I hate the media!

[Professor47]

^
Interesting.

Yeh fair point schmix Todd did get a lot of cheers from the crowd.

Jester has a good point too, it is kind of crummy how this whole situation has panned out so far, but Gus is right, if this isn't the catalyst for something big to go down, then nothing ever will be, Seriously.

It will be interesting to hear more factual content later down the track - but without a doubt, this is the situation rugby league finds itself in today. From what I can tell, the channel 9 commentary team won't get into the topic anymore, the calls would be as usual, I doubt they will mention it in the call at all, if they do, probably briefly and same goes for the sunday shows. I could be wrong, but the opening segments they had tonight felt like that was what channel 9 had to say about the matty situation on a short term basis.

 

[Webcke]

I don't know who this waste of oxygen is, but FFS...how **** hard is it for the players to say NO. Just because a girl propositions you doesn't mean you have to accept. Especially since they seem to know it can go bad when the girl, probably in the cold light of sobriety, has retrospective second thoughts and can then make accusations or whatever.

Players really are just retards aren't they?

Obviously not the words of a man who gets propositioned by attractive females much.

Fantastic footy show tonight. Fatty and co all talked plenty of sense (Especially about that bloody Manly try.) Gus really put his heart out there tonight too. I feel for Matty, his life is down the shitter right now and he obviously realizes it. Would be a travesty if the Kiwi lady ends up being some psychotic bitch wanting payback like that lady on ACA said.

 

[gUt]

In fact, Gould has gone up a few notches in my book after his monolouge on the footy show tonight.

+1

 

[OXY-351]

It changes nothing of my opinion of Matt Johns nor channel 9's decision to stand him down. He has conducted himself in a manner that is, to the vast majority of people, disgusting and unacceptable.

So is everyone here saying that sacking Johns was/is the best thing to do, happy that Hunt and Thaiday are still playing for brisbane?

Or are people still going to continue to argue how this the sharks case is still so very different to the broncos case? Cause it seems remarkable similar to me given the new information that has come to light.

Jesus you keep harping on this.

It wasn't a dig at you, but yes, I do keep harping on about this cause their seems to be such double standards on this forum when it comes to the wrong doings of broncos players compared to others.

I really think if they want group sex, hire a **** prostitute, tell them what you want, pay them the cash, do the deed. They won't "cry rape".

Well you have missed the point then if you listen to the NRL and the general public. The whole issue here isn't rape as such, it's how NRL players treat women in a degrading fashion. How is having group sex with a prostitue any different to having group sex with a willing participant? Do you still think there wouldn't be negative headlines and public backlash if a team hired a prostitute?

 

[OXY-351]

The female journalist (I forget her name) on the footy show last night made a good point when she said that we are judging an event that happened 7 years ago on todays morals. Let's not forgot that the story was acutally reported in the media at the time, but back then it didn't make headlines for whatever reason, be that because it wasn't fashionable to bash league players at the time, or the general public was somewhat accepting of players engaging in this activity (which I doubt).

But bring it up in todays world where the public is highly sensitive towards NRL players behaviour, and it makes headline news for days.

It begs the question, how far do you go back. If some women came out and said that she had CONSENSUAL group sex with Fatty and others in the mid 80s, when it was probably somewhat accepted, should he then be judged on todays morals, and sacked from channel 9.

It's purely hypothetical I know (especially someone rooting fatty in the first place lol), but it does seem to potentially open a big can of worms.

 

[rnabokov]

How would we feel, and what would we do if our precious teenage daughter had group sex with a bunch of pissed footballers?

Of course, if she consented, we'd feel fine. We'd even praise her for doing it with one or more Icons of League. Maybe even thank Matty for his good taste in choosing our daughter.

Of course, it's got nothing to do with a Public Icon having any responsibility towards anyone but himself.

How would we feel, and what would we do if our daughter chose to become a prostitute?

Thank you darling - now you can pay your rent, and afford a ticket to Origin.

 

[OXY-351]

How would we feel, and what would we do if our precious teenage daughter had group sex with a bunch of pissed footballers?

Of course, if she consented, we'd feel fine. We'd even praise her for doing it with one or more Icons of League. Maybe even thank Matty for his good taste in choosing our daughter.

Of course, it's got nothing to do with a Public Icon having any responsibility towards anyone but himself.

How would we feel, and what would we do if our daughter chose to become a prostitute?

Thank you darling - now you can pay your rent, and afford a ticket to Origin.

Personally, if it was consensual, I wouldn't be blaming the footy players. I'd be questioning what sort of morals I instilled in my daughter to make her think that a situation like this is ok. Everyone seems to want to continue to blame the footy players, but if woman continue to put themselves in these degrading situations, then surely they've got to start taking some responsibility sooner or later.

Yes, the footy players have a resoponsibilty too, but it takes two to tango.

 

[lynx000]

Again, one of the points that I had made earlier. I know where you are coming from rna, and there is a tendency to jump on the attack from some against the woman involved, but in cases such as this one, there is some shared responsibility, although I believe most of the blame must fall against the other players involved who have come into the room.

 

[Coxy]

I really think if they want group sex, hire a **** prostitute, tell them what you want, pay them the cash, do the deed. They won't "cry rape".

Well you have missed the point then if you listen to the NRL and the general public. The whole issue here isn't rape as such, it's how NRL players treat women in a degrading fashion. How is having group sex with a prostitue any different to having group sex with a willing participant? Do you still think there wouldn't be negative headlines and public backlash if a team hired a prostitute?

Oh sure, if they found out about a prostitute being hired it'd be big news, front and back pages, blah blah. BUT, prostitutes (legit ones) have to be discreet. If they blabbed about their clients they wouldn't get much business would they?

I think what I and others find abhorrent about the group sex escapades is that, in most cases, they almost coerce young, impressionable women into a situation they're not prepared for or experienced with, and one which they're not able to handle (or the aftermath - the guilt etc).

So while group sex with a hooker is not morally any better, it's not as likely to come out in public and thus not bring shame to the players, the game, the clubs, or anybody.

 

[OXY-351]

I think what I and others find abhorrent about the group sex escapades is that, in most cases, they almost coerce young, impressionable women into a situation they're not prepared for or experienced with, and one which they're not able to handle (or the aftermath - the guilt etc).

Yeah, fair enough point. That's the one's we hear about anyway I guess.

I'd be interested to know how much group sex goes on between NRL players where the women truly is a willing participant, enjoys herself thoroughly and would never think about crying rape or traumatic damage, because she can't wait for her next installment.

If you believe some of the stories (like Vossy and that SMH journalist on the footy show last night), it would seem that group sex and offers of group sex from women is rife within the NRL, and your "Clare" type of women who is coerced in to it and regrets it later, is actually in the minority.

If these stories are true, the NRL and Clubs are certainly going to face an uphill battle if they are trying to get this stuff out of the game.

 

[gUt]

I think what I and others find abhorrent about the group sex escapades is that, in most cases, they almost coerce young, impressionable women into a situation they're not prepared for or experienced with, and one which they're not able to handle (or the aftermath - the guilt etc).

Yeah, fair enough point. That's the one's we hear about anyway I guess.

I'd be interested to know how much group sex goes on between NRL players where the women truly is a willing participant, enjoys herself thoroughly and would never think about crying rape or traumatic damage, because she can't wait for her next installment.

If you believe some of the stories (like Vossy and that SMH journalist on the footy show last night), it would seem that group sex and offers of group sex from women is rife within the NRL, and your "Clare" type of women who is coerced in to it and regrets it later, is actually in the minority.

If these stories are true, the NRL and Clubs are certainly going to face an uphill battle if they are trying to get this stuff out of the game.

It's not a fair enough point. How do you know that anyone has ever been 'coerced'?

 

[Coxy]

By coerced I don't mean "do it or piss off", more like, she meets one bloke at the bar, they chat, get flirty, invites her back to the hotel for a ****...and then "oh, do you mind if my mate joins in?" and then "how about another?" and another and another...and then the nice flirtatious behaviour makes way for the "circle jerk" that Jeanette mentioned where they just laugh and joke amongst themselves, ignore her, treat her like shit etc.

I reckon that scenario is probably pretty common amongst the group sex culture. I can't imagine it's THAT easy to find a chick who you can say "hey, want to **** me and 10 of my mates?" and she goes "oh yeah, sure, let's go". At least not without saying "I charge $500 an hour, and here's my rules".

 

[Nashy]

DVDA!

 

[Coxy]

Give up Nashy...nobody's going to touch that one! :P

 

[Kaz]

Coxyz

You got a different interview to what you saw.

I got the interview were he was talking about the players being hassled for photos & autographs.

 

[rnabokov]

I just find it hard to take that, (supposedly) mature, adult males have little compunction in having it off with teenage girls - “groupies†or otherwise, particularly if the men are married, and worse, have daughters themselves.

It's just such a clear case of taking advantage of someone in a weaker position of power - regardless of the moral and ethical skills parents have tried to instill in their children.

(Yeah - it happens, it's been happening and no doubt, it will keep happening. But that doesn't make it right, nor does it absolved the responsible(?) adult males from being accountable for their actions.)

It's one thing to say the girl agreed, but who really, in the interests of a just, fair and decent society, will lay the primary responsibility in these situations on the too often doey-eyed (and/or pissed) teenage girl?

What a nice place the world would be if we all did the right thing by and for each other.

 

[OXY-351]

I can't imagine it's THAT easy to find a chick who you can say "hey, want to **** me and 10 of my mates?" and she goes "oh yeah, sure, let's go". At least not without saying "I charge $500 an hour, and here's my rules".

See I reckon if you're a high profile football player, it probably isn't that hard. There are a lot of skanks in this world who would get off on that sort of stuff.

Not sure if you saw any of the footy show, but Vossy was saying a high profile NRL player offered to take him out for a night on the town so Vossy could see it from an NRL players perspective. The player (who vossy didn't name) said that last weekend he went out for a few drinks cause his team had the bye, and within 5 minutes of walking in to the place he went, had already had 2 offers of one-on-one sex, along with another of group sex.

I personally know of 2 girls who have had group sex with NRL players. Sure they aren't probably the norm, but I reckon there is enough of them out there for 16 NRL teams.

 

[Coxy]

I just find it hard to take that (supposedly) mature, adult males have little compunction in having it off with teenage girls - “groupies†or otherwise, particularly if the men are married, and worse, have daughters themselves.

(Yeah - it happens, it's been happening and no doubt, it will keep happening. But that doesn't make it right, nor does it absolved the responsible(?) adult males from being accountable for their actions.)

It's one thing to say the girl agreed, but who really, in the interests of a just, fair and decent society, will lay the primary responsibility in these situations on the too often doey-eyed (and/or pissed) teenage girl?

What a nice place the world would be if we all did the right thing by and for each other.

Absolutely!

And while some of the players aren't much older (and definitely no more mature) than those doey eyed and/or pissed teenage groupies, many of them, like Johns, are. And it's the behaviour of those guys, guys who should know better and respect their responsibilities to their families and to the game more who are the ones that cause the likes of Telstra to re-think pouring millions of dollars into the game each year.

Whispers have already started that Telstra won't continue their sponsorship in light of the negative press over the past few years.

And before someone repeats the subject of this thread and blames the reporters - don't shoot the messenger. The players are the ones that are guilty. They're the ones fucking up and giving these guys ammunition.

We need to stop making excuses for them (they're just dumb footballers, you can't expect any more from them), start educating them, start drumming into them what the consequences can and will be and get them to sort their shit out. If it means being hard line, and that some of the players who really want to be fucking idiots go and play some other sport in some other country - good bye, have a good one, try not to catch a disease...

As Gallop said, if they want to do this stuff, don't play rugby league at the highest level.

OXY: I'm not doubting they're out there. But the fact is how can you be sure that wide eyed, big titted young woman who offers group sex isn't going to get an attack of the guilts and make a fuss about it after the fact? Who has more to lose? The woman, or the players?

Until the players get it through their incredibly thick skulls that they stand to lose far more than an orgy is worth they're going to keep getting in trouble.