Seibold General Discussion

[lynx000]

I'm happy with Seibs and am certainly going to give him more than 8 rounds to judge him. If we are still playing like this next season then I will call it a failure.

I do want to call bullshit on a few things though.

1. This insistence that we have a similar squad so should be at least as good, that's simply not true. This squad has lost so much experience, it needed too IMO as Thaiday etc. was past it and while McGuire is still good we needed his money to retain these young guys, but still that experience is all gone. People talk about how experience is essential yet don't think the lack of it in this squad is an issue, go figure.

2. This shit we keep hearing about this team is a failure because they were expected to be top 4. How does what the media think mean anything? They are basically the most ill-informed and lazy analysts in any sport. They looked at where we finished on the ladder, a few good games from rookie forwards and went 'herpa derp, top 4". They didn't take into account the lack of structure this team has played with for years, the fact that we still didn't have a halfback, the experience that would be lost and the fact that these forwards will take time.

3. This team is rebuilding. People can say they aren't, or that 'the Broncos don't rebuild' or whatever other bullshit they want but that's not the case. The front office has clearly looked at the overall trajectory and realise we need to go through some pain to ultimately get better.

a) We finally have a halfback, we finally have a halves combination that compliment each other. For nearly every other team this is basic but for whatever reason it has taken over a year for the Broncos to arrive at that conclusion. Dearden is young but using this year for him to develop in the top grade and with Milford will pay off 10 fold.

b) Boyd is cooked. I love Boyd and he is one of my favourite players on and off the field but his body has let him down. I do not subscribe to this bullshit about it being his effort or any of that other crap but his body will not let him perform at the level required for fullback and he should never have been signed to this length of contract. This has weakened our spine compared to last season.

c) This team is learning structure for the first time, and that is going to take time. You can still see it in games. We have periods of fluency in attack and good shape but then when things get tough we revert back to the one out hitups and prayers for individual brilliance that we have had for years. It will take time to break those habits. This is not a criticism of Bennett but his style of coaching has crippled this team. His style can work and obviously has and he has 7 premierships to prove that but this team doesn't have the players in key positions to make it work. He should have realised that and fair play to him perhaps he did and was working on getting those players before the club decided to move him on. We will never know but I am happy to give him the benefit of the doubt there.

d) On paper in terms of results this team has gone backwards but we still had these issues the last couple of years. We still had shit defense last year, we still had major attitude problems which were largely covered over by results in games we probably should have won and Bennett's ability to get teams up which I believe is second to none. Even at our best last year it still resulted in us scraping into the 8 only to have our arse absolutely handed to us, at home in one of the most humiliating games I have witnessed in quite a while.

If people still maintain this team didn't need a rebuild in both personal and overall strategy then I don't know what else to say.

4. This constant comparison to Seibs and Bennett is just pointless. They are at opposite ends of their career and as of right now Bennett is better than Seibs in almost every aspect, obviously, and so he should be. You wouldn't look at a kid that has just come on to the tennis circuit who comes up against Djokovic and say "oh well, Djokovic won that easily this guy should just give it away now. Seibs needs time and this team needs time which is why they moved the 70 year old on and gave Seibs a 5 year contract.

Sorry for the long post but this is some points I have been wanting to say for a long time and it needed to be said.

Great post B4L, sums up my position perfectly. I totally agree with you.

 

[Dee]

No guarantees, this is sport, this is life. There are no guarantees. If you want guaranteed success wait until grand final day each year and jump on whoever looks the best.

Exactly. I agree with you. There are no guarantees for success or anything so we have every right to be pissed right now at how we are performing because, what if this is just the way it is for many years moving forward? It might change for the better (hope so) or it might not, no one knows so I say, let every fan react however they wish right now in the moment because right now is all we really have and no, I'm not Eckhart Tolle, lol.

 

[Renegade]

How is it? We went from the grand final to 2nd week of the finals to destroyed in the first round of the finals. Without even looking at the performances and other factors (something that you routinely also do not do) that is clearly going backwards.

We had leaders in the team. Hodgo would chew your ear off if you weren't putting in or making dumb errors. Thaiday was still putting in. Parker was still leading from the front. The drop off in experience is massive as you pointed out in one of your recent posts, but I still get the impression we are treating them with kid gloves on the basis that they are young.

Leaders aren't born, they're moulded. We need to stop shielding them, throw them in the furnace and see who wants to stand up. If no one does, sign a rugged veteran. Someone like James Graham would be fucking brilliant for our pack.

 

[broncsgoat]

You’re not really interested in actually having a mature discussion about this, are you?

I didn't create this. It's funny though.

Not sure what you're message is about though. I've been fairly restrained in my criticism (itt anyway).

 

[Wolfie]

I'm actually willing to give Seibold the benefit of the doubt as long as things start changing. We are now into his sixth month here. If he can't get this group used to his playing methods in that time something is wrong. They don't have to have it perfected, but it should be reasonably well drilled by now.

8 games in is enough time to see who is working and who isn't. For all his effort and good displays, it's clear Bird isn't great at left center. Move him to fullback and move Boyd to left center. It will remove a lot of burden from his game and he can still be a good player there for us. Bid thrives on having the ball. Roberts and Issako need a lot of work as a pair. Neither are performing.

Next thing for me is the forwards. Start Fifita and Gillo back row, Haas, Lodge and Carrigan as middle forwards. Bring TPJ and Flegler from the bench for impact, Joffa as the solid forward, and either Glenn or Sua as bench player 4. Macca we are probably stuck with for now

 

[broncos4life]

I didn't create this. It's funny though.

Not sure what you're message is about though. I've been fairly restrained in my criticism (itt anyway).

Restrained? **** me I would hate to see you off the leash.

In any case that wasn’t what my post said, you don’t appear to be wanting to consider other points made or discuss rather just having a tantrum and posting memes because not everyone sees things from your POV.

 

[broncsgoat]

Restrained? **** me I would hate to see you off the leash.

In any case that wasn’t what my post said, you don’t appear to be wanting to consider other points made or discuss rather just having a tantrum and posting memes because not everyone sees things from your POV.

Tbh mate I didn’t see your long post before you made that comment.

 

[PNG Broncos fan88]

What a long list of tired excuses, this is getting depressing.

 

[Alec]

He made the first obvious change - breaking up Milf and Kodi. Now he's gotta move Boyd from fullback soon too. Then we can be sure that he's really thinking of ways to improve the side.

 

[Broncs_Fan]

I’ve been highly critical of Seibold - but telling him his future is as a 9 off the bench was the right one. Nikorima can’t control a game so he’s not a 7. If he was going to be unhappy coming off the bench then it’s for the best he moves on.

As other people have said - the next step to getting better is axing Boyd.

 

[lynx000]

Exactly. I agree with you. There are no guarantees for success or anything so we have every right to be pissed right now at how we are performing because, what if this is just the way it is for many years moving forward? It might change for the better (hope so) or it might not, no one knows so I say, let every fan react however they wish right now in the moment because right now is all we really have and no, I'm not Eckhart Tolle, lol.

Also a good post and fair play as well.

 

[theshed]

If there is one niggling thing that does worry me a little about Seibs is that I get the impression he is perhaps relying on the games stats and performance numbers a little too much.

I can't really put my finger on the problem but we look like a team without any actual 'feel' for the game.

Its as if now we are just trying to meet a set of performance numbers as individuals and discarded or lost any instinctive play at all.

Did Siebold say in the press conference that that was their best defensive effort so far? If he did he must have some good weed.

Exactly what I was trying to get at in my post. He said something about the effectiveness of tackles and said the % which was 90 odd from memory. Something he’s mentioned needed improvement in previous post loss presser.
Previously he used this stat as an example of “its an execution issue not a processes issue”.

You could almost hear it in his voice that this defensive stat he was so reliant on improved to where he was aiming for and yet we had the worse loss of his career, and maybe he was realising you can’t base your whole coaching approach on statistics and kpi’s. Maybe rugby league has intangibles that you can’t learn from a Harvard seminar.

Wayne is the closest thing I still have to an idol, but even I was excited about the appointment of Seibold. As a fan of sport science, he really appealed to me with the things he was saying and his approach to coaching. Maybe there’s more important aspects of coaching than stats.

 

[Dee]

Also a good post and fair play as well.

What alot of people on here fail to understand is, we are allowed and it's okay to look at things differently and disagree. We all want the Broncos to succeed and I'm glad some understand this.

 

[lynx000]

Exactly what I was trying to get at in my post. He said something about the effectiveness of tackles and said the % which was 90 odd from memory. Something he’s mentioned needed improvement in previous post loss presser.
Previously he used this stat as an example of “its an execution issue not a processes issue”.

You could almost hear it in his voice that this defensive stat he was so reliant on improved to where he was aiming for and yet we had the worse loss of his career, and maybe he was realising you can’t base your whole coaching approach on statistics and kpi’s. Maybe rugby league has intangibles that you can’t learn from a Harvard seminar.

Wayne is the closest thing I still have to an idol, but even I was excited about the appointment of Seibold. As a fan of sport science, he really appealed to me with the things he was saying and his approach to coaching. Maybe there’s more important aspects of coaching than stats.

And those things will develop with Seibold, and if they don't, he will fail and will lose his job. That is the thing about all of the navel gazing that goes on on this site, no one is more heavily invested in the ultimate success of the Broncos than Seibold is.

He had a further year on his contract with Souths, he had an established mature team, he was being offered an upgraded contract, it would have been easy to stay put. He chose not to and put everything on the line. He is not a stupid man, he knows he has to make this team work or it is his neck on the line. I can see some signs of what he is working towards and he is starting to make changes to the team which I hope to see continue.

 

[Jedhead]

Too right there is more to coaching than stats. Stats only should be used to flag positions of performance. It's how you address those positions that counts.

You are coaching human beings out there. Emotions, resilience and the drive to be a winner will never be found in statistics.

Siebs is only a young coach learning. Hopefully this season teaches him the importance of blending stats with man management skills.

 

[theshed]

And those things will develop with Seibold, and if they don't, he will fail and will lose his job. That is the thing about all of the navel gazing that goes on on this site, no one is more heavily invested in the ultimate success of the Broncos than Seibold is.

He had a further year on his contract with Souths, he had an established mature team, he was being offered an upgraded contract, it would have been easy to stay put. He chose not to and put everything on the line. He is not a stupid man, he knows he has to make this team work or it is his neck on the line. I can see some signs of what he is working towards and he is starting to make changes to the team which I hope to see continue.

I mean this in a completely sincere way, but what signs are you seeing?

 

[tommy]

I mean this in a completely sincere way, but what signs are you seeing?

I guess the most obvious would be the inclusion of a classic halfback.

 

[Huge]

The thing is, this squad scraped into the 8 last season and people will deem the season to be a success because thats the so called minimum for this club. What it doesn’t show is that the attitude has been terrible for a long time and was trending downwards. For me it all finally self destructed when the dragons flogged us in the finals last year. The squad hasn’t changed much at all and those mental scars are now on full show. If Bennett was here it’d be the same results. Some of these players are cooked and seibold really walked into a shit show at the worst possible time.

Huh? We finished on 32 points, equal second and one game behind equal first and three games clear of ninth!!!