Sam Thaiday Judiciary Hearing

[tkday]

You can't hurt a ref by hurling abuse at him, but if other players start getting physical with the ref then there's potential. We have a change of refs etc. this year. Lets see how they handle the other cases as the season goes on. It will be interesting. If other players don't get charged when they touch a ref then I will be spitting chips.

 

[lynx000]

We will just have to agree to disagree my friend, because my view is that you risk creating an unfortunate precedent unless a player is charged when they touch a referee. I do not believe the NRL or indeed the governing body of most sports want to risk that, hence the black and white rule. In any event, it is very difficult to try and get inside someone's head to determine what their intent was. How many times do we hear the familiar, `he is not that type of player, it is not his go'.

 

[lynx000]

Browny, I was not saying that they should be charged, what I referred to was the refs dealing with verbal abuse on the field by using the sanctions available to them. If players started getting regularly penalised, the coaches would ensure that they spoke to refs in the right way.

 

[Anonymous person]

If the referee and captain have a chat, and the captain pats him on the back in a "no worries, understood" kind of fashion, charge him.

IMO yes, charge them.

dont touch the ref. why would you pat the ref on the back? the referee is like a police officer - what they say goes, theyre certainly not going to change their mind because you argued with them, and you never have a reason to touch them unless they put their hand out and want to shake hands at the beginning/end of the conversation.

 

[broncos4life]

You can't hurt a ref by hurling abuse at him, but if other players start getting physical with the ref then there's potential. We have a change of refs etc. this year. Lets see how they handle the other cases as the season goes on. It will be interesting. If other players don't get charged when they touch a ref then I will be spitting chips.

Feelings can be hurt

 

[Browny]

Browny, I was not saying that they should be charged, what I referred to was the refs dealing with verbal abuse on the field by using the sanctions available to them. If players started getting regularly penalised, the coaches would ensure that they spoke to refs in the right way.

I get what you're saying but the way a lot of the refs talk to players leaves a lot to be desired ie Suttor, not excusing the players have an obligation to behave in a respectful manner but the game prides itself on the passion and we can't make it too sterile

 

[lynx000]

I get what you're saying but the way a lot of the refs talk to players leaves a lot to be desired ie Suttor, not excusing the players have an obligation to behave in a respectful manner but the game prides itself on the passion and we can't make it too sterile

I agree with you about that. That is something that should be addressed by Anderson in his role.

 

[Coxy]

And the problem is it's a one way street. Referees can disrespect players, no punishment. Player taps a ref on the shoulder, they can get suspended.

 

[QUEENSLANDER]

As soon as you allow grey areas, you put the ref in danger imo. Black and white like it is is the best call

 

[Browny]

Still wishing that Hayne, Bird or Gallen knock Suttor the **** out. Kill 2 birds with one stone.

The 2 minute deliberation sounds to me like they had already decided prior to going into the hearing. Shit how long did it take for the JT farce the other year?

 

[lynx000]

And the problem is it's a one way street. Referees can disrespect players, no punishment. Player taps a ref on the shoulder, they can get suspended.

Once again, I agree with you about that, and there should be consequences for the referees if they do not improve the manner in which they interact with players. I simply do not know what the processes are behind the scene, if in fact someone does speak to them if there is a complaint, or what review processes are in place for their performances. If there are none, then it is a failing in the system that should be addressed. As I noted above, the only way to ensure that there is a change for the referees (if particular refs have a problem) is for there to be consequences of bad performance or poor communication.

 

[lynx000]

As soon as you allow grey areas, you put the ref in danger imo. Black and white like it is is the best call

Yes, that is my view. The issue probably really is not at NRL level, where you are dealing with professional refs and professional players. You would hope that both of these would be able to work their way through a player/ref discussion without any significant problems. The issue with any form of discretion or grey area involving the touching of officials is at a more junior level where you might have a 17-18 year old ref adjudicating over 12-16 year old players without the same level of impulse control as professional players have. A lot of sports are already having difficulties in attracting people to take on official roles, in my view we do not want to give anyone the idea it is appropriate (in some circumstances) for a player to touch an official (even just to innocently emphasis a point).

 

[Porthoz]

I agree with Thaiday's charge because regardless of the fact that he didn't mean to be aggressive when he tugged at the refs shirt, he was arguing with him. Of course, there needs to be common sense and the notion that a player should be charged for shaking a ref's hand or patting him on the back is at the very least idiotic. The same goes for accidental contact obviously.

What does piss me off is that although Thaiday was charged correctly, he copped a loading from a completely different matter in 2011 and because he argued this new charge, has now 50 pts on his record, which means any new charge in the future will rub him out for another match.
That needs to end. Only apply the loading to similar charges, and don't rub a player out for something this silly!

The other problem is that the punishment doesn't fit the crime. Compared to the punishments for other infractions, this is not something a player should be suspended for, and a fine should suffice.

Of course, the fact that the Storm benefitted from yet another Bellyache cheating trick doesn't help. Recognition from the refs boss about and the fact that Thaiday was the victim of it himself should be a mitigating factor in the handing of the "sentence", and I think that's what the Broncos were coming from when they argued the charge.

 

[Anonymous person]

Of course, there needs to be common sense and the notion that a player should be charged for shaking a ref's hand or patting him on the back is at the very least idiotic. The same goes for accidental contact obviously.
....
Of course, the fact that the Storm benefitted from yet another Bellyache cheating trick doesn't help. Recognition from the refs boss about and the fact that Thaiday was the victim of it himself should be a mitigating factor in the handing of the "sentence", and I think that's what the Broncos were coming from when they argued the charge.

i really dont think some of you guys understand what "cheating" is. pushing the boundaries of what the referees will allow is not cheating, and this is what the Storm do. any coach worth their paycheque should be doing it.

on your first point, i disagree - take "common sense" out of it. black and white is all thats needed. did you intentionally touch the referee in any way shape or form? if yes, go directly to jail. some people here seem to think patting the ref on the back is fine going by "common sense", whereas i wouldnt dare do that to an official in even my oztag or indoor soccer competition. its "common sense" IMO not to touch a referee/official. you dont intentionally touch the referee, ever, unless they are inviting you to (ie. a shake of the hand). thats common sense IMO.

i do agree that its ridiculous how the loading thing works though. loading should only be for similar offences.

 

[broncos4life]

i really dont think some of you guys understand what "cheating" is. pushing the boundaries of what the referees will allow is not cheating, and this is what the Storm do. any coach worth their paycheque should be doing it.

on your first point, i disagree - take "common sense" out of it. black and white is all thats needed. did you intentionally touch the referee in any way shape or form? if yes, go directly to jail. some people here seem to think patting the ref on the back is fine going by "common sense", whereas i wouldnt dare do that to an official in even my oztag or indoor soccer competition. its "common sense" IMO not to touch a referee/official. you dont intentionally touch the referee, ever, unless they are inviting you to (ie. a shake of the hand). thats common sense IMO.

i do agree that its ridiculous how the loading thing works though. loading should only be for similar offences.

I didn't read your whole rant but deliberately holding someone back is cheating, not just pushing the boundaries.

You could have shortened that speech by simply saying "cheating is cheating... Unless it is the brain child of one C Bellamy... In which case it is a stroke of coaching genius"

 

[Anonymous person]

the player was already being held, he just took a bit longer than usual to break from the scrum. thats not cheating, its pushing what the referees will allow.

unless you call every single thing that results in a penalty "cheating". id use the word "cheating" for things like their salary cap breach.

 

[Porthoz]

Not saying it isn't smart, but I still call it cheating, as it is a deliberate attempt to violate the rules or regulations.

I definitely don't agree that every coach should be doing this, nor should unsportsmanlike or unethical behaviour or actions be encouraged in any way at any time!

 

[Anonymous person]

so pretty much every rugby league player is a cheater, since every player would have given away multiple penalties. gotcha.