POST MORTEM. Cowboys Broncs Grand Final.

[vertigo]

As all have said, question marks over the second half tactics of defending rather than attacking till the end. I reckon you should never stop attacking no matter how far or close you are in front.

Yep, just like we did against the Roosters - we kicked for touch at the right times but still went for it and piled on 31 points.

When defending a lead you should probably have at least an eight point buffer.

 

[mieko]

Yep, just like we did against the Roosters - we kicked for touch at the right times but still went for it and piled on 31 points.

When defending a lead you should probably have at least an eight point buffer.

Spot on. You don't close out games with a four point lead with 25 to go. Oh well, you live and learn

 

[AceAv]

I agree with BP. I don't think that was the goal to close it out.. We just weren't finding any opportunities and were waiting for the cows to force their hand and create an error.

I also took the advice of others here and watched the press conference. Feel a lot more resolved and super confident that we are in great hands going forward.

WB said it best; "it's not just about winning and losing".

There's too much doom and gloom on here that brings the rest of us down. Be proud of our club and it's achievements and don't think you have to win it just so you feel better about them. We are the real deal, we are the fucking Broncos!

 

[Mr Fourex]

Watching it again, I've got to say, I really disagree with this mentality that the Broncos tried to defend a lead with 30 minutes to go. What other option did they really have other than kick it deep?

Great review Pete
Regarding the bolded, "what other options"?
......are you suggesting that kicking it dead over the sideline is the only course of attacking option on a football field......(other than kicking it deep) ??

Plenty of other options......kicking it high (might force a mistake) ...running it.......kicking for the wing.......play attacking football, just as we had been doing for the first 50 mins.

To try and protect a 4 point lead with that much time to go was a mistake.

 

[Big Pete]

......are you suggesting that kicking it dead over the sideline is the only course of attacking option on a football field......(other than kicking it deep) ??

Plenty of other options......kicking it high (might force a mistake) ...running it.......kicking for the wing.......play attacking football, just as we had been doing for the first 50 mins.

It is when all you're doing is defending repeat set after repeat set.

There were seldom few opportunities they found themselves in attacking territory to actually launch a kick and more often than not, they had usually just defended a repeat set and needed the break more than any other team.

Normally, they would have earned a few more penalties and been able to play attacking football. However, the Cowboys just happened to be too good in the ruck and only conceded the one ruck infringement in the second half.

 

[Dexter]

It is when all you're doing is defending repeat set after repeat set.

There were seldom few opportunities they found themselves in attacking territory to actually launch a kick and more often than not, they had usually just defended a repeat set and needed the break more than any other team.

Normally, they would have earned a few more penalties and been able to play attacking football. However, the Cowboys just happened to be too good in the ruck and only conceded the one ruck infringement in the second half.

Too good in the ruck, hehe, nice way of putting it BP. I think they tried to give the penalty at least twice because a quick play the ball would have been too dangerous to risk but even then the refs wouldn't blow it. I guess they were smarter than us because we just kept rolling off when we could have held down that little bit longer.

 

[_wwong]

Well I guess we now have good defence structures in place so next season should be all out attack. Milford and Ben hunt to dominate

 

[Nashy]

Well I guess we now have good defence structures in place so next season should be all out attack. Milford and Ben hunt to dominate

Bennett said in an interview a while back that he hasn't coached the team any attack yet.

 

[Big Pete]

Too good in the ruck, hehe, nice way of putting it BP. I think they tried to give the penalty at least twice because a quick play the ball would have been too dangerous to risk but even then the refs wouldn't blow it. I guess they were smarter than us because we just kept rolling off when we could have held down that little bit longer.

:winky:

We all know what I meant by that...

Here is a list of all the last tackle kicks Brisbane came up with in the second half...

44th Minute - Ben Hunt, 45m inside his own line, finds Lachlan Coote on his chest, Cows open set 22m outside their own line.
46th Minute - Andrew McCullough, 49m out from his own line, finds the in-goal and manages to keep the ball in play, Cows ball 11m outside their own line.
48th Minute - Anthony Milford, 20m out from the Cowboys line, toes the ball through for Oates after Jack Reed is taken out in backplay. Set finishes with a Broncos knock on after Gillett fails to take Hunt's pass (thanks to the attention of JT...whether it was premature is up for debate)
50th Minute - Ben Hunt, 48m out from the Cowboys line, picks up Feldt on the full, Cowboys ball 25m out from their own line.
52 Minute - Ben Hunt, 35m out from his own line, attempts a 40/20, kick rolls over the sideline 25m out (this was the set where Coote caught Boyd with a fore-arm)
54 Minute - Ben Hunt, 45m out from his own line, mid-field bomb, bounces over the sideline 25m out from the Cowboys line
57 Minute - Ben Hunt, 18m out from the Cowboys line, places a cross-kick that is marked in-goal by JT
62 Minute - Ben Hunt, 35m out from the Cowboys line, places a bomb up for Feldt, Cowboys open set on their 12m line.
64 Minute* - Ben Hunt, 40m out from the Cowboys line, places a grubber kick to find touch 10m out from the Cowboys line.
68 Minute - Ben Hunt, 40m out from the Cowboys line, kicks it low at Kyle Feldt, earns a repeat set
71 Minute - Ben Hunt, 40m out from the Cowboys line, kicks it into touch 20m out from the Cowboys line
73 Minute - Anthony Milford, 18m out from the Cowboys line, chips for the goal-line but picks JT out on the full, Cows ball 13m out from their own line.
75 Minute - Ben Hunt, 40m out from the Cowboys line, finds touch 15m out from the Cowboys line
77 Minute - Andrew McCullough, 40m out from the Cowboys line, finds touch 15m out from the Cowboys line


* - Hunt forced into the kick as Kodi balked him from dummy half, forcing Hunt little option.

So really the tactic didn't come about the last 10 minutes when the Broncos were out on their feet. It may have worked had Hunt not dropped Linnett on his head and then lost the ball to Fedlt on the next set.

 

[_wwong]

One thing I've been wondering is why in golden point when you know other team is setting up for field goal, why not have speed men rushing the kicker? Thurston only had Parker and Thaiday running at him and they were never going to get close

 

[bazza]

Lockyer was the best player i had ever seen play the game.

Until JT came along.

All this talk of "he hasnt lead his team to many premierships" is rubbish. One man doesnt make a team. One man cant carry a team to a title.

Lockyer was the best at chiming in when he needed to. He was the best clutch player too, probably will always be the best. But to me, he didnt control games as much as JT can. He was more the player that let his halves partner look after the majority of the game, and he would chime in when he saw fit. Absoutely nothing wrong with this, but to me, JT has more pressure on him as the player controlling the game. His record speaks for itself. He hasnt missed an origin game in 11 years, and of those years we have won 9 series. It's no coincidence. The guy is a freak, and I absolutely believe he is the best player I have ever seen. No doubt in my mind whatsoever. Both players leave Johns for dead imo. Johns had a few dominant years, but he couldnt even lock down the blues halfback jersey.


Whether or not JT is inducted into the immortals before locky or not is not something I care about. I think both of them should be eventually. I dont think JT is overrated however, and all of the people saying the cowboys win was set up by the NRL so they could get their fairytale is just being a bad loser. The broncos did not play well enough to win that game. They shouldnt have been trying to hold a 4 point lead for nearly half of the game. Horrible tactics. The cowboys worked their asses off for that win and totally deserve it. No-one should be trying to take any gloss off that.

I know where your coming from, but I sort of disagree with the comment about Lockyer not controlling games as much as JT and instead letting his halves partner look after the majority of the game... Lockyer was the dominant halve at the Broncos. Lets remember that Lockyer didn't really have a halves partner. Plus, Perry and Wallace were made to look better than they actually were due to the work Locky did with, and without the ball.

For me, Lockyer was the best at controlling a football game without overplaying his hand. JT plays frantic, and tries to do everything, everytime, which may give the impression that he controls a game, but often he just overplays his hand. There are no doubt quality moments from Thurston, but there are also some ordinary moments throughout a game.

Instead, Locky perfected the art of having a sustained, yet steady influence over the course of a match, as well as stepping up in attack or through his magical clutch plays whenever it was required. By not trying to come up with a mircacle play every play meant he had more quality in his work, which may give the impression that Lockyer took a back-seat in most games.

A lot of the stuff that Locky did, was often overlooked because it wasn't flashy, but it was high percentage football. He knew what was required of him, and he knew exactly what the game needed and when it needed it. Locky very rarely took the wrong option. For example, something as simple as picking his spots on the field and kicking early to turn their forwards around is something Lockyer did so well. That's my definition of controlling a match.

Lockyer also had the ability to swing the match in his favour and then close it out from there, something he did better than most. He could kick his team to victory. Lockyer was always able to get the job done.

 

[bazza]

As good as JT is, its ridiculous to make him an immortal now. He's time will come.

There are players who could of been immortals, who have probably missed out due to Johns being named immortal. Players like Meninga, Sterling, and even Langer as well as players further back like Provan have all been part of the immortal debate, but its seems improbable they'll go back after naming Johns, I fear if JT gets named an immortal in the near future, it may overlook some other greats, who have been forgotten since retirement.

In my opinion Lockyer deserves to be made an immortal, definitely before any of JT, Smith, Slater and GI are even considered to be immortals.

If Lockyer isn't named an immortal than that will be the greatest tragedy in rugby league as I believe he is one of, if not the greatest player to play the game, ahead of other modern day greats such as Thurston etc.

 

[Super Freak]

Apparently Reed dislocated his shoulder twice during the game.

Kind of explains why he held off on Morgan.

He is having off-season surgery on it. It's not the shoulder he injured a couple of years ago.

 

[Bucking Beads]

I'm a big JT fan but I've never seen an elite level player at his age shit themselves so hard under pressure. He played his guts out but his kicking game was very average, he barely set anything up, and he he made an error that lead directly to a try. He was noticeably shook leading into the final conversion attempt which he shanked and was lucky to get as close as he did.

He bailed out of 2 possible field goal attempts before dropping the ball on its side and toeing it over. If we went on to win in extra time the game would have been a huge blemish on his career.

You'd never see Locky, Joey, Smith, or Cronk buckle so hard under pressure. Hunt buckled pretty hard too (extremely hard towards the end) but this is his second full season as a first grade player.

It's a fair call and puts Hunts performance into perspective. JT has played over 30 origins and can still be over awed by a GF.

 

[ningnangnong]

I know where your coming from, but I sort of disagree with the comment about Lockyer not controlling games as much as JT and instead letting his halves partner look after the majority of the game... Lockyer was the dominant halve at the Broncos. Lets remember that Lockyer didn't really have a halves partner. Plus, Perry and Wallace were made to look better than they actually were due to the work Locky did with, and without the ball.

For me, Lockyer was the best at controlling a football game without overplaying his hand. JT plays frantic, and tries to do everything, everytime, which may give the impression that he controls a game, but often he just overplays his hand. There are no doubt quality moments from Thurston, but there are also some ordinary moments throughout a game.

Instead, Locky perfected the art of having a sustained, yet steady influence over the course of a match, as well as stepping up in attack or through his magical clutch plays whenever it was required. By not trying to come up with a mircacle play every play meant he had more quality in his work, which may give the impression that Lockyer took a back-seat in most games.

A lot of the stuff that Locky did, was often overlooked because it wasn't flashy, but it was high percentage football. He knew what was required of him, and he knew exactly what the game needed and when it needed it. Locky very rarely took the wrong option. For example, something as simple as picking his spots on the field and kicking early to turn their forwards around is something Lockyer did so well. That's my definition of controlling a match.

Lockyer also had the ability to swing the match in his favour and then close it out from there, something he did better than most. He could kick his team to victory. Lockyer was always able to get the job done.

Reading this post has reminded me just how much I miss watching Lockyer run around for us.

Bloody well said, mate!

 

[sus]

penny drops

have always supported the team thru thick and thin, funnily enough joined this forum (or began lurking) during the 'dark years' to keep abreast of developments that would herald the 2nd coming, but lately with a reminiscing sentiment of a Locky or another great or an era gone by, even last year with Hunt breaking out.

not this year. win lose or draw for most of the season travelling to shitty newcastle or remondis fucking stadium to watch these fellas turn out im our jersey. its just been a pleasure

**** me dead cant wait for 2016

 

[Nashy]

One thing I've been wondering is why in golden point when you know other team is setting up for field goal, why not have speed men rushing the kicker? Thurston only had Parker and Thaiday running at him and they were never going to get close

Because you need to have people defending in case they don't kick, and pass instead. And trying to stay onside too.

 

[john1420]

Huge fan of Thurston, and I have been fortunate enough to watch both his and Locky's entire careers

JT should be made an immortal, in due time

But that time is not now

Locky led his team, state and country to the ultimate prize in a single year, and named best player in the world in 2 positions, which JT hasn't

And I know it's a matter of opinion, but mine is that Locky was a better player overall