NFL 2017 Discussion

To be fair I think Kaepernick being unsigned has more to do with him being a shit QB than it does with any stance.
 
Without getting into a racial debate - he's standing up (or kneeling) for what he believes in. It was a quiet, public protest designed at sending a message. Unfortunately the only message that got through was the perception he isn't worth the potential bad publicity.

He's easily better than a number of starting QBs in the league right now, so the fact he can't even land a job as a backup is astounding.
 
Clintos said:
Without getting into a racial debate - he's standing up (or kneeling) for what he believes in. It was a quiet, public protest designed at sending a message. Unfortunately the only message that got through was the perception he isn't worth the potential bad publicity.

He's easily better than a number of starting QBs in the league right now, so the fact he can't even land a job as a backup is astounding.
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Sure he is better than some Clintos but unfortunately he reached his peak during the 2013 playoffs.
I was a massive fan of his mobile QB play but teams worked him out and my beloved 49ers were in self destruct mode.
 
He opted out of the contract he already had, was about to sign with a team and his girlfriend tweeted that the teams owner was a slave owner. Can one person tell me why any team would want to be involved with negative press like that? Todd Carney might be the 17th best half in the game and yet he can't get a spot in the NRL. Why is that?

How many black football players were signed in the time Kaepernick has been unsigned? How is it racism and why am I redneck? Simple questions..
 
AndyB said:
Sure he is better than some Clintos but unfortunately he reached his peak during the 2013 playoffs.
I was a massive fan of his mobile QB play but teams worked him out and my beloved 49ers were in self destruct mode.
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For sure. He was a beast in 2013 after Smith's injury. He declined, sure. His accuracy was never the best, but his off the cuff play was always great. The 49ers on the whole were on the decline - it didn't just rest on his shoulders.

Coach change after coach change, trying to get him to learn new systems and trying to make him a pocket passer - it was never going to work.

Would he be a top 10 QB? No - definitely not. He certainly should be rostered though - and that's the issue here IMO.
 
It's pretty crazy that he's been blackballed by the NFL and yet a player like Jay Cutler can pick up a cold $10 million as a backup at Miami.

To be fair, the controversy surrounding Kap predates the public protest and while that's taken it to a new level, there were folks who made their mind up on him long before. It has nothing to do with race and to be honest he's not the only QB in the NFL who plays the race card.

How about them Saints, Cult? Drew Brees shown up by Sam Bradford, I would be pumping my chest, but this is the Saints away from the Superdome in the opening month of the season...it's like taking candy from a baby. Biggest talking point of the night centred on AP and how he would go against his old team. Unfortunately for AP he only managed 18 yards as he got to watch Dalvin Cook break one of his franchise records.

Broncos/Chargers was heading the exact same way, until Denver turned the ball over and gave Rivers a shot late. The Chargers just about forced OT until YoungHoe Koo had his field goal (his second, with the first being successful but ignored due to a crafty time out) blocked by one of the Broncos defenders.

That's sort of the NFL in a nut-shell. It can be all one way traffic with the games just chugging along then out of nowhere the entire course of the game can change. I still can't get over the Patriots/Falcons Superbowl...I still don't know how Atlanta fans pick themselves up after that.

FYI would hate to be a Saints fan this weekend. Hosting the Patriots after New England let a game slip...yikes.
 
Are the Vikings a really good team or are the Saints terrible? Do they play better at home and do they get better over the season? I watch the Super Bowl every year but that's as far as my NFL viewing gets. I watched the Saints/Vikings game though. It just isn't sucking me in. What got you guys into it?
 
The Vikings are about as middle as the road as it gets, but they're my team. It's a real culture shock going from a side like the Broncos and cheering on a team like Minnesota who are so irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. The only thing they have to crow about is their defence which is good without being elite.

The Saints always start the season slow and seem to play a lot better at home than they do away. Reality for a Saints fan is that you've got a ticking clock starring you in the face and the less time you have with Drew Brees, the less likely your side will come to winning another Superbowl. He was brilliant for the Saints last year, but he basically had to do it on his own and the defence as it's been for years has been pissweak. The Saints have made steps to try and improve that area, trading one of your star receivers to get a first round pick but it's a tall order.

I'm by no means a big NFL fan and I've still got a lot to learn, but just think about what got you into Rugby League and try to follow the same pattern.
 
I'm not sure of any controversy surrounding Kaep before the kneeling occurred? Are you just referring to his poor play, or have I forgotten something?

I guess my main issue with it is that players get found guilty of crimes almost every week in the NFL. Mostly small stuff, but some spend time in jail and come back and play and there's seemingly no issue with that. There's controversy everywhere. Why does a man's right to protest peacefully make him a less appealing option than those with drug charges, or murder charges?

Players will kneel again this year and nothing will happen. A white player kneeled in the pre-season and it was barely a blip. Says a lot IMO.
 
I'm not sure of any controversy surrounding Kaep before the kneeling occurred? Are you just referring to his poor play, or have I forgotten something?
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Not a specific incident per se, just his demeanor in general. For whatever reason, he's been rubbing fans up the wrong way for years and there was definitely a contingent who were looking for a reason, found it and then went into overdrive.

As far as this particular incident is concerned, I don't think his on-field form helped him one bit. Clubs will put up with a lot if a guy can produce, but if they're just flapping their gums and not backing it up it makes everyone hesitant.

Kaep will find a franchise eventually, it will just come down to desperation.
 
Big Pete said:
The Saints always start the season slow and seem to play a lot better at home than they do away. Reality for a Saints fan is that you've got a ticking clock starring you in the face and the less time you have with Drew Brees, the less likely your side will come to winning another Superbowl. He was brilliant for the Saints last year, but he basically had to do it on his own and the defence as it's been for years has been pissweak. The Saints have made steps to try and improve that area, trading one of your star receivers to get a first round pick but it's a tall order.
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Domefield advantage hasn't actually been a thing for a few seasons, now, unfortunately. There was a period where a home game was basically an automatic W (primetime games, home or away, were a bit like that as well), but sadly no longer. They've also got a patchy o-line (RT Strief went down yesterday, elite LT Armstead out for a little while yet), a decimated receiving corps (Cooks gone, Snead suspended, Fleener underproducing), and a largely young and inexperienced defense (three rookie starters, entirely new LB unit, plus a couple of key injuries in Breaux and Fairley).

Given their relative youth, I expect the defense to get better with time this year. This isn't going to be a shut-out defense, but more of a bend-but-don't-break, opportunistic defense like we had under Gregg Williams. If they can be middle of the pack by the end of the season, that's an enormous improvement on what we've had recently.

The problem is definitely the offense. Yesterday was a prime example - they got into the redzone four times, and settled for four field goals. That allowed the Vikings to play with the lead for the majority of the game, and they ended up putting the game to bed by converting their own chances. If the Saints had converted just a couple of those opportunities into TDs, the defense is suddenly looking at a much smaller margin. I think a huge turning point as well was in the two minutes before the half when Payton called those timeouts. Great, I love that you have faith in your defense, but man you out them in a hole you didn't really need to by doing that.

The offense is definitely on the downswing. Brees is coming to the end of his Hall of Fame career - granted, he may play another four or five productive years, but unless he has the Denver-like defenses Peyton enjoyed, I don't think he's winning another ring. Mike Thomas is a stud, and I hope we hang on to him. I wasn't that sad that Cooks left purely because of Thomas, because Cooks has a skill set that is more common in the league (I'd have been far less sad if we'd gotten Butler in return). Ingram is a fine all-purpose back, but Peterson is done. I'd be surprised if he contributes much at all this season. Kamara is more exciting, and has plenty of potential. They have some good pieces on the o-line, but the remainder of the offense is not anything like as deep as it once was.

They also play in what's probably the second toughest division in the league, so there's also that. All told, after yesterday I get the feeling that it's going to be another loooong season...
 
I liked your post Culhwch Culhwch but that doesn't do your contribution justice. Awesome analysis and thank you for teaching me a thing or two about the Saints.
 
How freakin terrible is our offense playing Porthoz Porthoz ?
Hoyer is hopeless, Hyde gave us hope. WR were avg at times.
Good signs with our D though.
 
AndyB said:
How freakin terrible is our offense playing Porthoz Porthoz ?
Hoyer is hopeless, Hyde gave us hope. WR were avg at times.
Good signs with our D though.
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Yes, liked the D. And we don't even have Foster at the moment. Good times ahead I think.

The offence... 2 games, 0 TD. Says it all, doesn't it?
It's not all Hoyer, as like you said our receivers weren't very good, but jeez, do we need a QB. Bring Kaep back ffs... at least until we have someone capable in the pocket!
 
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