I hate the media!

[Kimlo]

To some of the posters in this thread:

As the Four Corners reporter Sarah Ferguson pointed out: "A woman involved in degrading group sex can still be traumatised whether she consents or not." Clare told the program she felt powerless to stop what was being done to her by a "long line" of players. "I thought I was worthless and I thought I was nothing. And I think I was in shock. I didn't scream and they used a lot of … mental power over me and, and belittled me and made me feel really small like I was just a little old woman."

Source: SMH: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/morality- ... tml?page=2

It is one thing to look at these sorts of events in legalastic terms of consent in the context of the (masculine derived construction) of the Law, but what about the moral and ethical context?

Johns (and others) knew exactly what they were doing. Johns was 30 and married. No-one gave a toss about the consequences of their actions on the hearts and minds of anyone.

As far as I am concerned, there is practically zero focus placed on developing male emotional IQ in the social construction of gender, as is clearly evident in episodes such as this.

The opposite side of this tarnished coin is the disgusting “Beauty Myth†perpetrated on girls and women. I know it well. My daughter has been ravaged by an Eating Disorder since her early teens. She was bullied mercilessly at school for years.

Of course, it's all her fault - she consented to going to school.

So because the girl say they treated her like this, it is taken as fact? Matt said she was a "willing participant" and even encouraged them so obviously the girl has zero lack of integrity to willingly participate then go out 7 years later claiming she was intimidated. But hey, lets believe everything said by someone who wants to kill those players (or the only famous one) and said she wants to ruin their lives. There is no chance someone who would be willing to kill you and who wanted to ruin your life would be telling a lie to get you in trouble [icon_wink
(btw, I don't mean that, but it amazes me how some take the girls word as absolute fact and anything Johns' has said is a lie...)

 

[rnabokov]

To some of the posters in this thread:

As the Four Corners reporter Sarah Ferguson pointed out: "A woman involved in degrading group sex can still be traumatised whether she consents or not." Clare told the program she felt powerless to stop what was being done to her by a "long line" of players. "I thought I was worthless and I thought I was nothing. And I think I was in shock. I didn't scream and they used a lot of … mental power over me and, and belittled me and made me feel really small like I was just a little old woman."

Source: SMH: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/morality- ... tml?page=2

It is one thing to look at these sorts of events in legalastic terms of consent in the context of the (masculine derived construction) of the Law, but what about the moral and ethical context?

Johns (and others) knew exactly what they were doing. Johns was 30 and married. No-one gave a toss about the consequences of their actions on the hearts and minds of anyone.

As far as I am concerned, there is practically zero focus placed on developing male emotional IQ in the social construction of gender, as is clearly evident in episodes such as this.

The opposite side of this tarnished coin is the disgusting “Beauty Myth†perpetrated on girls and women. I know it well. My daughter has been ravaged by an Eating Disorder since her early teens. She was bullied mercilessly at school for years.

Of course, it's all her fault - she consented to going to school.

So because the girl say they treated her like this, it is taken as fact? Matt said she was a "willing participant" and even encouraged them so obviously the girl has zero lack of integrity to willingly participate then go out 7 years later claiming she was intimidated. But hey, lets believe everything said by someone who wants to kill those players (or the only famous one) and said she wants to ruin their lives. There is no chance someone who would be willing to kill you and who wanted to ruin your life would be telling a lie to get you in trouble [icon_wink
(btw, I don't mean that, but it amazes me how some take the girls word as absolute fact and anything Johns' has said is a lie...)

As I mentioned about my daughter ...

It would be a great lesson for us tough guys to become girls and see what life's like in a “real†man's world.

 

[Kimlo]

To some of the posters in this thread:

As the Four Corners reporter Sarah Ferguson pointed out: "A woman involved in degrading group sex can still be traumatised whether she consents or not." Clare told the program she felt powerless to stop what was being done to her by a "long line" of players. "I thought I was worthless and I thought I was nothing. And I think I was in shock. I didn't scream and they used a lot of … mental power over me and, and belittled me and made me feel really small like I was just a little old woman."

Source: SMH: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/morality- ... tml?page=2

It is one thing to look at these sorts of events in legalastic terms of consent in the context of the (masculine derived construction) of the Law, but what about the moral and ethical context?

Johns (and others) knew exactly what they were doing. Johns was 30 and married. No-one gave a toss about the consequences of their actions on the hearts and minds of anyone.

As far as I am concerned, there is practically zero focus placed on developing male emotional IQ in the social construction of gender, as is clearly evident in episodes such as this.

The opposite side of this tarnished coin is the disgusting “Beauty Myth†perpetrated on girls and women. I know it well. My daughter has been ravaged by an Eating Disorder since her early teens. She was bullied mercilessly at school for years.

Of course, it's all her fault - she consented to going to school.

So because the girl say they treated her like this, it is taken as fact? Matt said she was a "willing participant" and even encouraged them so obviously the girl has zero lack of integrity to willingly participate then go out 7 years later claiming she was intimidated. But hey, lets believe everything said by someone who wants to kill those players (or the only famous one) and said she wants to ruin their lives. There is no chance someone who would be willing to kill you and who wanted to ruin your life would be telling a lie to get you in trouble [icon_wink
(btw, I don't mean that, but it amazes me how some take the girls word as absolute fact and anything Johns' has said is a lie...)

As I mentioned about my daughter ...

It would be a great lesson for us tough guys to become girls and see what life's like in a “real†man's world.

[eusa_eh

 

[tryhard]

Matthew Johns just as his brother did, focused the whole thing around himself, what he had done to his family etc.
Really in this interview he should have totally focused on 'the girl' at the center of the whole thing. His apology to her and how he was devastated at what group sex consenting or not can ruin a persons life( if not even end it). A young immature 19yr old kids. I only hope she never ever hears what he had to say in the interview.

How horrific to see his wife almost throwing up and running out of the interview at the end. Made me for one cry. Just as hearing that young girl broken and screaming how much she hated these blokes and wanted to shoot them did. Trauma and hatred certainly came to the fore at that point.

Cannot believe the women on here, some mothers of young girls who jumped to the conclusion this girl is a slag and probably just regretted it after the event. One in particular the Mum of a young girl. Gosh I do hope that her daughter never gets into any kind of situation with a man or men. Then of course that would be close to home so probably she may have a different reaction.

It is time for the other players to put their hands up. Where is the team bonding thing now? Let a mate suffer and lay low. Some of these blokes are still in the NRL and one is the Captain of a team. (not saying those particular players were involved)

 

[OXY-351]

Rape often starts from something consensual.

What? Like going in to the toilets with 3 other guys?

Ahh, but that's ok, because she isn't traumatised, nothing non-consensual must have happened.

People deal with things differently. Have a look at armed robbery for instance. Some victims involved in armed robbery are traumatised for days/months/years, while others have no long lasting negative effects from it, or no effects at all, because everyone deals with the stress of such situations differently.

So based on your logic, if the victim isn't traumatised, then nothing untoward went on, and the perpetrator shouldn’t be punished?

LOLZICOPTERPOPS at that logic.

 

[mrslong]

I thought he shirked the question to be honest (and apparently so did Tracey Grimshaw who said so on the radio), of course he can't come out and say she was unwilling, because he would be putting himself and his mates on the chopping block. But that's just me.

No-one is saying he should be in prison, but I think the outcome that has happened is in the best interest of the game and his wife and kids.

 

[OXY-351]

When you see the way that Charmanne chick and her friends act around/towards footy players, it's no wonder they think they are gods gift to women. These women are the ones who don't respect themselves and are treating themselves like pieces of meat. The NRL players are simply treating them the way they are asking to be treated

 

[OXY-351]

No-one is saying he should be in prison, but I think the outcome that has happened is in the best interest of the game and his wife and kids.

I think he's been made a scapegoat because out of all the alleged rape cases in the past 10 years, he is probably now (given his coachign and TV roles) the highest profile star to be involved. The public is sick of it, and they want him to be made an example of.

If he's going to get sacked, so should Stewart, Laffranchi, Hunt, Boyd, Thaiday, The Bulldogs players and any other NRL player who has EVER been involved in an alledged sexual assault.

Are the NRL or clubs going to do this. No way in hell, because if they did, they'd lose some of the games biggest names, and where would the game be then? Matthew Johns is an easy scapegoat.

 

[ronnyd]

If she's not psychologically traumatised she was fully consensual and despite maybe regretting doing it, it hasn't hurt her.

Big difference. But I don't expect an ignorant 18 year old like yourself to have any idea or concept of trauma.

Not sure what your point is Ari. This woman has suffered far more than Johns has, despite losing his job. He and his teammates are responsible for that. At some point it crossed a line and they either ignored or didn't see the signs that that was the case.

Why must the act be non-consensual for the victim (or participant) to be traumatized (or vice versa)?? PTSD and emotional trauma are just about the most subjective medical diagnosis there are.

The thing is nothing is known about this girl, anything could have happened to her in the last seven years (or preceding the event) to cause emotional disturbances. I think if she is allowed to come out and publicly attempt to 'ruin' someones life, she should be made to reveal more about her own situation.

 

[mrslong]

When you see the way that Charmanne chick and her friends act around/towards footy players, it's no wonder they think they are gods gift to women. These women are the ones who don't respect themselves and are treating themselves like pieces of meat. The NRL players are simply treating them the way they are asking to be treated

Yeah exactly, add to that the Male Ego and they think they can get away with anything to any women, but they can't.

I reckon this should be the new rugby league theme song....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zv9jUffQKxI

 

[Nashy]

I'll give my two cents (Great say the admins).

Matty Johns has ben hung out to dry, yet he hasn't done a thing wrong. The woman involved agreed to go home and screw two footy players. This happened, and of course all the other team mates came in and decided to give her a ride.

Instead of going after Matty Johns, who didn't do anything, why not go after the club or the NRL. Why should he lose his career for consensual sex.

If Nine has fired him and they are hiding it behind the "I stood down because I know I'm wrong", surely they would have a case to answer for unfair dismissal.

If it's such a big deal, why haven't the police re-opened the investigation. Hell, why did they close it, it's high profile investigations like this that should be left to go cold, so when the oppotunity to re-investigate it comes, it's not going to mean moving the Earth to look into it.

I'll acknowledge the problem in the game right now, and I'll acknowledge that some people will think poorly of the game because of Matty Johns, all because the media are targeting him, for having consensual sex.

Now today they are saying he should name the other players involved. Why? What's the point? He's lost his job, his career, and his family are again going through something they didn't want to. All because some slag blamed him.

It's not right, and I can't stand Nine's double standards with him and his drugged up brother.

I feel sorry for Matty Johns, he's taken the fall and had no chance to put his hands out to break it.

 

[OXY-351]

Matty Johns has ben hung out to dry, yet he hasn't done a thing wrong.

See this is the problem though. People are saying he did something wrong, in a moral sense, not a legal sense though. He probably did, but if we are going to start punishing people for doing things other view as morally wrong, then that opens up a fairly big can of worms because what you class as morally wrong is purely subjective and based on your own view points.

I don't think homosexuality is morally correct. Does that mean channel 9 should never have employed Ian Roberts to act on Underbelly?

I'd like to know if channel 9 standing down/sacking Johns based on these events is even legal. Have they actually sacked him, or just stood him down? Perhaps they don't want to sack him because they either know it's not legal, or they only plan to do it in the short term until it all blows over, and then gradually bring him back on air.

 

[gUt]

I don't exactly feel sorry for Johns, moreso for his wife and kids and for the fans of Rugby League. Still if this whole affair is finally going to shake the players and club officials up then maybe some good will come of it.

 

[Chumbason]

To some of the posters in this thread:

As the Four Corners reporter Sarah Ferguson pointed out: "A woman involved in degrading group sex can still be traumatised whether she consents or not." Clare told the program she felt powerless to stop what was being done to her by a "long line" of players. "I thought I was worthless and I thought I was nothing. And I think I was in shock. I didn't scream and they used a lot of … mental power over me and, and belittled me and made me feel really small like I was just a little old woman."

Source: SMH: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/morality- ... tml?page=2

It is one thing to look at these sorts of events in legalastic terms of consent in the context of the (masculine derived construction) of the Law, but what about the moral and ethical context?

Johns (and others) knew exactly what they were doing. Johns was 30 and married. No-one gave a toss about the consequences of their actions on the hearts and minds of anyone.

As far as I am concerned, there is practically zero focus placed on developing male emotional IQ in the social construction of gender, as is clearly evident in episodes such as this.

The opposite side of this tarnished coin is the disgusting “Beauty Myth†perpetrated on girls and women. I know it well. My daughter has been ravaged by an Eating Disorder since her early teens. She was bullied mercilessly at school for years.

Of course, it's all her fault - she consented to going to school.

So because the girl say they treated her like this, it is taken as fact? Matt said she was a "willing participant" and even encouraged them so obviously the girl has zero lack of integrity to willingly participate then go out 7 years later claiming she was intimidated. But hey, lets believe everything said by someone who wants to kill those players (or the only famous one) and said she wants to ruin their lives. There is no chance someone who would be willing to kill you and who wanted to ruin your life would be telling a lie to get you in trouble [icon_wink
(btw, I don't mean that, but it amazes me how some take the girls word as absolute fact and anything Johns' has said is a lie...)

As I mentioned about my daughter ...

It would be a great lesson for us tough guys to become girls and see what life's like in a “real†man's world.

I see your point mate, but just as you seem to be only open to the idea that it's the man's fault whenever girls get into trouble, I look to the other side. Everyone in here is going on about how powerless she was and intimidated she was... I spoke to my wife about it and we both agreed that if anyone had the power it was her. A young chick in a room full of doey footy players, telling them who she would have sex with and who she wouldn't, would have all the power in the room. Can you imagine the her sending one bloke away in preference of another and all in front of his mates. I tend to think she is either the local bike or something very near to it, and got off on ordering the players around like kids and being complettly in charge of the situation. I doubt she was too drunk to speak, I doubt she was unwilling and I very much doubt that this is anything more than a big case of regret and looking for someone to blame.

 

[TLCC]

OXY-351 and ronny are a very sad reflection on today's society, hopefully they are in the minority! Johns dodged the hard questions and there was no way in hell he could say anything different to her consenting if he didn't want to be in the shit with police and his mates!

As has been stated over & over again, the psychologist attributed the PTSD to this incident nothing else.

OXY the way someone acts does not give anyone the right to treat them in a disgusting, degrading manner. They should have the self control to walk away from a situation rather than take advantage. Not sure why you continually want to compare this to other incidents that we don't know the details of and look for every excuse for men to treat females with contempt. Obviously its not only the NRL that need educating on acceptable behaviour and attitudes towards women.

Nashy I agree that Matthew Johns has taken all the blame, while the other players seem to have escaped punishment. Nine and the NRL had no choice but to take a stand as he is a public figure and failure to do so would be seen as condoning the behaviour. I just hope today's footballers get it through their head that it is not on as I am totally sick of these stories.

 

[mrslong]

I don't exactly feel sorry for Johns, moreso for his wife and kids and for the fans of Rugby League. Still if this whole affair is finally going to shake the players and club officials up then maybe some good will come of it.

+1

 

[ronnyd]

OXY-351 and ronny are a very sad reflection on today's society, hopefully they are in the minority!

I am a sad reflection of today's society becuase I want to know more about the situation (beyond the accusations of a blurred out face) before passing judgment?? :roll:

 

[Chumbason]

A woman was on sky this morning, she's something to do with the league and is talking about the other players are now facing rape charges...WTF!

Aren't we meant to be innocent 'till proven guilty? or is it now guilty 'till proven innocent? Her and Tracy Grimshaw want to get off thier high horse and stop slagging off at these players and ruining thier lives when they have no way of knowing the truth. The cops have looked into it and the players were cleared, or do we just throw that out the window because an upset woman has made a statement?

I am sure she is now less than proud of what happened, but that does not mean someone has to pay for it. This notion that it is never anyone's own fault, this society that now believes that there is always someone else to blame when the result of something is not what we had hoped for is just pathetic.

I can fully understand that this rot has played on her mind and will do for years, but IF she was willing and IF the cops looked into it and said she WAS found to be willing, then that's it. If traumatises her after the fact, then that is in no way her fault, but it is her load to carry and NOT that of the others involved. She needs to get the help and care of her friends and family and I hope she can put her life back together, but to wreck other people's lives because she has a fairly heartwrenching case "buyer's regret" 7 years down the track, is not fair to them or their families.

If one or ten people agree to do something, then one or however many find that they have remorse after the fact, I can't see how that is then automaticlly the fault of the others.