The Wayne Bennett Super thread!

[I bleed Maroon]

Re: Sack Griffin/New Coach Discussion

I just do not get where people are coming from with this. He took the Knights to a Prelim just last year and all of a sudden, after one really shit start to a season, he's no longer in touch with the game. Not only has the baby gone out with the bathwater, the baby has practically been drop punted.

 

[austin71]

Re: Sack Griffin/New Coach Discussion

I'd take bellamy over Bennett. Or Maguire. But Bennett and Walters might be a good thing as I think Kevie could be a smart coach when it comes to structures and he would be great for our new halves pairing Imo.. Hunt and Milford.

 

[Bucking Beads]

Re: Sack Griffin/New Coach Discussion

Bennett is not even in the ball park of best coaches anymore. He can still play an important role for a team but I think his coaching days are almost behind him.

 

[jd87]

Re: Sack Griffin/New Coach Discussion

i agree with [MENTION=8274]I bleed Maroon[/MENTION] if bennett is not the best coach for broncos then who do u guys suggest replace griffin? unless Bellamy or hasler are up for grab then bennett is easily the next best available coach.

 

[Big Pete]

Let's talk about Bennett's tenure at the Knights.

When Bennett signed with Newcastle in 2011, the idea is that him & Tinkler would re-ignite Newcastle Rugby League, bringing home a bunch of former juniors (Buderus, Tahu, Snowden, Quinn, McKinnon, Rochow etc.) and complimenting it with signings like Boyd who at that time was considered one of the best players in the world.

Considering the Knights managed to make the Top 8 that year, they seemed odds on to make it again in 2012 and finish higher.

Instead, they finished well outside the 8.

The first real black mark of Bennett's coaching career in the NRL.

Okay, so every coach is due one bad year, surely 2013 will bring in better results.

It did, but it was hardly convincing. In the end, the Knights finished the regular season with 12 wins, 11 losses and a draw barely scraping in at 7th place. They had a good finals campaign but in the end they were easy pickings for the eventual premiers and they still had a long way to go before they could assert themselves as premiership contenders.

Then everything just went wrong for them.

Russell Packer, who had bit of a history of bad behaviour, got himself thrown in jail for a disgusting assault.

Mullen tore his hammy just as he tore the Broncos 9s defence into pieces.

And then the trifecta, the unfortunate and tragic tackle on McKinnon.

Factor in the drama off the field with Tinkler and it's no small wonder to see them struggle like they have.

However, there's been other factors at play here too. Bennett has been just as stubborn as Hook with his selections, if not more so given he's persisted with the likes of Kidley, Boyd & Uate despite their struggles and his forward pack is among the worst in the League.

To make matters worse, things really aren't looking good in the short term. While they have a bunch of promising juniors coming through who could factor in down the road, the rest of 2014 appears to be a bust and 2015 isn't appearing much brighter.

I believe a lot of the changes Bennett and Tinkler made will yield long term benefits (much like White at the Broncos) but in the short term there is definitely some pain and I cannot see how these past three years make him the best coach in the game.

A lot of people consider Wayne the best coach of all-time and they may have a point, but by the same token, others consider Jack Gibson the best coach of all time and there was a time where he knew he had to move on.

 

[Broncoman]

I would imagine Bennett would consider the years 1988-1991 a black mark.

Had a strong squad on paper which contained many of the rampaging QLD origin stars, plenty of support etc yet only made the finals once despite starting each year with a bang.

 

[Big Pete]

Fair point although I'd say 1991 would be the only year he'd be disappointed with.

I think he knew that the Broncos would struggle to handle the transition into the Sydney competition initially and was far more forgiving when he realised how big a toll Origin had on his players.

 

[Huge]

Those years the SOO side was 50/60% of the Broncos and it was only a final five series for the premiership. The Broncs did it tough, paying for every team to play in Brisbane but having to pay for their own way in Sydney. The Origin periods destroyed them with busted players trying to get the team into a final series where only five could make it. They did very well when you consider the obstacles placed in their way not the least of it being unfair judiciary hearings, biased refereeing favouring Sydney teams over the interlopers and extremely hostile crowds and shit facilities quite often not even featuring hot water !!

 

[Anonymous person]

Re: Sack Griffin/New Coach Discussion

I just do not get where people are coming from with this. He took the Knights to a Prelim just last year and all of a sudden, after one really **** start to a season, he's no longer in touch with the game. Not only has the baby gone out with the bathwater, the baby has practically been drop punted.

like i said on the last page of this topic:

if you just look at the result you might think they did well, but if you look at HOW they got there it doesnt paint a fantastic picture.

- scrape into finals on 50% win rate
- beat easily the worst team in the finals, who at the time were just pathetic, having just been beaten by the 12th placed broncos and lost their best player to injury during the game. the way the bulldogs played youd almost put money on some of their players having money on the knights.
- undeniably got the rub of the green from the refs to beat an obviously "on their last legs" and out of form storm.
- got absolutely smashed in the preliminary final.

People can make all the excuses they want - and by the looks of it, they're starting to write a list already - for the knights potentially winning the wooden spoon this year, but the fact is that if he was the "best" coach in the game the squad he has even with their injuries is more than enough to take them to the finals. The fact they're sitting on equal last and Bennett doesn't even seem to be trying to change anything or do anything different speaks volumes of how far short of the top coaches he is.

And I must say - watching the knights lose and lose and lose this year is just fantastic. They're fast approaching being out of the running for the finals, and that would make 2 out of 3 Bennett years that they have. Really not helping you guys with your "Bennett is still the best coach in the game" talk, especially with teams like the Bulldogs flying along with some shitty halves and no fullback, and Souths just rolling on without Luke for most of their season. Hell, even the Broncos are on a bit of a streak now that they have a decent half in control. Hunt is making Griffin look like a world beater.

 

[Broncoman]

I feel that some of the expectations set on Bennett when he joined Newcastle were quite unrealistic and over the hill. The Knights did make the 2011 finals but they only scraped in after destroying Souths in the final round and making it through on points difference.

Bennett came in and brought in some players that were past their best and brought some of his Dragons with him and all of a sudden they were the team to beat. I'm very close to writing off their finals hopes I feel they will need a miracle to make it through from here.

 

[Anonymous person]

Re: Wayne Bennett quits Knights... Is he coming back?

Yes, I would have too. It's really pretty weak of Bennett isn't it.

The reports are saying he's basically sacked himself / quit because he can't do any more with the team? That's pretty ****en **** poor on Wayne's part.

Looking for a club with better players.....can't work with the standard he's got at NTLE. The slurs that have dogged him for years about only being successful because of the players he's had around him must be true.

Bingo.

He's basically realised that he's not going to win a premiership with Newcastle so hes packed up his toys and quit. He'll go to whichever club has a good roster that already has a chance of winning a premiership in the next few years, will bring along his favourites in boyd, scott and co, and will piss off again before his contract ends if it looks like he can't win with their already established team.

Like some of us have been saying for years, most of Bennetts successes can be attributed to the teams that he had pretty much due to things outside of his control. He had great scouts picking him players, and in the early days he literally had the entire state of QLD at his disposal. Then he had the luxury of a basically salary cap free few years where we had far and away the best team that had ever been assembled in the NRL/ARL and we won a few premierships (but probably should've won another one or 2).

The longer he goes the more he's showing that his coaching record is not all it's cracked up to be.

 

[1910]

Re: Wayne Bennett quits Knights... Is he coming back?

Bingo.

He's basically realised that he's not going to win a premiership with Newcastle so hes packed up his toys and quit. He'll go to whichever club has a good roster that already has a chance of winning a premiership in the next few years, will bring along his favourites in boyd, scott and co, and will **** off again before his contract ends if it looks like he can't win with their already established team.

Like some of us have been saying for years, most of Bennetts successes can be attributed to the teams that he had pretty much due to things outside of his control. He had great scouts picking him players, and in the early days he literally had the entire state of QLD at his disposal. Then he had the luxury of a basically salary cap free few years where we had far and away the best team that had ever been assembled in the NRL/ARL and we won a few premierships (but probably should've won another one or 2).

The longer he goes the more he's showing that his coaching record is not all it's cracked up to be.

Your argument falls down dramatically at Souths and Raiders.

Those great scouts he chose too. The improvement in those players from kids to internationals also takes some explaining.

People sell very short how much is involved in setting up a club which he has done twice now, Broncos obviously and the Dragons were shocking with the systems they had in place or lacking. I've seen first hand the systems he set up the Dragons with the uni and and under age sides.

He didn't have the entire state either, that's disproven by the amount of Queenslanders leaving in full team amounts to Sydney. Redcliffe lost 30 players at the end of 1986 to Sydney.

Brothers Grand Final side lost Coyne, Gill, Bailey, Mohr and Carter to the Dragons and Stafford and Vernon to the Eels and Rea and Smith to the Bears.

He's been in this position before at Brothers and did the same thing (went back to Souths), be easier to stay and take your huge pay knowing you're not the right person then leave and let them get on with it. (Brothers wouldn't have been a big pay though).

 

[Nashy]

This would be the first time this has come up on BHQ....

 

[Big Pete]

If you want to discuss Bennett's entire career, you must do so here.

Mods made it very clear on their expectations in the Bennett to Brisbane thread what that discussion would entail and this is a breach of that.

Willing to let it slide on this occasion, but if there is a post you wish to respond to but it maybe off topic, find a more appropriate thread or start a new one and discuss it there.

Have fun and play nice.

 

[Ari Gold]

If you look at the Knights team this year and didn't know who the coach was, the last thing in the world you'd want is their coach to come join us. Seriously, everyone in their starting pack is over 30 save for Robbie Rochow. We aren't talking stars either, people like Fa'alogo and Mason and other seniors. I mean, I know Abbott lifted the retirement age, but Bennett's taking it too far.

We definitely need a new coach. We need a new era. Players should stop coming back to Brisbane to retire. Applies to coaches too. Bennett a great legend of the club and the game, but his time with us as a coach should be done. In some other capacity maybe.

 

[Harry Sack]

If you look at the Knights team this year and didn't know who the coach was, the last thing in the world you'd want is their coach to come join us. Seriously, everyone in their starting pack is over 30 save for Robbie Rochow. We aren't talking stars either, people like Fa'alogo and Mason and other seniors. I mean, I know Abbott lifted the retirement age, but Bennett's taking it too far.

We definitely need a new coach. We need a new era. Players should stop coming back to Brisbane to retire. Applies to coaches too. Bennett a great legend of the club and the game, but his time with us as a coach should be done. In some other capacity maybe.

This is all I'm calling for tbh and the only capacity I think he would come back in.

 

[Anonymous person]

Re: Wayne Bennett quits Knights... Is he coming back?

Your argument falls down dramatically at Souths and Raiders.

Those great scouts he chose too. The improvement in those players from kids to internationals also takes some explaining.

People sell very short how much is involved in setting up a club which he has done twice now, Broncos obviously and the Dragons were shocking with the systems they had in place or lacking. I've seen first hand the systems he set up the Dragons with the uni and and under age sides.

He didn't have the entire state either, that's disproven by the amount of Queenslanders leaving in full team amounts to Sydney. Redcliffe lost 30 players at the end of 1986 to Sydney.

Brothers Grand Final side lost Coyne, Gill, Bailey, Mohr and Carter to the Dragons and Stafford and Vernon to the Eels and Rea and Smith to the Bears.

He's been in this position before at Brothers and did the same thing (went back to Souths), be easier to stay and take your huge pay knowing you're not the right person then leave and let them get on with it. (Brothers wouldn't have been a big pay though).

Talking his Broncos years and onwards obviously, 1986 and earlier is irrelevant.

 

[Jeba]

Re: Wayne Bennett quits Knights... Is he coming back?

Talking his Broncos years and onwards obviously, 1986 and earlier is irrelevant.

Irrelevant because it doesn't suit your argument.