’re against a draft because the poor footballers can’t be expected to be moved from home?

I expanded and added other jobs that expect it- I would have thought you’d then back up your idea with yeah but footballers are different and give your reasons why you think they can’t be moved.

Sort of how a conversation goes.
I don't think it makes it anymore fair just because other have to move. Shit argument.
 
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Salaries being made public wouldn't be enough IMO. At the moment at least half of them are reported in the media, and though they may not all be 100% accurate, it gives an idea. There are already players that you'd consider to be on "unders", and the explanation is always that they're taking less to play for X club, out of opportunity or loyalty.

Even if you included their 3rd party deals, it doesn't go far enough. Because it's the stuff off the books that is where the real cheating happens. Teams don't do duplicate books anymore, but they still do free boats, fake jobs for family members through third-party companies, fake work/invoices for works that may or may not have been done, and even the ol' paper bag full of cash.

Without doing a complete and exhaustive audit of every player, their family, including income, expenditure, and compare it to their resulting lifestyle, it's too easy to hide payments.
 

Tom

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Salaries being made public wouldn't be enough IMO. At the moment at least half of them are reported in the media, and though they may not all be 100% accurate, it gives an idea. There are already players that you'd consider to be on "unders", and the explanation is always that they're taking less to play for X club, out of opportunity or loyalty.

Even if you included their 3rd party deals, it doesn't go far enough. Because it's the stuff off the books that is where the real cheating happens. Teams don't do duplicate books anymore, but they still do free boats, fake jobs for family members through third-party companies, fake work/invoices for works that may or may not have been done, and even the ol' paper bag full of cash.

Without doing a complete and exhaustive audit of every player, their family, including income, expenditure, and compare it to their resulting lifestyle, it's too easy to hide payments.
At the very least it will raise eyebrows when Roos....err, players on 100-200k are turning down offers of 400-500k
 
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At the very least it will raise eyebrows when Roos....err, players on 100-200k are turning down offers of 400-500k
You mean like how our young forward just rejected a $1.2 million offer from the Bulldogs to stay with the Broncos on what I assume would be a far more modest contract?
 
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Salaries being made public wouldn't be enough IMO. At the moment at least half of them are reported in the media, and though they may not all be 100% accurate, it gives an idea. There are already players that you'd consider to be on "unders", and the explanation is always that they're taking less to play for X club, out of opportunity or loyalty.

Even if you included their 3rd party deals, it doesn't go far enough. Because it's the stuff off the books that is where the real cheating happens. Teams don't do duplicate books anymore, but they still do free boats, fake jobs for family members through third-party companies, fake work/invoices for works that may or may not have been done, and even the ol' paper bag full of cash.

Without doing a complete and exhaustive audit of every player, their family, including income, expenditure, and compare it to their resulting lifestyle, it's too easy to hide payments.
It would be a huge step in the right direction.

You said it yourself, they're reported in the media, no one knows what's bullshit and what's not. Is Jack Bird on 500k, or 1.2M? Having all salaries public cuts out the innuendo and BS. If Cooper Cronk and Tedesco are on 400k each while players like Milford and Ponga are on 1M it would make it a lot easier to tell who's rorting the system. Sure the NRL knows this but they've never found a salary cap rort unless someone gave them a directions chart with a numbered list of offences on a USB stick, they're useless. Having it public means the fans know, the media know for sure and the all of a sudden there's a lot more scrutiny when the Roosters sign the next superstar for a can of coke and a pie.
 
And? Life isn't all about being paid a wage and having a roof. For some it's also about their roots. It's about being home. It's about Mum being a 5 minute drive away. Hell, maybe your favourite bar and best mates are here, there doesn't need to be a reason to want to choose where to live, and I don't think we should be forcing ANYONE to live anywhere.
So essentially your argument against is that you'd prefer to stay close to home, therefore everyone does? I can guarantee a LOT of 18 year olds with no life experience would love to go move to a different state for 3 years, get paid to play footy, meet new people, visit new places, etc, etc.

Seems like a personal preference thing, no? Also, there's nobody forcing players to enter the draft, which you seem to be avoiding. If you don't want to risk being drafted by a team in another state, don't enter the draft. There's alternative ways to get in to the league, fight your way through Queensland Cup / New South Wales Cup like everyone does right now. Having a draft and staying home to fight your way in to your local first grade team aren't mutually exclusive, they can co-exist.
 

Tom

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You mean like how our young forward just rejected a $1.2 million offer from the Bulldogs to stay with the Broncos on what I assume would be a far more modest contract?
But do we really know that's what the figure is? They love to just make them up, especially when it comes to us. Plus I think we probably have the best record of developing juniors and bringing them into first grade which makes it a little more understandable than a seasoned first grader doing the same.
 
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So essentially your argument against is that you'd prefer to stay close to home, therefore everyone does? I can guarantee a LOT of 18 year olds with no life experience would love to go move to a different state for 3 years, get paid to play footy, meet new people, visit new places, etc, etc.

Seems like a personal preference thing, no? Also, there's nobody forcing players to enter the draft, which you seem to be avoiding. If you don't want to risk being drafted by a team in another state, don't enter the draft. There's alternative ways to get in to the league, fight your way through Queensland Cup / New South Wales Cup like everyone does right now. Having a draft and staying home to fight your way in to your local first grade team aren't mutually exclusive, they can co-exist.
Your second point is the best one going. It's the only one that actually plays to me saying well earlier in the thread that I don't know the ins and outs of the draft.

In regard to the first, of course it's a preference. But once you throw the draft there, it's not a choice anymore. You do as you're told. Shit system.

I still don't see how a draft fixes ANYTHING in the NRL though. No one pro draft has said that yet.
 
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But do we really know that's what the figure is? They love to just make them up, especially when it comes to us. Plus I think we probably have the best record of developing juniors and bringing them into first grade which makes it a little more understandable than a seasoned first grader doing the same.
The point is, as much as I love to sink the boot in to the Roosters, if we're going to vilify them for "cheating the cap" because of the exact same things that our club also claims, we should equally be under suspicion.

Even if we did have every player's salaries known, if a Roosters player is genuinely getting paid less than a rival club offered, they are still no more guilty of cheating the cap than we are, assuming the Bulldogs' offer to Carrigan is genuine.
 

Battler

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Without a cap the most popular clubs in the comp + the rorters (for as long as Politis is around) and maybe the storm (I think they're about to drop off massively in the next few years without Smith, but they seem to have a lot of cash) will be successful which will be good for the game imo. The Dogs, Eels, and maybe Raiders will be powerhouses and the Warriors will be able to maintain consistent success in a market where league is gaining more and more ground.

Financial horror shows like the Titans, Sharks, Manly, etc will fold and we'll get new financially viable clubs in places like Perth. It'd be wonderful for the game long term, but it ought to have happened 20 years ago. I'm not sure if we can go through it now..

It would be a huge step in the right direction.

You said it yourself, they're reported in the media, no one knows what's bullshit and what's not. Is Jack Bird on 500k, or 1.2M? Having all salaries public cuts out the innuendo and BS. If Cooper Cronk and Tedesco are on 400k each while players like Milford and Ponga are on 1M it would make it a lot easier to tell who's rorting the system. Sure the NRL knows this but they've never found a salary cap rort unless someone gave them a directions chart with a numbered list of offences on a USB stick, they're useless. Having it public means the fans know, the media know for sure and the all of a sudden there's a lot more scrutiny when the Roosters sign the next superstar for a can of coke and a pie.
What I also love about the rorters claiming that players take less to play for them is that the club is located in the most expensive place to live in the country.
 
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Cult3

State of Origin Captain
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I like the idea of a salary cap system similar to the NBA, whereby if you exceed the cap you pay a huge luxury tax.
This is pretty much what we have now except they call it a fine and we have no idea where the money goes
 

Tom

State of Origin Rep
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The point is, as much as I love to sink the boot in to the Roosters, if we're going to vilify them for "cheating the cap" because of the exact same things that our club also claims, we should equally be under suspicion.

Even if we did have every player's salaries known, if a Roosters player is genuinely getting paid less than a rival club offered, they are still no more guilty of cheating the cap than we are, assuming the Bulldogs' offer to Carrigan is genuine.
Yeah we are good at hanging onto the young guys and I assume that's because of the point I already made but when it comes to guys who have been in first grade a few years there would be huge question marks over why they wouldn't want to double their pay.
 
Salaries being made public wouldn't be enough IMO. At the moment at least half of them are reported in the media, and though they may not all be 100% accurate, it gives an idea. There are already players that you'd consider to be on "unders", and the explanation is always that they're taking less to play for X club, out of opportunity or loyalty.

Even if you included their 3rd party deals, it doesn't go far enough. Because it's the stuff off the books that is where the real cheating happens. Teams don't do duplicate books anymore, but they still do free boats, fake jobs for family members through third-party companies, fake work/invoices for works that may or may not have been done, and even the ol' paper bag full of cash.

Without doing a complete and exhaustive audit of every player, their family, including income, expenditure, and compare it to their resulting lifestyle, it's too easy to hide payments.
Why not include their sexual habits as well? If a player doesn't fuck his wife/gf often enough, he's probably fucking some piece on the side, that he might be maintaining with the brown paper bag he gets on a weekly/monthly base from his club...
Let's fucking get real, as much as they are public figures, players also deserve the right to privacy!

The main reason for a salary cap is to artificially maintain a close competition and give the opportunity to every club in the comp to actually have a fair chance to win it.
No matter what people feel about the cap's pros and cons, that works, as it does in any competition in the world where a cap is used.

On the other hand, no cap guarantees a competition dominated by a handfull of clubs, as the biggest sport in the world proves in every single club competition, be it national, continental or international.

As Broncos fans, we would certainly not regret it, because we would undoubtedly be part of said handfull of dominant clubs.
But would the NRL survive in such a small market as the Australian, if most clubs without resources would essentially be aspiring to nothing more than a spot in the bottom part of the top 8?

I don't know whether a Draft would work without a cap either, and there are valid arguments for both sides of the argument. I tend to think that if your goal is to be a player in the NRL, chances are you will not be able to stay in your comfort zone, especially if you hail from Victoria, New Zealand or ACT, not to speak of other Australian states or countries, so a Draft would only be a discomfort for Qld'ers and especially NSW'kers, with their 9 NRL clubs in a relatively small area.

Of course, you could argue that forcing more than half of the rookies to live in Sydney and suburbs, is cruel and unusual punishment, possibly in contravention of the UN Human Rights Charter.
 
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