[Confirmed] Ben Barba signs with Cronulla

[Porthoz]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

@Anonymous person

There was a lot of reasons that Barba wasn't even remotely good this year, I'm sure the injuries and weight gain didn't help his cause, but as ivan just said, for him to get even close to what he did in 2012 he needs to be in pristine condition and somehow magically find a team that has nothing but bigs who all offload and a coach that is willing to devise an entire structure around getting him the ball in space.

It's just not going to happen dude, it's way too much to invest into a player who may never be the same again.

Except that this is a falacy. While the monster pack, and the way the Dogs played did help, most of his tries and actions came from individual brilliance at the back, especially kick returns.

Whether he returns to his old form or not, is indeed a question mark, but the same goes for Boyd. And if Bennett was able to get both players to their best, Barba would be a much better option.

 

[Alec]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

Sharks pack isn't anywhere as skillful as the Dogs one was. Neither is ours. Graham is a better ball player than a lot of current halves and then Kasiano, Pritchard, Eastwood etc were all great in that area too.

 

[Unbreakable]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

Whether he returns to his old form or not, is indeed a question mark, but the same goes for Boyd.

As much as everyone thinks Bennett is blinded by his friendship with Boyd, I honestly don't think he would've cleaned house like he did if he wasn't 100% confident in Boyd getting back to premiership winning form.

I have faith in both of them, and until they prove me wrong, I always will.

 

[Ari Gold]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

AP - I presume that like me you think Milford should be fullback. If that's the case, are you arguing Barba could be great for us at five-eight? Because I personally think he's a shit option. The only reason I'd play him there would be as a placeholder for Taylor or Nikorima.

To whoever said Boyd is good at finding the line, or is at least reasonable at it, is totally wrong in the context of this argument. Boyd has played 136 games at fullback at NRL level for 35 tries. Barba scored more tries than that over the space of the 2011-2012 seasons. 35 in 136 is basically 1 in 4 games. That is an awful record. I can't think of a single fullback in the NRL with a worse strike rate -- maybe Perrett if you're lucky. There are most definitely second rowers with better records.

The majority of Boyd's tries come from the wing, be it outside Inglis at Origin level or when he started with us. He's good at finishing on the wing, but he won't play wing for us. And the reason he won't score a lot of tries as a fullback is that he is a lousy support player. I can almost guarantee you that Milford and Gillett will outscore Boyd this year.

 

[Anonymous person]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

@Anonymous person

There was a lot of reasons that Barba wasn't even remotely good this year, I'm sure the injuries and weight gain didn't help his cause, but as ivan just said, for him to get even close to what he did in 2012 he needs to be in pristine condition and somehow magically find a team that has nothing but bigs who all offload and a coach that is willing to devise an entire structure around getting him the ball in space.

It's just not going to happen dude, it's way too much to invest into a player who may never be the same again.

I'm starting to really think that you guys firstly didn't watch many bulldogs games in 2012, and secondly haven't even watched the 11 minute highlights video of Barbas 2012 lol.

having a "monster forward pack" or a coach devising structures around you means jack-shit when the other team boots the ball downfield and Barba carves them up and runs the length of the field by himself to score. he didnt just do this once, or twice, or 3 times - he did it pretty much once a week, either scoring himself or putting someone else in.

Seriously - go watch the video now, then come back and tell me he was only good in 2012 because of the coaching and the forwards.

AP - I presume that like me you think Milford should be fullback. If that's the case, are you arguing Barba could be great for us at five-eight? Because I personally think he's a **** option. The only reason I'd play him there would be as a placeholder for Taylor or Nikorima.

I think Milford should be fullback, yes. Barba and Milford could switch it up on the fly, and Barba at 5/8th can work with Hunt being the dominant half.

Since Milford is going to play 5/8th no matter what though, Barba should have been our fullback.

 

[Financeguy]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

Barba will come back to hurt us if he gets his speed back. With his speed came the confidence to back himself over those length of the field try's.

Whether it was injury or the beefcake loading diet Griffin had him on, he was a yard or 2 off his 2012 pace with us. I kept waiting for the game where he would find that extra gear but it never came.

Without that electric speed, i consider Barba to be only an above average fullback and an average 5/8th.

 

[Danoz Direct]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

Sharks pack isn't anywhere as skillful as the Dogs one was. Neither is ours. Graham is a better ball player than a lot of current halves and then Kasiano, Pritchard, Eastwood etc were all great in that area too.

I think ours could be they have just been discouraged to do it.

 

[Porthoz]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

We certainly have a few skillful forwards in our team, such as Thaiday, McGuire or Gillett. Hannant was pretty handy as well btw...

 

[Anonymous person]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

Well I hope you're not expecting our forward pack to start busting out the ballplaying now under Bennett lol. The first thing Bennett does is eliminate all that stuff from forwards games. Always has, always will.

Well second thing, behind bringing Baby Boyd along with him.

 

[Unbreakable]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

I'm starting to really think that you guys firstly didn't watch many bulldogs games in 2012, and secondly haven't even watched the 11 minute highlights video of Barbas 2012 lol.

having a "monster forward pack" or a coach devising structures around you means jack-shit when the other team boots the ball downfield and Barba carves them up and runs the length of the field by himself to score. he didnt just do this once, or twice, or 3 times - he did it pretty much once a week, either scoring himself or putting someone else in.

Seriously - go watch the video now, then come back and tell me he was only good in 2012 because of the coaching and the forwards.

At which point did I say he wasn't brilliant in 2012? I've admitted in nearly every post about Barba that he was insanely good that year, nobody can deny it, even if he didn't have that forward pack and coaching (Although apparently Des had a LOT to do with how he played each week) he would've scored those amazing length of the field tries.

The point is AP, you're living in the past, Barba was unreal in 2012, Barba was average in 2013, Barba was below-average in 2014.. What's next on the list? ISC? Japanese Union?

I'll honestly eat my hat if he goes to the Sharks and carves up again, but at this stage I'm genuinely not worried about him magically regaining 2012 form somewhere else.

 

[Dazza 92]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

The season tis long and hard.....the fact that both Boyd and Milford "can" play other positions well in addition to the ones that Bennett has them earmarked for is a bonus.

You never know, it may very well be a case due to injury or lose of form that both Milford and Boyd are switched around, Boyd may go to the wing and start scoring heaps of tries and Milford may carve teams up like he did at Canberra (and like we wished Barba could have..?)

In a NRL seaosn, i think it is wise to have options available to you. Both of our new buys certainly offer that to the coach..

 

[ivanhungryjak]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

Except that this is a falacy. While the monster pack, and the way the Dogs played did help, most of his tries and actions came from individual brilliance at the back, especially kick returns.

Whether he returns to his old form or not, is indeed a question mark, but the same goes for Boyd. And if Bennett was able to get both players to their best, Barba would be a much better option.

Well, you probably can't prove this either way with stats but it's not a fallacy because the forwards lay a platform by tiring the opposition, running them around and tiring them, destroying their defensive structure, etc, etc. Then a player like Barba can run amok knowing the defence won't be as set or as mobile.

It's like the old saying, the forwards always lay the platform for the backs to do their business.

 

[Anonymous person]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

At which point did I say he wasn't brilliant in 2012? I've admitted in nearly every post about Barba that he was insanely good that year, nobody can deny it, even if he didn't have that forward pack and coaching (Although apparently Des had a LOT to do with how he played each week) he would've scored those amazing length of the field tries.

The point is AP, you're living in the past, Barba was unreal in 2012, Barba was average in 2013, Barba was below-average in 2014.. What's next on the list? ISC? Japanese Union?

you said this:

for him to get even close to what he did in 2012 he needs to be in pristine condition and somehow magically find a team that has nothing but bigs who all offload and a coach that is willing to devise an entire structure around getting him the ball in space.

that is downplaying how good he was in 2012, attributing a large part of it to things other than Barba himself.

 

[Unbreakable]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

that is downplaying how good he was in 2012, attributing a large part of it to things other than Barba himself.

Not at all actually.. the first thing I said is he needs to be in pristine condition, i.e - fix his weight and ankles, if he does that and is put in a structure that gives him the freedom to roam and do what he wants, he may get close to 2012. But it's very unlikely.

 

[Kimlo]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

you said this:



that is downplaying how good he was in 2012, attributing a large part of it to things other than Barba himself.

Let me ask you AP, what do you think Boyd can offer as a player? Do you rate him in the top 8 fullbacks of the competition? What do you believe he excles at?

 

[Anonymous person]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

Let me ask you AP, what do you think Boyd can offer as a player? Do you rate him in the top 8 fullbacks of the competition? What do you believe he excles at?

In no particular order, but all higher than Boyd:

Inglis
Slater
Stewart
Milford
Barba
Dugan
Tedesco
Moylan
Morgan
Tomkins
Hayne

That places him at least 12th IMO. Do you disagree with any of those (other than Barba obviously since you think hes shit)?

I don't believe he excels at anything other than being relatively safe under the highball. He doesn't make many 1-on-1 try savers, hes not a good backup runner, hes not lightning quick, doesnt have much in the way of playmaking skills, not much of a kicker. Hes pretty good at tackle busts, but not so much line breaks. Hes really really really good at being where he needs to be to score tries when he plays on the wing though.

 

[Porthoz]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

In no particular order, but all higher than Boyd:

Inglis
Slater
Stewart
Milford
Barba
Dugan
Tedesco
Moylan
Morgan
Tomkins
Hayne

That places him at least 12th IMO. Do you disagree with any of those (other than Barba obviously since you think hes shit)?

I don't believe he excels at anything other than being relatively safe under the highball. He doesn't make many 1-on-1 try savers, hes not a good backup runner, hes not lightning quick, doesnt have much in the way of playmaking skills, not much of a kicker. Hes pretty good at tackle busts, but not so much line breaks. Hes really really really good at being where he needs to be to score tries when he plays on the wing though.

I am 100% behind this.

I would add Michael Gordon to the list of FB's I have ahead of Boyd, and also Kahu, although the latter only on potential, as he hasn't done anything at NRL level to prove it.

 

[Unbreakable]

Re: [RUMOUR] Ben Barba to Cronulla

Dugan is playing centre, Milford is playing five-eighth, Hayne is playing NFL, Barba will probably play five-eighth for Sharks

My order for Fullbacks in the NRL for 2015 -

1.) Greg Inglis (Souths)
2.) Billy Slater (Storm)
3.) Brett Stewart (Eagles)
4.) Matt Moylan (Panthers)
5.) Sam Tomkins (Warriors)
6.) Darius Boyd (Broncos)
7.) Michael Morgan (Cowboys)
8.) James Tedesco (Tigers)
9.) Roger Tuivasa-Sheck (Roosters)
10.) Sam Perrett (Bulldogs)
11.) Josh Hoffman (Titans)
12.) Michael Gordon / Ben Barba (Sharks)
13.) Sione Mata'utia (Knights)
14.) Adam Quinlan (Dragons)
15.) Jack Wighton (Raiders)
16.) Reece Robinson (Eels)