Short Kickoffs and Drop-Outs

[Big Del]

I like them if everyone’s absolutely on the same page. No one was within cooee of Herbie when he tapped it to the grass. You need to have players all around it.

I’d go further and suggest setting up for a short kick but then drill it long to mix it up. But when in doubt, safety is always most important.

How do you set up differently for a short kick off ?
Every one is behind the goal line and spaced ready to defend . What can you do differently ?

 

[pennywisealfie]

Short drop outs? Every time. The other team end up on your line anyway by the end of the set if you boot it long. Might as well try to get the ball back.

 

[winslow_wong]

How do you set up differently for a short kick off ?
Every one is behind the goal line and spaced ready to defend . What can you do differently ?

Stack a few more players around where the ball will land.

 

[Dexter]

Hate the short drop outs unless you have to get the ball back, like the short kick off but I would do it differently especially if there was time left.
I would go low and hard at the sideline just beyond the 10 mtr line with the winger putting pressure on.
I used to do it a lot back in the day and it made the players on the sideline shit themselves. Success rate easily North of 50%

 

[Super Freak]

There's merit behind it.

Teams prefer to attack outside of the 20 rather than inside the 10. These days it's easier for a good defence to hold out a team when inside the 10 so they are more willing to take the chance of a short drop out. If they get it back great and if they don't, they're willing to back their defence. And if it doesn't go 10, I'm willing to bet 90% of the time taking the two will be the option taken which isn't a big deal.

 

[Big Del]

Stack a few more players around where the ball will land.

Then if you don`t get the ball there is a massive overlap on the other side .
And ,, your fucked as they score in the far corner .

 

[winslow_wong]

Then if you don`t get the ball there is a massive overlap on the other side .
And ,, your fucked as they score in the far corner .

it’s a high risk play regardless. Look at what happened on the weekend.

 

[Alec]

I'm a big fan and Broncos have generally been very successful with it in 2023. I dunno what happened in the Grand Final, but if someone was ready for the bat back (as they should have been), we would have called it a massive play and the Broncs probably would got a lot of confidence out of it.

 

[BroncsFan]

I don't like the Broncos threads discussion, so I wanted to ask this more generally.

Do you like them? If so, why?

I hate them. They are studpid hugh risk, and 9/10 come down to absolute chance.

The Walker brothers obviously saw some success in 2015 and there abouts when absolutely no other team were doing them, fast forward to today, teams expect it, and opposition teams often end up with the ball. Worst case, one day it might cost a team a grand final.

Why is is so popular now? It's useless.

Yes... but they need to be trained properly to make the execution more consistent for the team. If we just kicked it long to penrith then they would've spent the entire time camped on our line through Cleary's short kicking game.

The short drop out from Reynolds to Herbie was absolutely perfect... huge hang time and fell right on top of Hebie's head at the 10m line.

Unfortunately instead of catching it he bats it backwards and no one is there ready for it... this happens a lot with our team when it comes to bat backs. Remember Titans scoring on the last play of the game, because Patty bats it back to no one off the short kick off.

We go in with the plan of "bat ball backwards + ??? = our ball"... they're not aware of where their team mates will be to know where the bat back should be directed.

I don't recall our plans to generally be bat backs on short drop outs anyway... and realistically that shouldn't be the plan, because you're effectively knocking it back into your ingoal creating a huge risk. Usually our wingers will just leap and try to catch it themselves on the short drop outs.

We don't seem to have much of a plan when it comes to actually batting it backwards

This is not just on short drop outs and kick offs... compare our attempts on cross field kicks to teams like rorters, storm, panthers, etc. they will kick across field with the only intent to knock the ball backwards to someone waiting behind the line. The defensive line is then disrupted, because they've collapsed on the cross field kick, which means the edges are open. The bat back itself is also very safe when it comes to avoiding knock ons... hence why it's become popular. Stephen Crichton does them all the time for those mid range cross field kicks. It just needs to be trained by the rest of the players that Crichton is going for it and will knock it directly behind him.

We barely do cross field kicks as it is, but if we do it will be Selwyn usually getting blocked or having an attempt to catch it himself. Teams will kick to their second rowers who will just be looking to bat backwards... we have athletic backrowers that never get used that way, and Walsh who would be a fucking nightmare off the back of bat backs in broken field play.

On short drop outs if trained and executed correctly it can basically nullify the opposition's forced drop outs altogether... it would also bring confidence to the defensive line if a drop out is conceded, because we will give ourselves a good chance of getting the ball back. It would become a relief if a kick goes behind, because you just bat it dead and then, if you train it well enough, give yourself a better than 50% chance of getting it back, and all pressure is released.

If the defence do get the ball back from the short drop out one tackle will be lost catching the ball and being tackled straight away, a second tackle is then required for a settler to the sticks. Our defensive line can then be set to defend a couple more tackles on the goal line and see if they want to go for the forced drop out again.

If we were able to execute them correctly in the GF, then it would've given us a good chance to break the pressure that penrith were putting on and get the ball back, instead of conceding them and hoping Reynolds can pull off a miracle kick to the sideline that penrith were ready for.

 

[ningnangnong]

It would be interesting to see for the whole competition, but if anyone’s interested in the Broncos’ 2023 dropout stats (in every game before the grand final) they are below:

• They kicked 29 dropouts in total: 19 were short (up to 25m but usually 10-20m) and 10 were long.
• Of the short dropouts, the Broncos regained possession 7 times in that play (37% of the time).
• Of the long dropouts, they regained possession twice (bounced overhead).

Of course this doesn’t consider what happened in the remainder of the set. I think only 1 short dropout resulted in a penalty against the Broncos, but I would have to confirm this.

Very interesting stats, thanks for sharing @Jimmy.

Where did you find them? I'd be keen to see the statistics for the NRL overall when it comes to short drop-outs and how often they are successful in regaining possession.

 

[Jimmy]

Very interesting stats, thanks for sharing @Jimmy.

Where did you find them? I'd be keen to see the statistics for the NRL overall when it comes to short drop-outs and how often they are successful in regaining possession.

Procrastination drove me to do it myself today - I just pulled all instances of a dropout from each game’s ‘Play by Play’ rundown on the NRL website and skipped through match replays to watch them all. It wasn’t much fun to do retrospectively so I didn't venture into non-Broncos games. As far as I know there isn’t a database with this info...

 

[ningnangnong]

Procrastination drove me to do it myself today - I just pulled all instances of a dropout from each game’s ‘Play by Play’ rundown on the NRL website and skipped through match replays to watch them all. It wasn’t much fun to do retrospectively so I didn't venture into non-Broncos games. As far as I know there isn’t a database with this info...

Bloody hell mate, that's some effort!

I'm sure many clubs would have staff that keep track of statistics such as this. That kind of knowledge makes a huge difference in the game today.

 

[Xzei]

maybe someone at the game can confirm but i was under the impression that it was blowing a gale for the majority of the second half and that was the reasoning behind the long low flat dropout and the couple of short ones?

 

[ningnangnong]

maybe someone at the game can confirm but i was under the impression that it was blowing a gale for the majority of the second half and that was the reasoning behind the long low flat dropout and the couple of short ones?

It started blowing hard just as the momentum turned Penrith's way (ie after Herbie threw it to no one).

It was a bloody strong wind, the kind you get before a massive storm blows in.

 

[Nashy]

37%. But we tried it in a GF? **** it off, it's a useless tactic.

 

[Xzei]

It started blowing hard just as the momentum turned Penrith's way (ie after Herbie threw it to no one).

It was a bloody strong wind, the kind you get before a massive storm blows in.

Were we running into it or with it from memory?

 

[ningnangnong]

Were we running into it or with it from memory?

We were going into it. It was behind the Panthers... it's like it was meant to be for them.

 

[Xzei]

We were going into it. It was behind the Panthers... it's like it was meant to be for them.

Dont blame arey for the options he took pushing shit up hill trying to kick long lol the miss knockback tho it on the left hand players mising there asdignment