When do clubs need to develop?

[Sproj]

I am just saying if you're going to talk development you/we/people need to know they lived in Victoria until they were 15 and then moved up here. It's pretty important detail in a development discussion.

Sure, except almost none of those in the list lived in Victoria until they were 15. Exaggerating context is not really a good way to go about a robust discussion is it.

So to provide context:

Jason Akermanis - Lived in Victoria until 9
Aliir Aliir - Lived in Africa until 8
Harris Andrews - Lived in Victoria until the ripe old age of 4
Marcus Ashcroft - Lived in Victoria to that career defining age of 3
Dayne Beams - Lived in Victoria until going grey at the age of 4
Charlie Cameron - Born and Bred in Queensland, moved to WA at the retirement age of 17
Charlie Dixon - Born and raised in Queensland
Jason Dunstall - Born and raised in Queensland
Eric Hipwood - Born in Victoria and moved to Queensland at the already developed age of 3
Mal Michael - Born and bred in PNG, that good ol' AFL heartland, a country in which incidentally is the only one in the world with rugby league as its national sport - moved to Queensland at 15 (so you got this one mate, well done)
Nick Reiwoldt - Lived in Tasmania until 9
Kurt Tippett - Born in the AFL heartland of Sydney and moved to Queensland at the almost dementian age of 2 months old
Michael Voss - Lived in Victoria until 11
Lachie Weller - Born in Tasmania and moved to Queensland at 15 (another one you got, well done to you!)
Dayne Zorko - Born and bred Queenslander

So three players post the age of 11. Enough context for you? How about you provide a list of Victorian rugby league players with the same context.

 

[Dash]

Sure, except almost none of those in the list lived in Victoria until they were 15. Exaggerating context is not really a good way to go about a robust discussion is it.

So to provide context:

Jason Akermanis - Lived in Victoria until 9
Aliir Aliir - Lived in Africa until 8
Harris Andrews - Lived in Victoria until the ripe old age of 4
Marcus Ashcroft - Lived in Victoria to that career defining age of 3
Dayne Beams - Lived in Victoria until going grey at the age of 4
Charlie Cameron - Born and Bred in Queensland, moved to WA at the retirement age of 17
Charlie Dixon - Born and raised in Queensland
Jason Dunstall - Born and raised in Queensland
Eric Hipwood - Born in Victoria and moved to Queensland at the already developed age of 3
Mal Michael - Born and bred in PNG, that good ol' AFL heartland, a country in which incidentally is the only one in the world with rugby league as its national sport - moved to Queensland at 15 (so you got this one mate, well done)
Nick Reiwoldt - Lived in Tasmania until 9
Kurt Tippett - Born in the AFL heartland of Sydney and moved to Queensland at the almost dementian age of 2 months old
Michael Voss - Lived in Victoria until 11
Lachie Weller - Born in Tasmania and moved to Queensland at 15 (another one you got, well done to you!)
Dayne Zorko - Born and bred Queenslander

So three players post the age of 11. Enough context for you? How about you provide a list of Victorian rugby league players with the same context.

You're selling yourself short. Mal Michael moved to Brisbane as a 3 year old.

 

[Sproj]

You're selling yourself short. Mal Michael moved to Brisbane as a 3 year old.

Is that so? I know some of the other guys either personally or through other relationships or obviously being a Lions fan, so was confident on the details, I didn't know that about Mal.

I am looking forward to @1910's response now he has the context he was asking to be included.

 

[Dash]

Is that so? I know some of the other guys either personally or through other relationships or obviously being a Lions fan, so was confident on the details, I didn't know that about Mal.

I am looking forward to @1910's response now he has the context he was asking to be included.

I'm just going by Wikipedia and the AFLQ website, so there's always the chance I'm wrong.

 

[Cult]

How much help did the Broncos get from the NRL to produce juniors in their first 24 years? Seems they've done everything to hinder us at any possible point. Melbourne should be looking at Victoria, visiting schools (I guess schools probably don't want the Munsters/Smiths there anyway) and having a reserve grade team in their actual state.

Why would Melbourne players want to play for them when the only avenue they bother using is being born in QLD, playing for a QLD team and then moving to Melbourne? The NRL giving them a free pass is a **** up too, but very few people have anything nice to say about those that are in charge of this competition.

 

[Mr Fourex]

25 years is really **** all in the grand scheme of history and time........

Even with the AFL comparison in QLD. As far as I can remember.....playing AFL was an option when I went to school.....albeit, in limited numbers and with limited schools participating.

Without knowing for sure....but I strongly doubt that has been the case in Victoria.

I suspect it may have come to life in the last 25 ys (since the Storm become a thing).....but thats a lot different to having the sport engrained in your psyche since you were an infant for decades.......

 

[Sproj]

having the sport engrained in your psyche since you were an infant for decades.......

So you are saying this is representative of all Victorian kids?

 

[Scorchie]

Interesting figures. Problem is though the numbers dont give us any idea of quality. For example, how would the top u16 sides in Victoria fare against the top 5 u16 sides in QLD

I don’t think we will be seeing an under 20s vic team on grand final day in the pre games, that’s for sure!

 

[Wolfie]

How much help did the Broncos get from the NRL to produce juniors in their first 24 years? Seems they've done everything to hinder us at any possible point. Melbourne should be looking at Victoria, visiting schools (I guess schools probably don't want the Munsters/Smiths there anyway) and having a reserve grade team in their actual state.

Why would Melbourne players want to play for them when the only avenue they bother using is being born in QLD, playing for a QLD team and then moving to Melbourne? The NRL giving them a free pass is a **** up too, but very few people have anything nice to say about those that are in charge of this competition.

I suppose the difference is Queensland is a Rugby League stonghold. The numbers of kids playing the game was already huge.

Probably the best way to encourage Melbourne to do more than they currently are is to give them a salary cap break for every Victorian who becomes a first team regular. I guess anyway every team should get that, if you produce your own players from your local areas you should get a cap break anyway after so many appearances so teams cant spend all their cash on top players and fill their squad with not good enough players who they can get a salary cap deduction on.

 

[Wolfie]

I don’t think we will be seeing an under 20s vic team on grand final day in the pre games, that’s for sure!

Thats more the thing i'm curious about. Just what the standard is down there. If thats not competitive then no Victorian team would stand a chance of developing local talent.

 

[Scorchie]

I suppose the difference is Queensland is a Rugby League stonghold. The numbers of kids playing the game was already huge.

Probably the best way to encourage Melbourne to do more than they currently are is to give them a salary cap break for every Victorian who becomes a first team regular. I guess anyway every team should get that, if you produce your own players from your local areas you should get a cap break anyway after so many appearances so teams cant spend all their cash on top players and fill their squad with not good enough players who they can get a salary cap deduction on.

1998-2007 sure. We are 24 years on in this journey with a club owned by a newspaper that could very easily put afl a few pages back off the back page…

 

[Wolfie]

1998-2007 sure. We are 24 years on in this journey with a club owned by a newspaper that could very easily put afl a few pages back off the back page…

It would help.

 

[Big Pete]

How much help did the Broncos get from the NRL to produce juniors in their first 24 years? Seems they've done everything to hinder us at any possible point. Melbourne should be looking at Victoria, visiting schools (I guess schools probably don't want the Munsters/Smiths there anyway) and having a reserve grade team in their actual state.

Why would Melbourne players want to play for them when the only avenue they bother using is being born in QLD, playing for a QLD team and then moving to Melbourne? The NRL giving them a free pass is a **** up too, but very few people have anything nice to say about those that are in charge of this competition.

Not only did the Broncos have the BRL to pilfer off of, they had the whole State of Origin concept which helped create immortals. The Storm did not have anywhere near that base to start from and there's a reason why Perth and Adelaide were preferred options before those brands were deemed unsalvagable.

If you want to say the NRL has failed to expand in Victoria I'm not going to argue. To put the blame squarely on Melbourne is unreasonable and no club has had to invest so much into development pathways.

However the reason they're called Melbourne and not the Sunshine Coast Storm is because the former is far more valuable when it comes to television rights.

 

[Mr Fourex]

So you are saying this is representative of all Victorian kids?

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Yes....at least more so than Rugby League is.

 

[Foordy]

I hate the Storm as much as anyone else on here ... but i put a big portion of the blame on the NRL.

there is literally zero incentives for spending money on development programs ... so why wouldn't the Storm spend their money in areas that already have existing programs (like the Sunshine Coast, Norths, Easts Tigers, etc)

sure, the NRL give you a discount if you keep players on a development contract for 2 years, but in reality, how often would that be taken up? because players far more often than not, earn a top 30 contract after 1 year on the development list.

 

[1910]

I think the AFL excuse is valid, but only because the NRL havent put enough into the game down there to encourage people to take it up. You just cant throw a footy club into an area like Victoria and expect that club to grow the game by itself.

I cant stand the Storm, but i just cant put all the blame onto them for the lack of development across the board down there. What i do think with them though is they probably dont do as much as they could in some respects because they have a players on tap up here.

It's not a funding issue, although I am sure more money would always be wanted. The Storm just tipped in a million to pay for the new Victorian League facility- Andrew's Government was about 14 million.

The Storm's/Victoria NRL program have visited over 600 schools and have seven DO in Melbourne doing God's work and they now have 24 clubs across Victoria and as I have already said 4000 juniors now up 300% in the last 10 years.

Storm have five schools they fund their rugby league program- their PBC of sorts.

There is something else missing, four juniors- one every six years isn't enough but I am not too sure what else you do.

 

[mitch222]

The only development Melbourne do is pilfer other clubs nursery's. I sincerely hope the dolphins run them out of QLD for good.

 

[Xzei]

Id like to know what WA does they seem to generate as much interest as Victoria without a nrl side.