Round 16 Discussion

[Bucking Beads]

Roosters are a shit club. I hate them.

 

[Porthoz]

All 3 are important. I remember a year or 2 back when Cronk was out, Melbourne looked just as lost.

I agree with Dexter. Cronk is nowhere near as important to the Storm as are Smith and Slater. Cronk compliments them and is by no means a bad halfback, but he is not at the Thurston or Langer level.
Without Smith they struggle big time to get rolling forward, while Slater makes a huge difference in their attacking plays.

 

[Broncoman]

That was total shit.

 

[Anonymous person]

Lets discuss Bellamy and the Storm then. Since Slater has been injured they look flat out scoring. All his so called structures and super coaching ability seems based on the exceptional ability of just 2 players. Smith and Slater.

Cronk is just a halfback IMO, so far he's failed at Origin level except for a 15min period in O2 and without Slater drawing the defence off him he doesn't have a clue at NRL level.

If Slater happens to be out for the back end of the year super coach Bellamy will be exposed again as he was in SoO without his two superstars

Let's discuss storm then. First place on the ladder. 2 wins clear of second, who are the ones who beat them yesterday, while missing the undisputed best player in the NRL. Take Lockyer out and the broncos looked flat out getting out of their half for 10 years. Take hayne out and the eels may as well not take the field. Same with gallen/Marshall/inglis etc. losing your best player who is also the best attacking weapon in the entire league is a HUGE thing to have to overcome.

Bellamys super coaching ability comes from the fact that he can take basically any 14 nuffies and coach them to be able to provide the groundwork for slater/cronk/smith to shine. He does that better than any other coach in history. Its why despite having one of the highest player turnovers of any club, melbourne continue to be a dominant force. A player gets injured, another of the same mould and quality steps straight up and does his job. If you can't see the genius in that then you should give up trying to talk coaching right now.

You say cronk has failed at origin, yet it was near half an hour of him playing his heart out in game 2. Before that, and in game 1, he was sitting back letting thurston take control. He knows he can't do that now. Expect a big game 3 and a much more organized Queensland.

Bellamy was "exposed" in origin? That's like saying that any sprinter who loses to usain bolt just got "exposed".

 

[Browny]

Here we go again

 

[Coxy]

Denial. Love it. No Slater, no storm.

 

[Dexter]

Let's discuss storm then. First place on the ladder. 2 wins clear of second, who are the ones who beat them yesterday, while missing the undisputed best player in the NRL. Take Lockyer out and the broncos looked flat out getting out of their half for 10 years. Take hayne out and the eels may as well not take the field. Same with gallen/Marshall/inglis etc. losing your best player who is also the best attacking weapon in the entire league is a HUGE thing to have to overcome.

Bellamys super coaching ability comes from the fact that he can take basically any 14 nuffies and coach them to be able to provide the groundwork for slater/cronk/smith to shine. He does that better than any other coach in history. Its why despite having one of the highest player turnovers of any club, melbourne continue to be a dominant force. A player gets injured, another of the same mould and quality steps straight up and does his job. If you can't see the genius in that then you should give up trying to talk coaching right now.

You say cronk has failed at origin, yet it was near half an hour of him playing his heart out in game 2. Before that, and in game 1, he was sitting back letting thurston take control. He knows he can't do that now. Expect a big game 3 and a much more organized Queensland.

Bellamy was "exposed" in origin? That's like saying that any sprinter who loses to usain bolt just got "exposed".

Open your eyes and realise you are arguing the same things for Bellamy as most of us do for WB yet in your opinion WB is a hack and Bellamy is a coaching god. The fact of the matter is as I see it Bellamy is a good coach because of his superstars ,as was WB, not because he has unlocked the mysteries of coaching nuffies.

As for big turnover of players, the Broncos have always had a massive turnover of players and lost players because of the cap.

The Storm without Slater struggle and the Broncs without Locky struggled. I can see the similarities you cannot.

Cronk so far in Origin has produced very little apart from that period after the bin. His kicking game has been rubbish and his attack has lacked anything really except the structure he brings from the Storm which prevents him from playing whats in front of him.

I'm not saying he isn't capable of producing at this level, but to date he hasn't, that's a fact.

 

[Anonymous person]

The Storm without Slater struggle and the Broncs without Locky struggled. I can see the similarities you cannot.

having trouble reading today? or are you comprehension skills just on the fritz? i specifically said that they struggle without slater - i even specifically likened it to the broncos without lockyer! lol

Take Lockyer out and the broncos looked flat out getting out of their half for 10 years. Take hayne out and the eels may as well not take the field. Same with gallen/Marshall/inglis etc. losing your best player who is also the best attacking weapon in the entire league is a HUGE thing to have to overcome.

As for big turnover of players, the Broncos have always had a massive turnover of players and lost players because of the cap.

yeh, and? the storm have too. look at the last 6 years or so and see who has lost more players, and more importantly more regular first grade players. i dont think it'll be the broncos.

and even if it WAS the broncos, the broncos have been nowhere near as consistent as melbourne in the last 10 years. how many minor premierships did the broncos get? 0. the storm have 4, with a 5th likely this year.

Open your eyes and realise you are arguing the same things for Bellamy as most of us do for WB yet in your opinion WB is a hack and Bellamy is a coaching god.

incorrect. WB doesnt take a team of nuffies and win. Bennett takes a team of rep players and excellent players who have struggled for consistency and if things go his way he wins. Bennetts already started sacking half the players he has and started throwing the cheque book around in the hopes of buying a premiership for next year, as he cant win without a superstar team. Newcastle is showing that.

 

[ningnangnong]

Bellamy spent something like four or five years working under Bennett, not to mention his time as a player at Canberra as well. Speaks volumes.

 

[Fozz]

Pointless arguing with AP over WB, he'll never see WB as anything other than the guy who ran over his dog multiple times.

 

[Anonymous person]

Bellamy spent something like four or five years working under Bennett, not to mention his time as a player at Canberra as well. Speaks volumes.

does it? his coaching style is comletely different to Bennetts, as are his tactics. Bellamy is continually coming up with new techniques that are within the rules to get an advantage on the field, and getting the best out of all of his players, often taking "has been" players and turning them into top level players once again. bennett does none of those. he stifles natural attacking flair and ability in order to play his 5 hitup then kick boring gameplan that hes had since the late 90s. forward shows a bit of ability with an offload or a chip chase? cut that right out or theyre dropped to reserve grade.

 

[Jeba]

Won 3 premierships since the late 90s too ;-)

 

[Ari Gold]

Bellamy spent something like four or five years working under Bennett, not to mention his time as a player at Canberra as well. Speaks volumes.

By the same token though, you could argue that Bellamy has improved on Bennett's style by keeping the things WB does well and adding his own improvements.

There's no doubt WB has been a great coach, but I don't think that necessarily means he still is at that level. Certainly what he's done at Newcastle isn't something you could rave about. Every coach has their favourite players, and of course WB is signing those. However, he's made startlingly little impact with fringe or less players already at the club. Compare that to say Des, who like WB is signing some of his brigade, but at the same time has done much more with the lesser/unknown Dogs players than what Bennett has done with the Knights.

 

[Anonymous person]

There's no doubt WB has been a great coach, but I don't think that necessarily means he still is at that level.

no no ari, thats not how it works. once the best, always the best. at least thats how BHQ sees it.

St George winning a premiership in 2010 was all Bennett. Newcastle missing the 8 and possibly getting the wooden spoon in 2012 is all the players.

I was a HUGE wayne bennett fan for years, up until the early 2000s. thats about the time where he just seemed to be relying on the same outdated gameplan that worked with unlimited interchange and a team full of superstars, despite the fact we didnt have a team of superstars and we had limited interchange. since then, very little has changed with his gameplan despite the fact that the game has had some huge changes.

and its the same with coaches as it is with players - just because you win the premiership doesnt mean your coach is the best coach in the league.

 

[Dexter]

having trouble reading today? or are you comprehension skills just on the fritz? i specifically said that they struggle without slater - i even specifically likened it to the broncos without lockyer! lol





yeh, and? the storm have too. look at the last 6 years or so and see who has lost more players, and more importantly more regular first grade players. i dont think it'll be the broncos.

and even if it WAS the broncos, the broncos have been nowhere near as consistent as melbourne in the last 10 years. how many minor premierships did the broncos get? 0. the storm have 4, with a 5th likely this year.


incorrect. WB doesnt take a team of nuffies and win. Bennett takes a team of rep players and excellent players who have struggled for consistency and if things go his way he wins. Bennetts already started sacking half the players he has and started throwing the cheque book around in the hopes of buying a premiership for next year, as he cant win without a superstar team. Newcastle is showing that.

When has Bellamy taken a team of nuffies and won? What, 1 minor Premiership last year. Melb can keep their minor premiership lol I'd rather have the big one.

As for Bennett throwing the chq book around, FFS you must be on crack to say something that stupid whilst supporting a coach and club that achieved all these great things you wax on about with the biggest chq book in the game and were stripped of most of those things because they were proven to be cheating.

 

[Big Pete]

Was I the only one who saw Melbourne defeat Manly at Brookvale without Slater?

 

[Anonymous person]

As for Bennett throwing the chq book around, FFS you must be on crack to say something that stupid whilst supporting a coach and club that achieved all these great things you wax on about with the biggest chq book in the game and were stripped of most of those things because they were proven to be cheating.

i dont support melbourne. theyre a damn good team and they get all the respect in the world from me, and ill even cheer them on against every team in the comp other than the Broncos, Cowboys and Titans, but I don't support them and never will. Im not rocky, i dont flip flop.

Was I the only one who saw Melbourne defeat Manly at Brookvale without Slater?

nah i saw it, but apparently it was just us lol.

 

[Son Edo]

Was I the only one who saw Melbourne defeat Manly at Brookvale without Slater?

Exactly, BTW who played 5/8 yesterday, Hinchcliffe?