Alec
International Rep
- Mar 4, 2008
- 19,413
- 12,537
I kinda agree. I mean, you could call it field goal practice, but it's not real practice unless they charging you while 5-10 metres offside. Otherwise, you might as well practice during training.
What’s going wrong with us?
- Thread starter Viti
- Start date
I kinda agree. I mean, you could call it field goal practice, but it's not real practice unless they charging you while 5-10 metres offside. Otherwise, you might as well practice during training.
NSW stables
NRL Player
- May 3, 2019
- 2,635
- 7,090
Firstly WB's coaching record is impressive, some say this has been the result of having quality teams/players, but none the less he has been a great coach. However, As an outsider, one of my criticisms was WB seemed to be too "softly, softly" with the recent players. That was why i was stoked that there was talk about bellamy (that and we may learn how to wrestle and be on par with other teams in the ruck) but unfortunately that wasnt to be (i would have definitely opened the cheque book for him)
I get the impression Seibs adopts the same softer approach as WB. I think some players in our squad need a rocket up them.
I get the impression Seibs adopts the same softer approach as WB. I think some players in our squad need a rocket up them.
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PNG Broncos fan88
NRL Player
- Aug 27, 2018
- 1,248
- 1,380
Very true outsider. I was frustrated as hell that he kept picking an injured Boyd and Bird last year. He played favourites with those two when they were clearly the weakest links in the team. And Seibold is doing that too, his leadership group now consists of our weakest links in the 1 and 9.
theshed
Just a Game
- Aug 28, 2010
- 15,601
- 36,349
Don’t think you’d need to tell him
IceWorks
NRL Player
- May 10, 2019
- 1,146
- 1,712
Ok.. timing in. Long time Broncs fan and have watched Wally Lewis in his Valleys days which dates me.
The Broncos are a one team town. Powerful club with a great history and finances. I have watched the coach trade fiasco and the dramas this year and something is clearly sub optimal with the leadership and planning. A club like this is bigger than any player or coach and the way that Bellamy was chased amongst other events seems more like hopeful desperation rather than negotiating from a position of power. Also having only enjoyed watching the team play live a few times I am wondering if it is just my bad luck or are they generally a boring and predictable attacking side now?
The Broncos are a one team town. Powerful club with a great history and finances. I have watched the coach trade fiasco and the dramas this year and something is clearly sub optimal with the leadership and planning. A club like this is bigger than any player or coach and the way that Bellamy was chased amongst other events seems more like hopeful desperation rather than negotiating from a position of power. Also having only enjoyed watching the team play live a few times I am wondering if it is just my bad luck or are they generally a boring and predictable attacking side now?
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lynx000
State of Origin Rep
- Jul 28, 2008
- 6,592
- 8,816
The club has failed at succession planing for the last 12 years, both coaching and playing wise. Yes, they are generally a boring and predictable attacking side and pretty much have been for the last 8 years.
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Browny
International Rep
- Apr 9, 2008
- 12,112
- 7,336
Add in a lack of composure and how to deal with adversity
lynx000
State of Origin Rep
- Jul 28, 2008
- 6,592
- 8,816
Yes, definitely, very little resilience these days.
- Aug 25, 2018
- 18,266
- 31,477
Remembering his brother Scott as the more promising schoolboy player dates me.
Kooly87
NRL Captain
- Jun 2, 2017
- 4,197
- 7,275
I think it's honestly fairly simple. Our Hooker and our Fullback simply suck.
That's seemingly a simplistic view of it, but it's a reflection of our inability to recognise that the game is changing and these two positions are arguably the two most important positions in the modern game, with really only the Halfback coming even close in their ability to dictate a result.
Look at the really successful sides of the last 3-5 seasons and they all share that much in common. A devastating running/playmaking Fullback and a Dummy Half who is a constant threat around the ruck.
Slater/Munster & Smith
Inglis / Cook
RTS/Tedesco & Friend
Morgan/Coote & Granville
Barba & Ennis
At Origin level, more of the same:
Slater & Smith had more than a decade of dominance and now NSW are having their turn and I'd argue that by far their biggest advantage right now is the devastation that Tedesco & Cook inflict on Queensland.
Now some of the really elite sides will also have a world class Half, but rarely do they have two great Halves.
I look at Manly who I think personally had a much lower quality roster than us overall and who have been ravaged by injury this year, but they've managed to remain competitive because they have a Fullback and Dummy Half setup which asks constant questions of the opposition defence.
Canberra are another side who have probably the worst Halves in the comp on paper and yet they continue to be competitive because they've unearthed a Fullback who constantly busts tackles and in Hodgson they have a Dummy Half who puts the opposition defence under pressure around the ruck.
For mine, until we correct the balance of our side and invest considerably in our salary cap on a world class Fullback and Dummy Half, we'll continue to be just making up the numbers.
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If we went to market to buy Kalyn Ponga, basically no matter what it cost, along with a full preseason for Turpin, I think we could turn our fortunes around almost instantly.
That's seemingly a simplistic view of it, but it's a reflection of our inability to recognise that the game is changing and these two positions are arguably the two most important positions in the modern game, with really only the Halfback coming even close in their ability to dictate a result.
Look at the really successful sides of the last 3-5 seasons and they all share that much in common. A devastating running/playmaking Fullback and a Dummy Half who is a constant threat around the ruck.
Slater/Munster & Smith
Inglis / Cook
RTS/Tedesco & Friend
Morgan/Coote & Granville
Barba & Ennis
At Origin level, more of the same:
Slater & Smith had more than a decade of dominance and now NSW are having their turn and I'd argue that by far their biggest advantage right now is the devastation that Tedesco & Cook inflict on Queensland.
Now some of the really elite sides will also have a world class Half, but rarely do they have two great Halves.
I look at Manly who I think personally had a much lower quality roster than us overall and who have been ravaged by injury this year, but they've managed to remain competitive because they have a Fullback and Dummy Half setup which asks constant questions of the opposition defence.
Canberra are another side who have probably the worst Halves in the comp on paper and yet they continue to be competitive because they've unearthed a Fullback who constantly busts tackles and in Hodgson they have a Dummy Half who puts the opposition defence under pressure around the ruck.
For mine, until we correct the balance of our side and invest considerably in our salary cap on a world class Fullback and Dummy Half, we'll continue to be just making up the numbers.
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If we went to market to buy Kalyn Ponga, basically no matter what it cost, along with a full preseason for Turpin, I think we could turn our fortunes around almost instantly.
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- Jul 28, 2016
- 24,425
- 35,824
@kooly87 raises good points on the offensive side of the ball.... I think that all stems from the spine where we are probably bottom 4 in the comp.
The only member that would make grade at another club is Milf (I'm excluding the young halves as they are developing and could make grade at other clubs based on potential alone). This leaves a huge burden on Milf to do almost everything from an offense point of view as evidenced on the weekend where he was playing 1 & 6 and the kicking game in the first half.
There is also the other side of the ball where I think we are way behind the 8 ball simply because we haven't been keeping up with the modern day tactics and have avoided the wrestle.... also our line speed is just ridiculously slow, which is either:
tactical - leftover from the old days (our line speed was snail's pace in 2015 as well),
attitude - where they can't be assed to hit the opposition or
fatigue - because their failures on offense are resulting in increased defensive sets.
I think it's partly attitude, because the lack of line speed is evident from kick off.. and coaching whether Seibs hasn't been able to institute the defence he wants due to a disrupted preseason or a poor defensive coach... or the squad is reverting to muscle memory of the old slow line speed days because they can't grasp the basics. It could also be Macca, because it appears he leads the defensive line and therefore sets the line speed... am only saying this because it is most evident when Turps is on the field, where his intensity in line speed is miles ahead of Macca.
I think the whole squad is so far behind in modern football that the basics in offense and defense is like a foreign language to them and they're having to learn it from scratch.
This could also impact on attitude where the players are too much in their own head trying to remember what their role is... it's not to say they aren't trying, but more that the basics of their role is not yet second nature to them. They have to be thinking all the time about the next move rather than just doing subconsciously.
I'm ok with losing this season as long as the players are actually learning how to play the game... once they can perform their role without thinking they will be able to focus more on the tempo and feel of a game, which will improve the squad significantly
The only member that would make grade at another club is Milf (I'm excluding the young halves as they are developing and could make grade at other clubs based on potential alone). This leaves a huge burden on Milf to do almost everything from an offense point of view as evidenced on the weekend where he was playing 1 & 6 and the kicking game in the first half.
There is also the other side of the ball where I think we are way behind the 8 ball simply because we haven't been keeping up with the modern day tactics and have avoided the wrestle.... also our line speed is just ridiculously slow, which is either:
tactical - leftover from the old days (our line speed was snail's pace in 2015 as well),
attitude - where they can't be assed to hit the opposition or
fatigue - because their failures on offense are resulting in increased defensive sets.
I think it's partly attitude, because the lack of line speed is evident from kick off.. and coaching whether Seibs hasn't been able to institute the defence he wants due to a disrupted preseason or a poor defensive coach... or the squad is reverting to muscle memory of the old slow line speed days because they can't grasp the basics. It could also be Macca, because it appears he leads the defensive line and therefore sets the line speed... am only saying this because it is most evident when Turps is on the field, where his intensity in line speed is miles ahead of Macca.
I think the whole squad is so far behind in modern football that the basics in offense and defense is like a foreign language to them and they're having to learn it from scratch.
This could also impact on attitude where the players are too much in their own head trying to remember what their role is... it's not to say they aren't trying, but more that the basics of their role is not yet second nature to them. They have to be thinking all the time about the next move rather than just doing subconsciously.
I'm ok with losing this season as long as the players are actually learning how to play the game... once they can perform their role without thinking they will be able to focus more on the tempo and feel of a game, which will improve the squad significantly
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- Jun 13, 2019
- 10,283
- 14,810
Big lack of effort with the Leadership Group is spreading this cancer all over the team, Boyd and Macca must go and we need to sign one or 2 good experienced players who fight hard no matter the result, the effort areas are killing us but we have the Talent to capitalize if we can get some good voices in There.
Wouldn't mind signing Maloney for a 1 season Deal next year, Penrith have been talking about Offloading him, would fit like a glove with our team atm, Milf can then go FB and we are ready to Rumble.
Wouldn't mind signing Maloney for a 1 season Deal next year, Penrith have been talking about Offloading him, would fit like a glove with our team atm, Milf can then go FB and we are ready to Rumble.
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Kooly87
NRL Captain
- Jun 2, 2017
- 4,197
- 7,275
I'll throw another one out there:
The main issue with dropping Boyd at this stage as far as I can see is the lack of a suitable replacement. Isaako was the only other Fullback on the books and his game has gone steadily backwards this year so I'm ruling him out.
We've seen this week gone that Seibold sees something in Milford as a Fullback and honestly I'm prepared to chance our arm here given I've already state that I think it's one of the two most important positions on the field. Milf deserves a rap for the sustained improvements he's made as a game managing Half over the years, but it's always been a bit of a case of fitting a square peg in a round hole. Credit to him for doing as well as he has there.
If we truly do believe he has the potential to revert to Fullback and become our version of Ponga/Barba/Teddy/Trbojevic etc then I'm more than happy to give it a shot. I think its critical we have a world class Fullback in our side and Milf at this point is the only player with even the potential to fit that bill.
What I cannot come at though is the idea that Darius Boyd is the second best 5/8 available at the club.
He's never been a Half. He has no playing history there whatsoever. He's old and unlikely to develop in any way into that role. He has shown no real kicking game that anyone can speak of. He's also defensively never been in the front line and his body is realistically only going to decline at his age.
So if we're going to buy into the Milford experiment then I'm all for it as we urgently need to address the Fullback position and I would absolutely sacrifice our Halves situation to achieve it given how important I think the position is in the modern game, but please, lets get serious. Darius Boyd should not be our 5/8 based purely on us wanting to shoehorn him into the side somewhere.
For Darius its as simple as this. He plays on the Wing, in the Centres, off the Bench as a Utility, or not at all. His days as a Fullback are done and he has no right to have a shot at his time as a Half.
At this point, if he really must be retained in the 17 then I'd prefer him at Centre and for us to provide an opportunity for a genuine Half to play in the 5/8 role whether that is a youngster or we go to market to get someone, but in no way does it make sense for us to use Boyd there.
The main issue with dropping Boyd at this stage as far as I can see is the lack of a suitable replacement. Isaako was the only other Fullback on the books and his game has gone steadily backwards this year so I'm ruling him out.
We've seen this week gone that Seibold sees something in Milford as a Fullback and honestly I'm prepared to chance our arm here given I've already state that I think it's one of the two most important positions on the field. Milf deserves a rap for the sustained improvements he's made as a game managing Half over the years, but it's always been a bit of a case of fitting a square peg in a round hole. Credit to him for doing as well as he has there.
If we truly do believe he has the potential to revert to Fullback and become our version of Ponga/Barba/Teddy/Trbojevic etc then I'm more than happy to give it a shot. I think its critical we have a world class Fullback in our side and Milf at this point is the only player with even the potential to fit that bill.
What I cannot come at though is the idea that Darius Boyd is the second best 5/8 available at the club.
He's never been a Half. He has no playing history there whatsoever. He's old and unlikely to develop in any way into that role. He has shown no real kicking game that anyone can speak of. He's also defensively never been in the front line and his body is realistically only going to decline at his age.
So if we're going to buy into the Milford experiment then I'm all for it as we urgently need to address the Fullback position and I would absolutely sacrifice our Halves situation to achieve it given how important I think the position is in the modern game, but please, lets get serious. Darius Boyd should not be our 5/8 based purely on us wanting to shoehorn him into the side somewhere.
For Darius its as simple as this. He plays on the Wing, in the Centres, off the Bench as a Utility, or not at all. His days as a Fullback are done and he has no right to have a shot at his time as a Half.
At this point, if he really must be retained in the 17 then I'd prefer him at Centre and for us to provide an opportunity for a genuine Half to play in the 5/8 role whether that is a youngster or we go to market to get someone, but in no way does it make sense for us to use Boyd there.
broncos4life
International Captain
- Oct 5, 2011
- 26,663
- 27,317
But hang on you said their strike weapons were out, what does that have to do with our completions? Were all of the sharks best defensive players out? Were the Sharks missing Johnson’s numerous tackles and defensive pressure?
Morepudding
NRL Captain
- Dec 16, 2015
- 4,383
- 4,775
I think it's pretty obvious what the issues are...
1. We don't have a leader. As much hate as Boyd has been getting for his performances, the thing that irks me the most is that he is also the captain. His performances are bad enough, but when you consider he is the captain, he most certainly does not lead by example. All research and studies will show how important having a good leader/captain is for any organisation, whether it's in a business setting or in a team sport. It is very rare that a team will ever do well without a very good leader. If you look at the teams who have been strong in previous years, Storm (Smith/Cronk/Slater/Bromwich), Roosters (Cordner/Cronk/Pearce/Friend), Rabbitohs (Sam Burgess/John Sutton/Greg Inglis), Sharks (Gallen/Maloney/Ennis), all these teams have had a captain their team gets behind 100%. Most of these teams also have a very strong leader for both the backline and the forwards. As experience as Alex Glenn and Matt Gillett are, I don't know if they are vocal enough to provide the leadership we need, and Darius Boyd most certainly isn't either.
2. We don't have a strong experienced middle forward (prop/lock). McGuire may have helped, but I think his form has been on a downward slope for 2-3 years.
3. We have the worst spine in the comp. Milford is probably the only person in our spine that would get a run at any other club. That's how dire our situation is.
4. Lack of speed/talent on the edges. With the injury to Jack Bird, and the release of Roberts, our outside edges (centres and wingers) are pretty pathetic. Oates is rocks and diamonds, and the others are all finding their feet.
1. We don't have a leader. As much hate as Boyd has been getting for his performances, the thing that irks me the most is that he is also the captain. His performances are bad enough, but when you consider he is the captain, he most certainly does not lead by example. All research and studies will show how important having a good leader/captain is for any organisation, whether it's in a business setting or in a team sport. It is very rare that a team will ever do well without a very good leader. If you look at the teams who have been strong in previous years, Storm (Smith/Cronk/Slater/Bromwich), Roosters (Cordner/Cronk/Pearce/Friend), Rabbitohs (Sam Burgess/John Sutton/Greg Inglis), Sharks (Gallen/Maloney/Ennis), all these teams have had a captain their team gets behind 100%. Most of these teams also have a very strong leader for both the backline and the forwards. As experience as Alex Glenn and Matt Gillett are, I don't know if they are vocal enough to provide the leadership we need, and Darius Boyd most certainly isn't either.
2. We don't have a strong experienced middle forward (prop/lock). McGuire may have helped, but I think his form has been on a downward slope for 2-3 years.
3. We have the worst spine in the comp. Milford is probably the only person in our spine that would get a run at any other club. That's how dire our situation is.
4. Lack of speed/talent on the edges. With the injury to Jack Bird, and the release of Roberts, our outside edges (centres and wingers) are pretty pathetic. Oates is rocks and diamonds, and the others are all finding their feet.
DigitalDaz
QCup Player
- Mar 18, 2008
- 658
- 426
Change - that's the problem. Too many, too soon.
Heck we are on our third halfback for the year, currently playing O'Sullivan our third best option when the year started. What other team does that?
We've got an entirely new coaching team (its just not Seibold remember).
We've offloaded our most senior forward (McGuire), Kahu, Nikorima, Roberts and now Sua. Four of those guys were long time Broncos, in the system for years, and then shown the door.
When I looked at the team before the Newcastle game - in the sheds - they looked like a lot of lost sheep - wondering around the room, not alot of talk. As opposed the Newcastle team - talking, back-slapping, moving, interacting.
We got a heap of players who hardly know each, playing under a coaching team they hardly know, being led around the park by a three-game halfback and a captain who should just retire.
We could have changed the coach, but left the team. Now, we've changed the coach and the team - and as opposed to Bennett who did the same when he returned to the club from Newcastle, Seibold doesn't have the previous connection with the club or players to lean on.
Heck we are on our third halfback for the year, currently playing O'Sullivan our third best option when the year started. What other team does that?
We've got an entirely new coaching team (its just not Seibold remember).
We've offloaded our most senior forward (McGuire), Kahu, Nikorima, Roberts and now Sua. Four of those guys were long time Broncos, in the system for years, and then shown the door.
When I looked at the team before the Newcastle game - in the sheds - they looked like a lot of lost sheep - wondering around the room, not alot of talk. As opposed the Newcastle team - talking, back-slapping, moving, interacting.
We got a heap of players who hardly know each, playing under a coaching team they hardly know, being led around the park by a three-game halfback and a captain who should just retire.
We could have changed the coach, but left the team. Now, we've changed the coach and the team - and as opposed to Bennett who did the same when he returned to the club from Newcastle, Seibold doesn't have the previous connection with the club or players to lean on.
upthebroncs
NRL Player
- Oct 16, 2016
- 2,555
- 1,608
We clearly need an experienced half. The only problem is that there aren't many available.
FYI I don't consider Milford or Boyd experienced halves.
[automerge]1561956153[/automerge]
Every Super League player off-contract at the end of 2019
May 1, 2019
CASTLEFORD TIGERS
Cory Aston, Mitch Clark, Tuoyo Egodo, Kieran Gill, Will Maher, Greg Minikin.
CATALANS DRAGONS
Jodie Broughton, Kenny Edwards, Tony Gigot, Benjamin Jullien, Samisoni Langi, Thibaud Margalet, Antoni Maria, Lewis Tierney
HUDDERSFIELD GIANTS
Michael Lawrence, Alex Mellor
HULL FC
Gareth Ellis, Bureta Faraimo, Chris Green, Dean Hadley, Jez Litten, Jack Logan, Sika Manu, Mark Minichiello, Mickey Paea, Jack Sanderson, Cameron Scott, Danny Washbrook, Joe Westerman
HULL KINGSTON ROVERS
Danny Addy, Chris Atkin, Josh Drinkwater, James Greenwood, Craig Hall, Tommy Lee, Shaun Lunt, Ryan Shaw, Nick Scruton
LEEDS RHINOS
James Donaldson, Brad Dwyer, Brett Ferres, Cameron Smith
LONDON BRONCOS
Jordan Abdull, James Cunningham, Matt Fleming, Matt Gee, Ben Hellewell, Mark Ioane, Elliot Kear, Eloi Pelissier, Morgan Smith, Alex Walker, Rhys Williams, Luke Yates
SALFORD RED DEVILS
Mark Flanagan, George Griffin, Jackson Hastings, Krisnan Inu, Greg Johnson, Josh Jones, Rob Lui, Ben Nakubuwai, Kris Welham
ST HELENS
Kyle Amor, Luke Douglas, Theo Fages, Ryan Morgan, Adam Swift, Zeb Taia
WAKEFIELD TRINITY
Chris Annakin, Tinirau Arona, Jordan Baldwinson, Ryan Hampshire, Justin Horo, Danny Kirmond, Pauli Pauli, Tyler Randell
WARRINGTON WOLVES
Sitaleki Akauola, Ryan Atkins, Bryson Goodwin, Lama Tasi, Ben Westwood
WIGAN WARRIORS
Joe Burgess, Tony Clubb, Sean O’Loughlin, Dan Sarginson
FYI I don't consider Milford or Boyd experienced halves.
[automerge]1561956153[/automerge]
Every Super League player off-contract at the end of 2019
May 1, 2019
CASTLEFORD TIGERS
Cory Aston, Mitch Clark, Tuoyo Egodo, Kieran Gill, Will Maher, Greg Minikin.
CATALANS DRAGONS
Jodie Broughton, Kenny Edwards, Tony Gigot, Benjamin Jullien, Samisoni Langi, Thibaud Margalet, Antoni Maria, Lewis Tierney
HUDDERSFIELD GIANTS
Michael Lawrence, Alex Mellor
HULL FC
Gareth Ellis, Bureta Faraimo, Chris Green, Dean Hadley, Jez Litten, Jack Logan, Sika Manu, Mark Minichiello, Mickey Paea, Jack Sanderson, Cameron Scott, Danny Washbrook, Joe Westerman
HULL KINGSTON ROVERS
Danny Addy, Chris Atkin, Josh Drinkwater, James Greenwood, Craig Hall, Tommy Lee, Shaun Lunt, Ryan Shaw, Nick Scruton
LEEDS RHINOS
James Donaldson, Brad Dwyer, Brett Ferres, Cameron Smith
LONDON BRONCOS
Jordan Abdull, James Cunningham, Matt Fleming, Matt Gee, Ben Hellewell, Mark Ioane, Elliot Kear, Eloi Pelissier, Morgan Smith, Alex Walker, Rhys Williams, Luke Yates
SALFORD RED DEVILS
Mark Flanagan, George Griffin, Jackson Hastings, Krisnan Inu, Greg Johnson, Josh Jones, Rob Lui, Ben Nakubuwai, Kris Welham
ST HELENS
Kyle Amor, Luke Douglas, Theo Fages, Ryan Morgan, Adam Swift, Zeb Taia
WAKEFIELD TRINITY
Chris Annakin, Tinirau Arona, Jordan Baldwinson, Ryan Hampshire, Justin Horo, Danny Kirmond, Pauli Pauli, Tyler Randell
WARRINGTON WOLVES
Sitaleki Akauola, Ryan Atkins, Bryson Goodwin, Lama Tasi, Ben Westwood
WIGAN WARRIORS
Joe Burgess, Tony Clubb, Sean O’Loughlin, Dan Sarginson
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upthebroncs
NRL Player
- Oct 16, 2016
- 2,555
- 1,608
https://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/george-lawler-hull-kr-derby-3032168
https://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/josh-drinkwater-hull-kr-future-2992407
Two cheap and valuable signings we could make for next year. Both off contract after 2019
(Matt Parcell and Josh Drinkwater)
https://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/josh-drinkwater-hull-kr-future-2992407
Two cheap and valuable signings we could make for next year. Both off contract after 2019
(Matt Parcell and Josh Drinkwater)
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