Sam Kasiano
- Thread starter Big Pete
- Start date
Force
BRL Player
- May 6, 2012
- 38
- 0
I think people have to realise more and more kiwis and other foreigners are playing in various league competitions throughout Australia.With the numerous scouts clubs have in NZ its a given and the influence will only get bigger.It is no longer just Australians as it once was when the Origin eligibility criteria was put in place.With the change in face of rugby league one would think the rules would have to change with it.If one glances over the teams in recent years,I dont think people like Tamou,Uate,or Costigan have diminished the origin concept even though they have either represented another country before or signaled their intentions to do so previously.As with KHunt and Tamou,the choice guy's like Te'o and other kiwis make is never between NZ and Australia,its always been between NZ and QLD/NSW.That to me tells one they arent interested in playing for Australia but are forced to if they choose to play Origin.Would you really want someone playing for Australia when their heart isnt fully in it?.....even Toni Carroll came out and said he had always wanted to play for NZ.I have no doubt guys like Te'o or Tamou have passion for their state of choice but for the good of the game internationally,I reckon players should'nt be forced to play for OZ instead,let them decide.It was a blow to the game when McGuire and Vidot had to pull out of a game for Samoa at the 11th hour because it would affect their Origin aspirations back in 2010.
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Hamm.0
NRL Captain
- Mar 5, 2008
- 4,671
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The rules shouldn't change with the "changing face of RL" at all. If 10000 Kenyans come over next year and start working in the construction industry, should the Australian Government change/lower Australian standards to those standards of Kenya?
People can call me controversial or whatever, but being Australian isn't a racial thing, it's a cultural thing and if you don't want to be a proud Australian, whether your job is construction of playing RL, then see you later. That's how I see it and that's why I always mention CITIZENSHIP in regards to eligibility. You can't have your cake and eat it to, if you want the perks, you commit to the cause.
Nobody could consider PNG anything other than a minnow nation in RL, people should not be concerned with Fijian, PNG, Tongan or Samoan Internationals playing SoO, if they are citizens of Australia. However, regards the "NZ or NSW/QLD" thing, my above comments are very apt.
Show me where or a source for this?
Samoa is a minnow nation and I agree, playing for them shouldn't affect their SoO eligibility (also, McGuire is Australian born so is a citizen).
Force
BRL Player
- May 6, 2012
- 38
- 0
I agree being Australian isnt a racial thing but just because people move to another country it doesnt mean they have to denounce their ties to their native country.This is why so many kiwi's who move to OZ still support NZ or OZ-Italians support Italy and even ex-pat Australians living in other countries who support Australia.They still enjoy the fruits of their new country without forgoing their ties to the old.No need to lower any standards at all just make the Origin eligibility and International eligibility separate.
The problem is it is affecting the minnow nations.Vidot and McGuire had to pull out of a test match cos they didnt want to jeopardise their chances of one day playing Origin.Feleti Mateo is doing the same thing,hes stepped down from Tonga in a hope to play Origin.Uate would do wonders for the international game if he were allowed to play Origin and then for Fiji.If you acknowledge this shouldnt affect the minnow nations like PNG,Samoa etc...then I dont see why it would be a problem allowing one more nation to do this and to be frank,theres really only 3 major nations in league and one of them have most of their players playing in the other country because league isnt big in their own.
As for the Toni Carroll thing.I heard Gordan Tallis talking about it the other week.All I could find on the matter is this...
[ A renowned rugby league defector is calling for New Zealanders to be included in State of Origin in the wake of James Tamou's defection to Australia.
Tonie Carroll believes it's the desire to play for New South Wales that's seen the kiwi-born prop switch allegiances.
Carroll himself opted to play for Australia after being born in Christchurch, before later switching to New Zealand, only to re-declare himself available for the Kangaroos.
He says it's disgusting that Australians have the advantage of playing the pinnacle of the game, while kiwis do not.
"Not even a grand final can match the intensity of a State of Origin match, so the players that are playing in these State of Origin matches are getting a massive leg up over the kiwi players."
Carroll says all he ever wanted was a State of Origin jersey, but he believes Tamou is cash-hunting.
"It sounds like he's doing it for financial reasons, he sort of looking for the State of Origin jersey which a lot of players playing today hold in bigger stead than the international jersey."
Players receive around $40,000 for playing State of Origin, while kiwis only get around $3000 per test.
Carroll says if New Zealanders could play Origin, it would eliminate the need for a choice between countries.
"I believe every player should be allowed to play State of Origin its the pinnacle of rugby league. To be disregarded to play for New Zealand, it's disgusting."]
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Hamm.0
NRL Captain
- Mar 5, 2008
- 4,671
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I'm sorry I should have made myself more clear; it's my belief that the RLIF and ARL should allow players eligible to rep. minnow countries (any country other than NZ, UK, AS) to rep. their eligible countries without affecting their SoO chances.
On Carroll, he has been here since he was like 7. I personally know he played for Waterford Demons JRLFC in under 10's. He always considered himself an Aussie and sort direction from the ARL and RLIF to ensure before playing for NZ, it wouldn't hurt his SoO eligibility.
Onto your first point Force, I completely disagree and we will have to agree to disagree.
To me, there's nothing LESS Australian, than someone who has been in this country forever (10+) years who supports another country OVER Australia in any sport. It's abhorred that somebody could honestly not want to assimilate on the sporting field, much like not assimilating in society in general.
WNG Hammo's Rant;
If you have lived here for 20 years, but still consider yourself a "kiwi" and rock a silver fern on your car, you're a douche IMO and a drain on the greatest country in the world. If one of my Asian mates gets asked where he comes from, he replies "Woodridge". A Tongan mate of mine, born Sydney bred Brisbane was asked in a pub, "you probably support the All Blacks hey?” He was very offended not because he's Tongan, but because after 12 years in the Army he's more Australian than half the "white" people in the pub. He supports Tonga in everything, until they play Australia. IMO that attitude extends onto the sporting field as well.
There's nothing at all wrong with celebrating your families culture, however take pride in the country which you now live in.
On Carroll, he has been here since he was like 7. I personally know he played for Waterford Demons JRLFC in under 10's. He always considered himself an Aussie and sort direction from the ARL and RLIF to ensure before playing for NZ, it wouldn't hurt his SoO eligibility.
Onto your first point Force, I completely disagree and we will have to agree to disagree.
To me, there's nothing LESS Australian, than someone who has been in this country forever (10+) years who supports another country OVER Australia in any sport. It's abhorred that somebody could honestly not want to assimilate on the sporting field, much like not assimilating in society in general.
WNG Hammo's Rant;
If you have lived here for 20 years, but still consider yourself a "kiwi" and rock a silver fern on your car, you're a douche IMO and a drain on the greatest country in the world. If one of my Asian mates gets asked where he comes from, he replies "Woodridge". A Tongan mate of mine, born Sydney bred Brisbane was asked in a pub, "you probably support the All Blacks hey?” He was very offended not because he's Tongan, but because after 12 years in the Army he's more Australian than half the "white" people in the pub. He supports Tonga in everything, until they play Australia. IMO that attitude extends onto the sporting field as well.
There's nothing at all wrong with celebrating your families culture, however take pride in the country which you now live in.
dukey
NRL Player
- Jun 5, 2008
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Force
BRL Player
- May 6, 2012
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I dont see a difference between a player from PNG playing SOO to a player from NZ wanting to play SOO.They are both from other countries.To me if you accept one way,surely you have to accept it the other based on the cases being almost identical.
Well lets put it another way...'Australians moving to another country'.
Australian actor Simon Baker(The Mentalist).He moved to the US because of work and recently became an American citizen.Is he now no longer Australian?...would you consider him American?...Another example, Australian NBA basketball player Andrew Bogut.He had to move to America because thats where the best basketball competition on the planet is(just like the NRL to league players).Would he be known as an American if he stays there for more than 10 years and can no longer consider himself Australian?...What if basketball was Australias top sport and all the top OZ basketball players moved to the US to try make the NBA.After living there since being on college scholarships would it be fair if America picked all the top OZ basketball players to play for the US?
People move to other countries just like the numerous ex-pat Australians scattered around the world.Yes they can develop a heart for their new country(they usually do) but also hold on to their ties to their home country.I dont believe one should have to denounce their ties to their homeland just because they moved and I would still consider ex-pat Australians Australian regardless of where they moved to or how long they've been there.
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Force
BRL Player
- May 6, 2012
- 38
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Even though he still considers himself Aussie?....So all Australias ex-pat actors,sportsmen or just ex-pat Aussie are no longer Australian cos they moved to a new country?...
Quote from Simon Baker..."Baker, who turns 41 in a fortnight, said his children were Australian without trying. ''I bring them home whenever I can but in LA we're an Aussie household,'' he said.
''Sure we do the Tim Tams and Vegemite thing, but being Aussie is just about being real. No airs and graces. Our family is normal.''
- Mar 13, 2008
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This. So much this.
Really don't know how you can advocate the fact people can represent Fiji and have allegiance to QLD but can't represent NZ and have allegiance to QLD.
Force
BRL Player
- May 6, 2012
- 38
- 0
Yeah...he became a DUAL citizen of Australia and America.Many people do this so they can get the benefits of being a citizen of that country.He didnt denounce his Australian-ness and still considers himself Australian.
Force
BRL Player
- May 6, 2012
- 38
- 0
PS...Anyone see Te'o have an (initial)Tamou moment when the national anthem was sung?...he looked uncomfortable almost chringe-worthy trying his best to hold it together.Dont worry,just like Tamou when standing for the anthem in the ANZAC test Im sure next time he'll be told he has to sing it.
Mister Wright
NRL Captain
- Jun 8, 2009
- 4,946
- 3,304
Tamou spent the first 3 days of the game 2 camp learning the National Anthem.
anzac7
NYC Player
- Sep 25, 2011
- 239
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lol ... last night he looked like he still didn't know it... looked very uncomfortable..
jarro65
State of Origin Rep
- Jun 26, 2008
- 7,191
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I also noticed Nielsen wasn't singing it either :confused:
