OFFICIAL Isaako released to Titans

[McHunt]

You’ve gone from criticising him / his statistics in his only 15mins at fullback (when the game was well an truly an absolute write-off) to saying you’re worried he might become the whipping boy if he does go back to 1.

Something doesn’t add up here, it seems like a 180 to me.

No, I wasn't criticizing him particularly. I was just reacting to the gushing over his performance compared to Jamayne. He was thoroughly underwhelming in that 15 minutes, and I've seen nothing from him other than a general affection that suggests he would transform the team if shifted to the back.

Right now, he's something of a poster boy, maybe due to some occasional, though impressive, little bursts through heavy traffic. Which coincidentally, Isaako does as well. Except Jamayne has turned his into tries. For what it's worth.

It's just that fullback is the most exposed position on the field. You're the last line of defence. You're exposed to a barrage of high balls. You're continuously punished behind your own in goal. And you're very often the studied target of the opposition's offensive plan.

When you **** up, the French report it.

Herbie, meanwhile, at centre doesn't get this kind of attention. His role is to get the ball from the halves and turn it into a try. As a centre your defensive errors wind up making your winger look bad. How often do our wingers look bad?

All I'm saying is be careful what you wish for. Moving Herbie to fullback will put him in the spotlight. Maybe he'll shine there. I don't know. What I do know is there isn't anything in that 15 minute cameo to provide evidence either way. And certainly not for.

 

[Kooly87]

LOL. No wonder you get your panties in a bunch so often. It doesn't mean that at all.

We're largely getting into people's perceptions here - I'd suggest the majority of the public interpret, rightly or wrongly, that a media exclusive is exactly that, reported first and by just one source. News Ltd no doubt know this public perception is true too and that's almost definitely why they both to highlight it.

 

[McHunt]

We're largely getting into people's perceptions here - I'd suggest the majority of the public interpret, righlty or wrongly, that a media exclusive is exactly that, reported first and by just one source. News Ltd no doubt know this is true too and that's almost definitely why they both to highlight it.

It's a marketing term, and it's not usually applied by the journalist. Journalists don't usually write their headlines, but they would flag whether an interview has come from a press conference (not exclusive) or a one-on-one (exclusive). There are chains of command in the way news is sourced, presented and sold, which differ largely depending on the size of the outfit.

Nonetheless "exclusive" is a marketing term, just like "all-new," which makes me gag a bit.

This message is an "exclusive," by the way. Yet nothing I've said is in any way new or unique.

 

[Kooly87]

No, I wasn't criticizing him particularly. I was just reacting to the gushing over his performance compared to Jamayne. He was thoroughly underwhelming in that 15 minutes, and I've seen nothing from him other than a general affection that suggests he would transform the team if shifted to the back.

Right now, he's something of a poster boy, maybe due to some occasional, though impressive, little bursts through heavy traffic. Which coincidentally, Isaako does as well. Except Jamayne has turned his into tries. For what it's worth.

It's just that fullback is the most exposed position on the field. You're the last line of defence. You're exposed to a barrage of high balls. You're continuously punished behind your own in goal. And you're very often the studied target of the opposition's offensive plan.

When you **** up, the French report it.

Herbie, meanwhile, at centre doesn't get this kind of attention. His role is to get the ball from the halves and turn it into a try. As a centre your defensive errors wind up making your winger look bad. How often do our wingers look bad?

All I'm saying is be careful what you wish for. Moving Herbie to fullback will put him in the spotlight. Maybe he'll shine there. I don't know. What I do know is there isn't anything in that 15 minute cameo to provide evidence either way. And certainly not for.

I didn't think you were being especially critical either, but when you talk about a widely held fan favourite on here you're always going to be flying very close to the Sun.

Personally, I think it seems highly unlikely that Herbie is going to prove a success at Fullback mid season, but that isn't entirely his fault as I doubt he's spent so much as a single training session in the role this year and asking him to move there right now is probably quite unfair.

Sadly, we probably have to just persist with Isaako now as the club seems allergic to recruiting Fullbacks (remember when Corey Allan wasn't worth looking at?) so we may as well look to get the best out of him and leave Herbie to do the things he's already doing well. IF we fail to recruit for 2022 then perhaps pre-season is the time to test Herbie out and do it properly instead of half-assing it with a knee jerk change mid year in a team that's getting flogged.

I have absolutely no idea what level of physical fitness Karmichael Hunt has right now but maybe even just on his muscle memory and self confidence alone he could handle the Fullback job better than anyone else we have available for the balance of this year?

 

[McHunt]

I didn't think you were being especially critical either, but when you talk about a widely held fan favourite on here you're always going to be flying very close to the Sun.

Personally, I think it seems highly unlikely that Herbie is going to prove a success at Fullback mid season, but that isn't entirely his fault as I doubt he's spent so much as a single training session in the role this year and asking him to move there right now is probably quite unfair.

Sadly, we probably have to just persist with Isaako now as the club seems allergic to recruiting Fullbacks (remember when Corey Allan wasn't worth looking at?) so we may as well look to get the best out of him and leave Herbie to do the things he's already doing well.

I have absolutely no idea what level of physical fitness Karmichael Hunt has right now but maybe even just on his muscle memory and self confidence alone he could handle the Fullback job better than anyone else we have available?

I'm very aware of how popular Herbie is, and that's great. I can't even tell whether it's warranted given how hidden he is in the centres. But I can see he hasn't been able to convert this talent to crossing the tryline, and I haven't noticed him flex the skills Jamayne is apparently lacking. So like I've been saying, it seems a bit of wishful thinking. Like he's the hero we need. I'm saying this also might be how to destroy him.

@theshed pointed out David Meade is an experienced fullback who got stuck behind Will Zillman at the Titans. Whether a switch there would be to our benefit I don't know either.

I do know Jamayne is an enormous talent, but his blunders are wearing increasingly thin.

 

[Kooly87]

I'm very aware of how popular Herbie is, and that's great. I can't even tell whether it's warranted given how hidden he is in the centres. But I can see he hasn't been able to convert this talent to crossing the tryline, and I haven't noticed him flex the skills Jamayne is apparently lacking. So like I've been saying, it seems a bit of wishful thinking. Like he's the hero we need. I'm saying this also might be how to destroy him.

@theshed pointed out David Meade is an experienced fullback who got stuck behind Will Zillman at the Titans. Whether a switch there would be to our benefit I don't know either.

I do know Jamayne is an enormous talent, but his blunders are wearing increasingly thin.

I'm actually of the opinion that Isaako could be better hidden in the Centres, similarly to how you've described Herbie actually.

Mead would I'm sure be a competent replacement but probably doesn't offer all that much upside if we're being honest. Maybe a bit of an improvement and a few less errors but I can't see him setting the world on fire either. Maybe just cutting the errors out would be good enough to warrant the change.

Herbie does have some upside but as you've pointed out, that's more theoretical than anything we have a lot of proof of, and as you've pointed out, it has a high chance of failure that could really set the bloke back long term too. I keep coming back to Hunt, who at least has to be in better shape than Boyd was last year and Boyd was actually pretty passable in the role in the back half of last year.

I'm firmly of the opinion that you don't come to the NRL to learn how to play Fullback, or Halfback or Dummy Half etc. These things virtually never work out in the many, many examples we've seen of Coaches trying things like this.

 

[WASSHHH]

No, I wasn't criticizing him particularly. I was just reacting to the gushing over his performance compared to Jamayne. He was thoroughly underwhelming in that 15 minutes, and I've seen nothing from him other than a general affection that suggests he would transform the team if shifted to the back.

Right now, he's something of a poster boy, maybe due to some occasional, though impressive, little bursts through heavy traffic. Which coincidentally, Isaako does as well. Except Jamayne has turned his into tries. For what it's worth.

It's just that fullback is the most exposed position on the field. You're the last line of defence. You're exposed to a barrage of high balls. You're continuously punished behind your own in goal. And you're very often the studied target of the opposition's offensive plan.

When you **** up, the French report it.

Herbie, meanwhile, at centre doesn't get this kind of attention. His role is to get the ball from the halves and turn it into a try. As a centre your defensive errors wind up making your winger look bad. How often do our wingers look bad?

All I'm saying is be careful what you wish for. Moving Herbie to fullback will put him in the spotlight. Maybe he'll shine there. I don't know. What I do know is there isn't anything in that 15 minute cameo to provide evidence either way. And certainly not for.

It was the final 15 minutes in a huge loss. Again, not sure what you wanted to see from him that would prove anything (one way or another).

As I said in my earlier post, how about you give him a chance to prove himself (good or bad). What have we go to lose.

 

[McHunt]

It was the final 15 minutes in a huge loss. Again, not sure what you wanted to see from him that would prove anything (one way or another).

As I said in my earlier post, how about you give him a chance to prove himself (good or bad). What have we go to lose.

The game?

 

[Dazza 92]

Watching one of the worst fullback performances this season (and ironically, one of the better ones from his opposite), i admit i did think of something different from most...

Rather than wishing he gets hooked (which he did, crimanally NOT at halftime) i thought "how many of these young players have actually been improved under Walters coaching...?"

And......um......er........i actually dont know.....

 

[Kooly87]

Watching one of the worst fullback performances this season (and ironically, one of the better ones from his opposite), i admit i did think of something different from most...

Rather than wishing he gets hooked (which he did, crimanally NOT at halftime) i thought "how many of these young players have actually been improved under Walters coaching...?"

And......um......er........i actually dont know.....

Well to be entirely fair to him, I don't think halfway through year one is a fair time to expect significant improvement. I agree, it's been fairly underwhelming so far, but he was handed one of the all time shit sandwiches this year and deserves to at least be given a bit more time to show what sort of impact he's capable of having on the side.

 

[McHunt]

Watching one of the worst fullback performances this season (and ironically, one of the better ones from his opposite), i admit i did think of something different from most...

Rather than wishing he gets hooked (which he did, crimanally NOT at halftime) i thought "how many of these young players have actually been improved under Walters coaching...?"

And......um......er........i actually dont know.....

Good question, but it's not just Walters.

Jamayne has access to at least three highly decorated fullbacks, loitering around the sheds: Lockyer, Boyd and Hunt. If at least one of them hasn't been in his ear there's something deeply wrong. Same with Turpin, having the two Walters brothers.

I get the impression - apropos of nothing - that Kevvie doesn't have a good understanding of the position, or it's not his focus. He seems completely fixated on the halves, and it hasn't worked out at all. I've been saying this for some time - and it's not a popular observation - but what has Allan Langer been doing in his tenure post playing? Because our halves have look shit the entire time he's been working with them.

 

[Dazza 92]

Well to be entirely fair to him, I don't think halfway through year one is a fair time to expect significant improvement. I agree, it's been fairly underwhelming so far, but he was handed one of the all time shit sandwiches this year and deserves to at least be given a bit more time to show what sort of impact he's capable of having on the side.

thats true...so ill change it up some.....what are the chances you think he DOES improve any of these guys come the end of the season?

Maybe the halves? Maybe Staggs is his project child once he returns...?

But i dont know.....im really not seeing how he does it.....

 

[theshed]

I'm very aware of how popular Herbie is, and that's great. I can't even tell whether it's warranted given how hidden he is in the centres. But I can see he hasn't been able to convert this talent to crossing the tryline, and I haven't noticed him flex the skills Jamayne is apparently lacking. So like I've been saying, it seems a bit of wishful thinking. Like he's the hero we need. I'm saying this also might be how to destroy him.

@theshed pointed out David Meade is an experienced fullback who got stuck behind Will Zillman at the Titans. Whether a switch there would be to our benefit I don't know either.

I do know Jamayne is an enormous talent, but his blunders are wearing increasingly thin.

I don’t know what the answer is but I think it is almost certain that despite DD’s comments, the club does not have a obvious internal fullback option for next year.

Herbie deserves a shot only due to the fact that Isaako has blown his. If we had good fullback coming to the club next year, you could put Mead there as a stop gap but as that seems unlikely to be the case, it makes sense to give Herbie a go and hope it happens to work.

Watching Storm again showed how much Hynes would’ve provided to this team. While I don’t think he is elite, what he does offer would’ve complimented our spine next year extremely well. Now that’s off the table I don’t really know what to do.

 

[Kooly87]

I don’t know what the answer is but I think it is almost certain that despite DD’s comments, the club does not have a obvious internal fullback option for next year.

Herbie deserves a shot only due to the fact that Isaako has blown his. If we had good fullback coming to the club next year, you could put Mead there as a stop gap but as that seems unlikely to be the case, it makes sense to give Herbie a go and hope it happens to work.

Watching Storm again showed how much Hynes would’ve provided to this team. While I don’t think he is elite, what he does offer would’ve complimented our spine next year extremely well. Now that’s off the table I don’t really know what to do.

Dufty is the obvious one on the market, though it needs to be pointed out, it's not an accident that he hasn't got a deal next year already. He does a lot of good things, certainly more good things than Isaako does, but he's also far from a complete Fullback and plenty capable of some pretty big errors too. If we went down that path we have to be prepared to wear the bad games too.

 

[Dazza 92]

Good question, but it's not just Walters.

Jamayne has access to at least three highly decorated fullbacks, loitering around the sheds: Lockyer, Boyd and Hunt. If at least one of them hasn't been in his ear there's something deeply wrong. Same with Turpin, having the two Walters brothers.

I get the impression - apropos of nothing - that Kevvie doesn't have a good understanding of the position, or it's not his focus. He seems completely fixated on the halves, and it hasn't worked out at all. I've been saying this for some time - and it's not a popular observation - but what has Allan Langer been doing in his tenure post playing? Because our halves have look shit the entire time he's been working with them.

Makes me wonder.....i mean....whilst acknowledging they are a absolute clusterfuck of a club.....it did not go unnoticed by me just how good of a job John Morris did there at Cronulla...

Phased out the rubbish like Woods, Fifita and Dugan to secondary roles and brought through AND improved guys like Kennedy, Bailey, Rudolph etc....

And there he is without a gig right now.....

Look, been more than 30 years watching this mob; my attitude is we are the biggets club in the league, we demand the best coach. So unless your name is Bellamy, Robinson or even WB, then im laying a more critical eye across anyone else in charge...

Its not reality i know, but thats how i feel. I just knew it when he appointed his brother as a assistant instead of a more experienced former head coach this would end in tears...

You mentioned Langer and our halves......why hasnt Boxhead turned Jake Turpin into a dominant hooker yet? Or at least NRL level...?

Maybe former greats just dont make great coaches full stop....

 

[Dazza 92]

I don’t know what the answer is but I think it is almost certain that despite DD’s comments, the club does not have a obvious internal fullback option for next year.

Herbie deserves a shot only due to the fact that Isaako has blown his. If we had good fullback coming to the club next year, you could put Mead there as a stop gap but as that seems unlikely to be the case, it makes sense to give Herbie a go and hope it happens to work.

Watching Storm again showed how much Hynes would’ve provided to this team. While I don’t think he is elite, what he does offer would’ve complimented our spine next year extremely well. Now that’s off the table I don’t really know what to do.

...we have zero to lose for this season......absolutely...give Herbie a go at fullback....

 

[winslow_wong]

Good question, but it's not just Walters.

Jamayne has access to at least three highly decorated fullbacks, loitering around the sheds: Lockyer, Boyd and Hunt. If at least one of them hasn't been in his ear there's something deeply wrong. Same with Turpin, having the two Walters brothers.

I get the impression - apropos of nothing - that Kevvie doesn't have a good understanding of the position, or it's not his focus. He seems completely fixated on the halves, and it hasn't worked out at all. I've been saying this for some time - and it's not a popular observation - but what has Allan Langer been doing in his tenure post playing? Because our halves have look shit the entire time he's been working with them.

I think Kevvie’s strength is coaching attack. Some of our tries this season have actually looked like top level rugby league plays. Whether being a head coach works out for him... who knows.

 

[McHunt]

I don’t know what the answer is but I think it is almost certain that despite DD’s comments, the club does not have a obvious internal fullback option for next year.

Herbie deserves a shot only due to the fact that Isaako has blown his. If we had good fullback coming to the club next year, you could put Mead there as a stop gap but as that seems unlikely to be the case, it makes sense to give Herbie a go and hope it happens to work.

Watching Storm again showed how much Hynes would’ve provided to this team. While I don’t think he is elite, what he does offer would’ve complimented our spine next year extremely well. Now that’s off the table I don’t really know what to do.

...we have zero to lose for this season......absolutely...give Herbie a go at fullback....

I keep asking: why Herbie, where is the intel that he's a fullback coming from?