International rugby league

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Nashy

Nashy

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I personally don't have an issue with the bolded bit ... and i liked the initial change where if the player wasn't selected by Australia they were free to play for the nation of their descent ... but IMO, they've taken it too far, where they can play Origin, then choose which nation they want to represent.

Take the choice away, and we sort it out. Either they don't play Origin and are not eligible, this bit is important, take the choice away, or they play Origin, but still have to play for their own nations.

Either way, Australia needs to stop being allowed to pick Islanders at the detriment of the International game. There are lots of solutions, but some sacrifice of the biggest nation in the sport need to be made.
 
Fitzy

Fitzy

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Why would you want to do that?

They are both australian(who grew up in that state they play for) and Samoan.

It's easy to say when you have a mono culture.
That’s the exact issue. You ask them what they are and they say Samoan or Tongan or Fijian with the majority never having lived a day there. Haas said it perfectly, I have lived in Australia all my life, I am an Aussie. They are fucken Aussies with Samoan heritage and have grown up in a Samoan culture (or Tongan, Fijian etc). That’s fine and that’s cool. If that’s how they identify go ahead. But we have players who aren’t afforded that luxury who first say they are Qlders and Aussies and they have 0 hope of ever representing such a team. Fucken 0. The reality is if you apply origin eligibility laws to internationals almost every single player would not be able to play for those nations. So for them to be able to have the opportunity to play in such a team they should have to give something up (origin). You are seemingly mis-interpreting that their culture is also not their nationality. I can respect that they wish to align themsleves as that but if they can’t consider themselves Australians which they truly are despite having lived here their entire lives why do they deserve to represent AUSTRALIAN STATES. The tier system for the last 5-6 years has been fucken ludicrous. How is a Tongan or a Samoan now anymore deserving to play origin than a kiwi who passes eligibility for our states or Victor Radley who moved off to England. These people had to make the decisions to forego ever playing for there state (for those who had that desire as well) in order to play for the nation of there choice. So don’t ever give me this culturally ignorant crap EVER. These players who are eligible to tier one nations from young ages have to make such difficult decisions that shape their careers and even there identity. They’re tough decisions to make but it’s time for all these Tongan and Samoan players to stop having their cake and eating it too. They have to choose what is more important. It’s become a fucken farce. Can’t have Tongans and Samoans representing a rep side that feeds to the Australian team just as an Australian player would never be able to represent a Samoan island rep team if such thing existed.
 
Mustafur

Mustafur

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That’s the exact issue. You ask them what they are and they say Samoan or Tongan or Fijian with the majority never having lived a day there. Haas said it perfectly, I have lived in Australia all my life, I am an Aussie. They are fucken Aussies with Samoan heritage and have grown up in a Samoan culture (or Tongan, Fijian etc). That’s fine and that’s cool. If that’s how they identify go ahead. But we have players who aren’t afforded that luxury who first say they are Qlders and Aussies and they have 0 hope of ever representing such a team. Fucken 0. The reality is if you apply origin eligibility laws to internationals almost every single player would not be able to play for those nations. So for them to be able to have the opportunity to play in such a team they should have to give something up (origin). You are seemingly mis-interpreting that their culture is also not their nationality. I can respect that they wish to align themsleves as that but if they can’t consider themselves Australians which they truly are despite having lived here their entire lives why do they deserve to represent AUSTRALIAN STATES. The tier system for the last 5-6 years has been fucken ludicrous. How is a Tongan or a Samoan now anymore deserving to play origin than a kiwi who passes eligibility for our states or Victor Radley who moved off to England. These people had to make the decisions to forego ever playing for there state (for those who had that desire as well) in order to play for the nation of there choice. So don’t ever give me this culturally ignorant crap EVER. These players who are eligible to tier one nations from young ages have to make such difficult decisions that shape their careers and even there identity. They’re tough decisions to make but it’s time for all these Tongan and Samoan players to stop having their cake and eating it too. They have to choose what is more important. It’s become a fucken farce. Can’t have Tongans and Samoans representing a rep side that feeds to the Australian team just as an Australian player would never be able to represent a Samoan island rep team if such thing existed.
Easy because a person can be multi cultured, you are saying a person is either Australian or Samoan but that's just incorrect, you do realise this country like most allow people to hold more then one passport for a reason?

just because someone who is Australian only exists doesn't mean it should invalidate others who are not who want to play origin and then a country that isn't Australia, because State of Origin isn't a trial for the national team it can't be when Origin is the pinnacle.

your Logic hurts either State of Origin or the International game, status quo doesn't, though I will say I would scrap the tier 1 system and Allow Kiwis who fit the criteria to also play in Origin.
 
Fitzy

Fitzy

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Easy because a person can be multi cultured, you are saying a person is either Australian or Samoan but that's just incorrect, you do realise this country like most allow people to hold more then one passport for a reason?

just because someone who is Australian only exists doesn't mean it should invalidate others who are not who want to play origin and then a country that isn't Australia, because State of Origin isn't a trial for the national team it can't be when Origin is the pinnacle.

your Logic hurts either State of Origin or the International game, status quo doesn't, though I will say I would scrap the tier 1 system and Allow Kiwis who fit the criteria to also play in Origin.
I don’t think you understand what is being argued here the point being is that they full and well can choose which country they wish to represent but they can’t benefit more than every other fucker who has to fit within the system. They literally have no system or laws that prevent them from anything. They get to choose when, where and how they play for whatever team whenever it suits. The fact is they have to choose what’s more valuable like every other bloke out there. The rules shouldn’t be changing to let them have a free for all but to limit them. Origin is far more valuable to the game at the minute than a failing International game. That’s the reality. The international game will be fixed in a way that has 0 detriment to origin.

Heaps of people in this nation have multiple cultures they live under and live by, but yet again their culture for the younger generations that have grown up in Australia is not their nationality. By suggesting otherwise makes the system so complex. I think it is a shame they don’t want to play for Australia but at the same time I understand they have almost all grown up in an environment that reflects the culture of their heritage, as such I understand 100% why they wish to align their nationailty with that. But they can’t choose to do that and base your identity around their last name, family and heritage and than all of a sudden switch up and all of a sudden decide they want to base their identity around themselves and their own origins in a professional sport such as ours so they can put their name on the biggest stage and grab a 90k cash grab.

They seem to have a difference in how their nationality builds them from each other and I have faith that if the system was to change and they could only have one or the other, the majority would choose their heritage which has been the beacon for their decisions until now. Nobody has an issue with that. I get that there is more to there lives than just being Samoan and Tongan etc but they have chosen to neglect the Australian part of their identity in rugby league so you can’t still stand there and tell me that by playing origin gives them a chance to represent every part of their existence.

Point being is you can’t say that your primary origins are from Samoa and then claim that your origins are also from Qld or NSW. One origin seemingly is a priority and by playing for a different nation to that of your state team is contradicting yourself. The current system allows a lot of freedom for what players want to do and where they identify from. Many sports aren’t as unrestrictive as rugby league. They understand what kids dreams might be. They have decided to neglect the ever present Australian identity in themselves when deciding to play for an opposite nationality. I have 0 issue with that decision at all. AT ALL. But like every other sport and even selective nations in this sport, that decision has bearings and consequences on your opportunities in their career. Origin needs to be included in that. It’s got nothing to do with them coming to play for Australia, it’s got to do with Origin keeping its integrity.
 
V

Viti

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Point being is you can’t say that your primary origins are from Samoa and then claim that your origins are also from Qld or NSW.
This is a complete crock of shit.

I’m a half Fijian/Australian that would’ve bled for both Fiji and QLD if a complete lack of skill didn’t hold me back from being selected.

I was born in Australia and have lived in Australia my whole life but I will always have a very deep connection to Fiji.
 
Big Del

Big Del

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I hadn't realised that being honoured to play representative football ....at its highest levels, had become such a money grab.

Yep ! They should be paying for the privilege .
Maybe give em a pie and coke if they win . Then they would learn to appreciate their position .
 
theshed

theshed

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This is a complete crock of shit.

I’m a half Fijian/Australian that would’ve bled for both Fiji and QLD if a complete lack of skill didn’t hold me back from being selected.

I was born in Australia and have lived in Australia my whole life but I will always have a very deep connection to Fiji.
Yeah, I’m actually sorry you have to read this drivel. Of course people can be proud of more than 1 location.

Imagine anyone questioning Petro’s commitment to QLD.
 
Mr Fourex

Mr Fourex

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Mate, this is rugby league not a world war. What a dumb opinion.
Why.....?

He was born in Australia, educated in Australia....afforded opportunities because he is Australian.
In some ways, everything he is today....is because he is Australian.

Why is it so unreasonable to expect that he put Australia first?
 
theshed

theshed

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Why.....?

He was born in Australia, educated in Australia....afforded opportunities because he is Australian.
In some ways, everything he is today....is because he is Australian.

Why is it so unreasonable to expect that he put Australia first?
Maybe he would like to honour a grandfather or parent. Maybe he would like to improve the quality of international league by repping his country of heritage. Maybe he knows that playing for Fiji would mean more to them than it would to them aussies with a stacked team?

Maybe he would like to honour a culture rather than a nation?
 
V

Viti

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Why.....?

He was born in Australia, educated in Australia....afforded opportunities because he is Australian.
In some ways, everything he is today....is because he is Australian.

Why is it so unreasonable to expect that he put Australia first?
I put Australia first in everything I do everyday?

I’d see representing Fiji as an opportunity to represent another piece of who I am
 
Mr Fourex

Mr Fourex

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I put Australia first in everything I do everyday?

I’d see representing Fiji as an opportunity to represent another piece of who I am

I get that......which is why I didn't rule it out altogether.

Don't you think that giving back, to the country that has given you so much of everything .....would be the right thing to do?

If Australia wasn't so successful and we needed the best available players to commit to Australia in order to gain an Australian victory.....would you still choose Fiji?
 
V

Viti

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I get that......which is why I didn't rule it out altogether.

Don't you think that giving back, to the country that has given you so much of everything .....would be the right thing to do?

If Australia wasn't so successful and we needed the best available players to commit to Australia in order to gain an Australian victory.....would you still choose Fiji?
Like I said, I give back to Australia everyday and yes I would still choose Fiji.
 
Mr Fourex

Mr Fourex

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Maybe he would like to honour a grandfather or parent. Maybe he would like to improve the quality of international league by repping his country of heritage. Maybe he knows that playing for Fiji would mean more to them than it would to them aussies with a stacked team?

Maybe he would like to honour a culture rather than a nation?
As mentioned above.......maybe he would like to honour the country that afforded him every benefit in life that he holds today?

I think all your reasoning above is a fair enough opinion. I don't agree with it.....but it doesn't make your opinion "dumb"

just different to mine is all.
 

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