Sack Griffin/New Coach Discussion

[Big Pete]

Yep, it's being a trying 12 months for the Broncos.

Sadly there is no light at the end of the tunnel, at least in the immediate future. I'm very disillusioned with Hook's gameplan, it's conservative yet defensively the Broncos are terrible across the park. Structure in football is fine, in fact in modern times it's won a bunch of premierships but it has to allow for good team work which I feel this team is devoid of. Of course, there are times where they where they prove me wrong and they'll piece together some wonderful plays that make sense but then go onto butcher it by doing something stupid like kicking it straight down the winger's throat. It's utterly frustrating because the problem can't be pegged down to factor.

What's really beginning to frustrate me is the post match conferences. Not because they're delusional, Hook has began taking ownership and admitting that the boys aren't good enough. No what annoys me is that Sam says the right things then doesn't do any of them. Essentially, he keeps saying the boys needs to start on the front foot instead of having to chase teams. Fantastic, I agree, the pacing ourselves and then trying with 20 to go has done nothing for us. However, why did you only take one hit up in the first half tonight? Why did you only take 3 in the first half in Origin? Sam, is a talented player, his skills aren't in defence, they're in attack yet he's constantly making over 40+ tackles a game - that shouldn't be his job. Let David Stagg or Mitchell Dodds take care of the dirty stuff ala Peter Ryan & Kevin Campion and allow the likes of Gillett and Thaiday to do what they do best.

There are other frustrations too and I accept that at the end of the day, our roster isn't premiership worthy and that's going to happen. You're not always going to be blessed with the best players in the competition, sometimes, the talent just isn't there and some genetic freak crops up elsewhere. That's life. Sometimes, a superstar team can start their year off with a win and a draw. We've gone through that first hand. However, when it's obvious that our problems can be resolved through good coaching and we continue to make the same mistakes over and over and over again for over 12 months (could argue since 2009 based on this crop of players) then it really is hard to swallow.

I'll continue to support the boys, but if they continue to make the same mistakes then I'll have no problem jumping on the Anti-Hook, Anti-Thaiday, Anti-Macca bandwagons.

 

[rnabokov]

The Raiders first try: nobody tries to catch the ball. The try scorer is unmarked - Norman, Wallace and Glenn and another player standing a metre away watching Hoffman takle Ferguson, not expecting the offload which leads to the try. ???

Their 2nd try: Gillett sprints out of the line, everyone else in the defensive line is flat footed. We know Gillett is prone to do that, and often it brings a good result BUT, where is the cover?

The Lee Try: Hodges moves away from the play the ball, goes the other way leaving Gillett on a running Edrick Lee and where is Norman in cover ????

The Joel Edwards try: the whole team is standing flat footed in defence giving Campese and his runners all the space and time they needed to set up and score. Thaiday stands watches and grabs as Edwards runs past him. ????

Seriously, this is schoolboy garbage. This is a coaching issue insofar as these sorts of TEAM mistakes at this level of football are unacceptable.

 

[Bucking Beads]

Hook good a fairly good response from them at half time but gee we are a lazy football team. Poorly coached because we certainly aren't playing to our strength. Recruitment is a non issue when we aren't even getting the best out of what we've got.

 

[FaithinHook]

[MENTION=8300]FaithinHook[/MENTION]

Thoughts on the game?

Look, I have had a variety of messages sent to me by several members of this forum to my personal inbox over the past 12 hours or so. Some of these messages have been superbly constructed critiques of the performance last nite, whilst some of the other messages have, unfortunately, been personal and insulting attacks ON me. But that's ok, I have a THICK skin.

Now, thanks to members such as BigPete and several others, I have decided to offer a few thoughts. AGAINST my better judgement may I add. I believe it IS always best to let the dust settle IN these types of situations. I know for a fact many of us are still hurting from last nites result and it IS only to easy to say/write things WE dont necessarily mean in thd heat of the moment.

Yes, last nites performance was disappointing in several respects - not least of all our poor start to the gamd. BUT, as Hook mentioned in thr presser, if not for a soft try IN a crucial period, there is no doubt we WERE finishing with a wet sail. Not saying we would have won, BUT the signs were there I believe that there is still self belief amongst the lads in terms of the possibilities still achievable in 2013.

Guys, there IS no doubting the past 5 or 6 weeks have been short of the mark in so far as what WE expect as fans, AND what IS expected from the lads by the coaching staff. In times OF adversity however it is then that we all see what we are really made of. I DO believe we are not yet ready to lay down and surrender. As my online 'handle' suggests, now is THE time to not only have faith in the lads, BUT also the coaching staff and organisation as a whole.

This team is too damn pround to give up and it is NOW when we all need to pull together and support the lads and Hook like we almost certainly have never done so before.

 

[Fozz]

, whilst some of the other messages have, unfortunately, been personal and insulting attacks ON me. But that's ok, I have a THICK skin.

That is quite disappointing to hear. While pms are private messages, there is no reason to abuse anyone for holding a different view.

Whoever has been doing this, pull your head in. Treat your use of pms as you would in a forum post.

 

[rnabokov]

This squad has been together, more than less for enough years to get the simple basics down pat: defensive line speed, eliminating the stupid one-out running in the 1st 2 thirds and have someone calling the plays from an organized middle

 

[Dexter]

Thanks faithinhook, just a small request mate, could you stop with the caps on your words, I don't know about anyone else but I can't read it without emphasising everything in my head.

 

[FaithinHook]

That is quite disappointing to hear. While pms are private messages, there is no reason to abuse anyone for holding a different view.

Whoever has been doing this, pull your head in. Treat your use of pms as you would in a forum post.

Fozz, it IS posters like you which give newbies such as myself the encouragement to continue posting to the board. Thank you for your support in regard to the unfortunate abusive postings I have received over the past 14 hours or so, but in all honesty, it just makes me want to support the lads and Hook even more. As I mentioned previously, it is posters/fans such as you and me who ARE the backbone of this great club in terms of the support we continue to give.

Ta mate again for the encouragement/support, much appreciated.

 

[FaithinHook]

Thanks faithinhook, just a small request mate, could you stop with the caps on your words, I don't know about anyone else but I can't read it without emphasising everything in my head.

Dexter mate, am sorry about that/the heads up. It is a bad habit I HAVE gotten myself into over the years I must admit. Whoops sorry, there I go again heh. Will read through my next posting to make sure I have cap locks off before I press send :thumbup1:

 

[Dexter]

None of this really surprises me, they were always going to struggle this year with this roster, maybe the CEO thinks these guys are top 4 material but he is probably a dead man walking anyways (along with Hook) if things don't improve dramatically. But I couldn't call myself a true fan if I didn't still have a bit of hope. It will take a 1999 type miracle to make the 8 but as a fan, u have to continue to believe, it is what keeps us going. The guys did their best tonite and hopefully they can triumph next week and who knows what it might lead to.

This year is gone mate, my only hope looking forward is that the club publicly recognises that this squad is not going to bring us a premiership and starts to work towards a solution.
Hook said 2015 was where he saw our window for a premiership with this squad and to his credit he has backed the players who he felt would develop and take us there. That is the main reason why no recruiting has been done but this plan is in tatters.

Now the club has to start identifying who to build around and who we should let go as well as identifying priority signings in positions that need better talent. The frustrating part as a fan is not being privy to the clubs intentions, we only get fed the "she'll be right" fluff.

The CEO is IMO doing his job, the football dept is in disarray, they really appear to have been caught out with the failure of the players who were identified as future stars to keep stepping up.

We all have to realise that these things take time but equally it would be nice if the club gave some indication they were changing tact not just releasing PR pieces then resigning all the same players to extensions and long term deals. Actions speak louder.

The coach also has to realise his methods need to improve, we all fully understand the need to have good basics but all the good sides have good second phase and stinging defence and much better bench rotation.

The club really is at a crossroads which the Broncos have not fully had to negotiate before now. Does Anthony Griffin have what it takes to steer us through this? I hope so, but to date nothing I see says yes.

 

[rnabokov]

Look, I have had a variety of messages sent to me by several members of this forum to my personal inbox over the past 12 hours or so. Some of these messages have been superbly constructed critiques of the performance last nite, whilst some of the other messages have, unfortunately, been personal and insulting attacks ON me. But that's ok, I have a THICK skin.

Now, thanks to members such as BigPete and several others, I have decided to offer a few thoughts. AGAINST my better judgement may I add. I believe it IS always best to let the dust settle IN these types of situations. I know for a fact many of us are still hurting from last nites result and it IS only to easy to say/write things WE dont necessarily mean in thd heat of the moment.

Yes, last nites performance was disappointing in several respects - not least of all our poor start to the gamd. BUT, as Hook mentioned in thr presser, if not for a soft try IN a crucial period, there is no doubt we WERE finishing with a wet sail. Not saying we would have won, BUT the signs were there I believe that there is still self belief amongst the lads in terms of the possibilities still achievable in 2013.

Guys, there IS no doubting the past 5 or 6 weeks have been short of the mark in so far as what WE expect as fans, AND what IS expected from the lads by the coaching staff. In times OF adversity however it is then that we all see what we are really made of. I DO believe we are not yet ready to lay down and surrender. As my online 'handle' suggests, now is THE time to not only have faith in the lads, BUT also the coaching staff and organisation as a whole.

This team is too damn pround to give up and it is NOW when we all need to pull together and support the lads and Hook like we almost certainly have never done so before.

The coaching staff have had 13 rounds to teach the lads not to stand flat footed in defence so players like Campese can sit down and have the time and space write a thesis about his next attacking move before putting it on.

This is schoolboy basics - errors which recur each and every game.

Naughty Hook. Bad lads. Everyone go and stand in the corner

 

[Renegade]

As I've said previously in this thread and others, the only time Hook looked competent was when he had an immortal-in-waiting running the show from 5/8th. He commanded the respect, he controlled the play, he kept morale high and he made players work for him and give 100% - no one looks like doing this since Lockyer left.

This isn't a woe is us Lockyer is retired post, it's a, holy shit Hook masqueraded himself as a capable coach the entire time, when he was really just riding the coat tails of Lockyer. No one has improved under his watch since Lockyer left and there are no gameplans to suit the players we have. Let's be honest, there's not really a gameplan apart from complete your set, bomb the wingers, keep tight and tackle. There's no depth, few second phases, no support play, no wraps, no second man play, no outside-inside balls, no repeat sets... there's literally nothing.

 

[Brent81]

Get rid of him NOW!!!!!! I'm tired of his excuses. I'm tired of this club (and him in particular) feeding me crap about their supposed efforts and how much they want to turn it around. Ring Bellamy right now. Get him locked in for 2015 or whenever he comes off contract. The see what players he wants us to keep and what players he wants us to get rid of/chase.

Hope is not a plan. I think the club is currently hoping and not doing much planning.

 

[rnabokov]

As I've said previously in this thread and others, the only time Hook looked competent was when he had an immortal-in-waiting running the show from 5/8th. He commanded the respect, he controlled the play, he kept morale high and he made players work for him and give 100% - no one looks like doing this since Lockyer left.

This isn't a woe is us Lockyer is retired post, it's a, holy **** Hook masqueraded himself as a capable coach the entire time, when he was really just riding the coat tails of Lockyer. No one has improved under his watch since Lockyer left and there are no gameplans to suit the players we have. Let's be honest, there's not really a gameplan apart from complete your set, bomb the wingers, keep tight and tackle. There's no depth, few second phases, no support play, no wraps, no second man play, no outside-inside balls, no repeat sets... there's literally nothing.

Not quite - we have done a few of those very nicely. A few. Precious few. And only in their red zone.

Elsewhere, you're spot on. All the top teams have a passing game with support runners in all thirds. We don't

 

[Culhwch]

This isn't a woe is us Lockyer is retired post, it's a, holy **** Hook masqueraded himself as a capable coach the entire time, when he was really just riding the coat tails of Lockyer. No one has improved under his watch since Lockyer left and there are no gameplans to suit the players we have. Let's be honest, there's not really a gameplan apart from complete your set, bomb the wingers, keep tight and tackle. There's no depth, few second phases, no support play, no wraps, no second man play, no outside-inside balls, no repeat sets... there's literally nothing.

This is certainly the fear I have in all this. On the performance of the team across the second half of last year and the first half of this year, I have to draw one of two conclusions:

1) Hook is out of his depth and has no idea how to right the ship, and is persisting with a tired and ineffective gameplan as it's the only thing he knows.
2) Hook is trying to implement positive changes, but for whatever reason he has lost the respect of the players and they just don't care.

I'd hope it's the first in truth as it's more easily fixed by replacing the coach. If a second coach in a row has lost the playing group, then that doesn't paint the current crop of players in a fantastic light, and there's no telling whether a coaching change would have a lasting effect, if any at all.

 

[FaithinHook]

Get rid of him NOW!!!!!! I'm tired of his excuses. I'm tired of this club (and him in particular) feeding me crap about their supposed efforts and how much they want to turn it around. Ring Bellamy right now. Get him locked in for 2015 or whenever he comes off contract. The see what players he wants us to keep and what players he wants us to get rid of/chase.

Hope is not a plan. I think the club is currently hoping and not doing much planning.

No no no! This is the kind of knee-jerk reaction clubs such as Parramatta are famous for. Not us! Who says the club is not doing any planning?! You can take this as fact - the club IS planning for the future. We have the nucleus, I believe, of a very formidable lineup. I firmly believe we are short maybe of 1, possibly 2 key positional signings only. We do not need a 'marquee' signing - we already have several strike/marquee players (Hodges, Hoffman, Hannatt, Parker to name 4). What we need is a couple of second-tier, depth players, particularly in the front row, where we can build on what we already have.

Why go chopping and changing the dynamics of the team now. Do you think dropping/sacking any of the lads now is going to have a positive effect on team morale?! :grrr:

 

[Renegade]

Not quite - we have done a few of those very nicely. A few. Precious few. And only in their red zone.

The problem is, if we have done oh so few, then they're probably mistakes and not intended. The fact we do not do these consistently enough show little variety in our attack, and subsequently, little difficulty for the opposition in shutting us down.

Edit: FaithinHook is seriously a troll, can we boot this guy? How exactly will it help this board when people are already abusing him because it's clear he's not here for serious discussion? If trolls are allowed can we all shit up this forum with random aliases, at least some of them might be amusing.

 

[Culhwch]

Dropping players for a lack of form can't possibly make things worse. Yes, morale may be damaged, but I'd rather have a team full of players with hurt feelings playing well because their jobs are on the line, rather than a team full of players content to phone it in because they are a protected species.

In your opinion, FIH, what is this nucleus of a formidable team?