Barba vs Boyd

[gordjw]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

B4L for Benevolent Dictator for Life.

Seriously, this thread is worse than the Griffin/Hoffman threads.

 

[broncos4life]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

B4L for Benevolent Dictator for Life.

Seriously, this thread is worse than the Griffin/Hoffman threads.

I'll take it

 

[Porthoz]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

Milford - Was bought here to play 6, wants to play 6, we need a 6

Barba - Was moved to 6 where he played better than fullback but at the same time didn't set the world on fire. I am in favour of keeping him but I honestly think his fullback days are behind him

Hoffman - The only think he brings to fullback is the ability to pad out your list. Everyone agrees he is a winger/centre and nothing more so why put him on the list

Hodges - Cannot defend at all at fullback and will last 6 games there before his off to the knackery

Eden - Eden? Eden? Oh that's right the guy that has been the butt of most jokes around here who from all reports will be lucky to hold down the fullback spot at Redcliffe.

2 Nikorimas - Both massive unknowns as far as NRL go and one isn't even eligible yet

If we only had Hodges, Hoffman and Eden, I would of course concede because your points are valid, but...

Unless you know of a contract clause saying that Milford is going to play 5/8, no coach should ever satisfy player's whims, and if him being at the back is the best option for the team, that's where he should play. He will have plenty of time to come through... like I don't know, Locky did! :wink:

Imo, Milford 1 and Barba 6 is at this stage the best thing for the team, but the reverse wouldn't be a deal breaker either, provided Barba slims down a bit and is 100% fit. It comes down to this imo:

- Barba is as good a 6 as Milford.
- Milford is a better fullback than Barba.
- Both are better fullbacks than Boyd.

We need to look at the Nikorimas future, not present, although unless he suffers a bad injury, Jayden is much more than an unknown and you know it.

Given Boyd's relationship with Wayne, it is highly unlikely he would lose a spot in the spine, which would leave only 2 spots for Jayden to come in and dispute with Hunt, Milford, Barba, Ash Taylor and his own brother. Hopefully he actually becomes a gun hooker, but he is and has always been primarily a fullback/halve.

 

[Porthoz]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

Yeah Porthoz!! why aren't you changing your opinions based on the strengths of our awesome arguments re Boyd:fish:

Haha, you win the internets! :laugh:

 

[Porthoz]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

B4L for Benevolent Dictator for Life.

Seriously, this thread is worse than the Griffin/Hoffman threads.

Mea culpa... I keep saying I won't argue, but then I can't resist answering. Sorry! :blushing:

 

[gordjw]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

Mea culpa... I keep saying I won't argue, but then I can't resist answering. Sorry! :blushing:

All good mate! We're all entitled to our rants/arguments/discussions. I enjoy hearing the different points of view that folks have. It's the circular part that gets me though.

 

[Big Pete]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

Agreed gordj.

In the future, if members can see that they're going around in circles I believe it'd be best that they just sum up all their points, lay them out and leave it there. Others can then choose to agree, disagree or move the conversation forward.

As far as this Boyd topic is concerned I see it as an inevitability and a very interesting part of the Bennett equation. No doubt that Boyd has not played to the best of his ability since 2011 but if he can reach those levels I believe he'll be worth every cent since he'll provide something the Broncos have struggled with for seasons now - a reliable option.

Yes, there are plenty of question marks and I would have liked to have seen us use the money on other positions but I don't see the point in crying over spilled milk.

There are other points that are being made that I don't necessarily agree with from both sides but for the time being I'll stick just with those three main points.

 

[broncos4life]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

If we only had Hodges, Hoffman and Eden, I would of course concede because your points are valid, but...

Unless you know of a contract clause saying that Milford is going to play 5/8, no coach should ever satisfy player's whims, and if him being at the back is the best option for the team, that's where he should play. He will have plenty of time to come through... like I don't know, Locky did! :wink:

Imo, Milford 1 and Barba 6 is at this stage the best thing for the team, but the reverse wouldn't be a deal breaker either, provided Barba slims down a bit and is 100% fit. It comes down to this imo:

- Barba is as good a 6 as Milford.
- Milford is a better fullback than Barba.
- Both are better fullbacks than Boyd.

We need to look at the Nikorimas future, not present, although unless he suffers a bad injury, Jayden is much more than an unknown and you know it.

Given Boyd's relationship with Wayne, it is highly unlikely he would lose a spot in the spine, which would leave only 2 spots for Jayden to come in and dispute with Hunt, Milford, Barba, Ash Taylor and his own brother. Hopefully he actually becomes a gun hooker, but he is and has always been primarily a fullback/halve.

I don't believe you can have both Barba and Milford in the spine. They are too much of the same player, except Milford is better. I really like Barba so I don't like saying this but I just don't see where he fits into the spine next year. He looked good at 6 but that was only against shit teams, and once the going got tough against sides like the storm and cowboys he was pretty unsighted.

I rate Boyd higher than you do but I'm not getting into that and I'm not getting into a comparison between Boyd and Barba because they are too intangible currently. Both of are different fullbacks and more importantly both of their form has been very patchy.

It will be up to Jayden to play his way into the squad in about two years time, if he can't play his way in then is it worth worrying about? I have massive wraps on Jayden (and while I think he is a future hooker, I'm not getting into that) but I still can't see how signing Boyd would impact him. He is a few years off yet and if he is the talent that most of us think he will be he will be able to push his way in then.

We have the opportunity to finally have some depth and competition in spine positions and I don't see why we should make sure there is a clear path right now for a guy that is at least a year (most likely more) off NRL.

 

[1910]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

He was a fullback. He was terrible at catching bombs. But now everyone knows it and will use it to their advantage. Like they already did this year. But whatever, man. I don't care anymore. No use having a discussion with people who don't listen to anything else.

Now everyone knows it? So he only just became terrible this year? So for from '08-'13 no one kicked a bomb to him?

 

[K-Style]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

Hoffman - The only think he brings to fullback is the ability to pad out your list. Everyone agrees he is a winger/centre and nothing more so why put him on the list

To be fair Hoffman was the best defender on the list (except for ?Milford?). He offers a strong run in attack but rarely offloads.

For mine I hope to see Oates and some other youngsters utilised a lot more next year. It was all to painful watching Oates/Kahu to warm the bench all season then get called to play more than 10min during the finals.

 

[Anonymous person]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

You claimed that Barba scored more than any Bronco player...and that was false. Barba did not score a tonne of tries, he in fact scored only 10. There were not just a few players who scored more than him, there were plenty ! And you know what's even more amazing ? Darius Boyd was one of them !!! So, yes not only was the claim factually wrong, it was very very wrong perfectly fitting my claim that it was outrageous. Typical of you that you cannot admit it was wrong and you seek to ameliorate it as well. A tiny off the cuff comment indeed, a stinking lie more precisely.

go back and read what i said. actually read it. maybe get someone with more education to read it to you.

i said, and i quote: "he still scored more tries than anyone in our team and most other teams".

You named 1 player in our team with more tries iirc? 26 others in the entire competition out of 300+ players seems like it fits under him scoring more than most other teams.

take off your rage goggles. its hilarious that out of everything being said, that is what you jumped up and down on and patted yourself on the back over lol.

 

[1910]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

Barba is playing today at the Murri Carnival at Redcliffe.

 

[sus]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

It could also be a kick in the pants for the players we have now, and make them lift their game a bit ?

I'm sure i also read somewhere that Bennett has stated that if Boyd doesn't lob here, that the fullback options we have will be more than adequate.

Bennett obviously knows what type of player he needs as our fullback ... somebody who will help execute the game plan that he has in mind.

spot on. bennetts a known antagonist and media stirrer.. whos to say what his motives were for saying all that. and bottom line, if the boyd signing does eventuate, ill put my money on the 6 time bronco premiership winning coach knowing exactly what the **** he's doing.. the bulldogs didnt win a premiership with one of the greatest form patches from a fullback in the modern game.... the raiders didnt do diddley with the greatest prospect in recent memory... the roosters won with anthony fucking minichiello, manly won one with brett stewart... i wont make any further reference to 2010. its not all about guns across the park, its about managing the sum of your available parts. boyd doesnt even need to hit top form to give us what we need.... we need a milf OR barba (both would be better im just guessing..) supplementing a calmer more methodical hunt, and some reliability and thoughtfulness at the back..

oh and if he goes to the titans ill eat my hat... LOL

 

[sus]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

Newcastle has already made very clear that they will not pay a cent towards his contract if he decides to action his get out clause.

Under the current salary cap rules, whichever club takes him, will have to at least pay his current contract value ($600K p/year), regardless of what the "Broncos financial administration" thinks of it.

There is no justification for this, when we have Milford, Barba, Hoffman, Hodges and both Nikorimas under contract... absolutely NONE!

I hope this is indeed a psych move by Bennett to get everyone on notice and make them work harder to earn a spot in the squad.

oh snap'd.......

good point.... will admit i wasnt lucidly aware of this. wouldnt change my tune exactly.. but would give me a shitty taste in my mouth.. if it does eventuate after all...

 

[Anonymous person]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

the bulldogs didnt win a premiership with one of the greatest form patches from a fullback in the modern game....

the bulldogs didnt win because they came up against the most determined bunch of blokes in the most dominant team that the NRL has ever seen in the grand final, with the best tactical coach possibly in rugby league history.

 

[sus]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

Even if that happened, which is highly unlikely (look at Milford's example), it still would be $400K of the Broncos cap, when we have 5 fullbacks (Milford, Barba, Hoffman, Hodges and Eden) and another 2 very promising ones coming through. No way this would be justified, ever!

I find it amusing that Boyd's depression is an excuse for his under-performing, yet Barba's psychological issues (for which he was also treated btw) are ignored, as well as his ankle injury, the fact he was bulked up, and the fact he was playing in a completely different tactical (if we can call it that) set-up than he was used to.


You keep banging about his bomb catching issues, but since you insist in ignoring everything else, I'm gonna have to annoy you again by repeating the same thing...

He doesn't only have attack, he is one of the best fullbacks defensively otherwise, easily out-performing Boyd in the try saving and positioning categories, is way more talented, has better passing, better kicking, is more elusive and without the extra weight and ankle injury, probably faster than Boyd.

After his spell at the Knights, Boyd is even less of a fullback, but he still does a job as a winger, outside of Inglis and Thursto...

(a hypothetical) $400K for a preimership winning, SOO and Kangaroo rep??? yep shit idea! cmon folks....

 

[sus]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

the bulldogs didnt win because they came up against the most determined bunch of blokes in the most dominant team that the NRL has ever seen in the grand final, with the best tactical coach possibly in rugby league history.

fair call...

...but if we come across those cap cheats again do we want a hardned rep or punt on the stalling once-upon-time dally M winner? ill take the boring as bat shit rep player and go maz to 92/93 back to back non-stop entertainment machines! L ;) why? because its not a reach to the stars to see boyd get back to some kind of form thats useful to us.. to see barba hit those highs (IMHO) would require some kind of self-determined transformation that would make oprah cream herself! (gratned, that would be worth it, figuratively and literally...)

 

[sus]

Re: Wayne Bennett related player movement discussion

To me its simple.

If all we had was Hoffman then i would be all for getting Boyd to play fullback as i actually think he is a better fullback than Hoffman.

If all we had was Milford and Hoffman i'd still be in favour of getting Boyd because Milf can play 5/8th and Hoffman can play wing or **** off.

The fact is we have Milford and Barba who i am pretty sure are contracted to us for the next 2 seasons. To me, both of those players need to be in the starting 13 and only to be replaced by injury or a very long period of sever bad form. Which one plays in the number 1 jersey and which one plays in the 6 would be up for debate. They are 2 marquee players who imo have the best value as starting players.

Boyd as a fullback is surplus to current requirements. If there was no bias by our coach, Boyd would be looked upon as a 2017 season option should Barba/Milford fail in the fullback role.

If someone like RTS from the Roosters knocked on our door and wanted a gig for next year at fullback he wouldnt be given the time of day even though he arguably provides as much benefit as Boyd.

this is a fair point. that said... the reality is that milford can still be moulded to what ever WB is planning. Barba has gone through all kinds of crap from Griffin's beefcake 3000 programme, todd greenbergs expert media mitigation strategies, succubi bombing advanced level 999,999 and syndemosis of the ankle or a broken toe nail or whatever the **** he did late last season - before we brilliantly decided to run him straight into the 9s).. it would take a brave one to call that bennett has any plane of honoring barbas contract here, let alone extending it. milford will be the future of this team, if not the core (unless hunt gets his shit together or nolan does DCEs cherry). which means theres room for another, and id take the proven performer in a dally m winner's heartbeat...