Ivan, Ivan, Ivan

[Charmamba]

I think the Broncos need to look to the long term with the players that are eligible for both Toyota Cup and QCup (Beale, Norman etc). Play them in the QCup. It might look good for the club if the U20's win a Premiership, but as has been discussed on here, it is not a good stepping stone to the NRL.

^^^ This. But I also think the Broncos should cut ties with at least 3 QLD Cup clubs, and divide their players amongst at most 3 QLD Cup clubs.

And those clubs should agree to be part of the Broncos coaching culture and coach the players in areas Henjak wants.

East, Wynnum, Redcliff

 

[Bucking Beads]

I think the Broncos need to look to the long term with the players that are eligible for both Toyota Cup and QCup (Beale, Norman etc). Play them in the QCup. It might look good for the club if the U20's win a Premiership, but as has been discussed on here, it is not a good stepping stone to the NRL.

^^^ This. But I also think the Broncos should cut ties with at least 3 QLD Cup clubs, and divide their players amongst at most 3 QLD Cup clubs.

And those clubs should agree to be part of the Broncos coaching culture and coach the players in areas Henjak wants.

East, Wynnum,Norths

Redcliffe can suffer in there jocks.

 

[Flutterby]

100% agree Jeb, Q Cup is a much better preparation for NRL than the Toyota Cup and I remember WB stating publicly when the Toyota Cup first came in that the Broncos would still play their best youngsters in the Q-Cup. However as I understand things, the NRL were very very unhappy with this prospect and put a fair bit of unofficial pressure on the club to change this approach.

Also agree with Coxy for the the Broncos success they need to cut down the number of Q Cup clubs they are affiliated with and need to treat that team (or teams) basically as a Broncos Reserve Grade side, so they are 100% linked to the club.

 

[Jeba]

100% agree Jeb, Q Cup is a much better preparation for NRL than the Toyota Cup and I remember WB stating publicly when the Toyota Cup first came in that the Broncos would still play their best youngsters in the Q-Cup. However as I understand things, the NRL were very very unhappy with this prospect and put a fair bit of unofficial pressure on the club to change this approach.

Also agree with Coxy for the the Broncos success they need to cut down the number of Q Cup clubs they are affiliated with and need to treat that team (or teams) basically as a Broncos Reserve Grade side, so they are 100% linked to the club.

From what I hear, at the start of 2009 when the Broncos under 20's were going ordinary, the Broncos decided it's "not a good look" for them to have their under 20's going crap so that's why they took Hunt, Yow Yeh, McGuire etc out of their QCup teams and put them in the U20's.

 

[Flutterby]

Perplexed and defiant, Brisbane Broncos coach Ivan Henjak says he will lead the club next season in spite of "scurrilous" rumours his job is in danger and he has fallen out with his playing group.

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/rugby-l ... 15dwh.html

He makes some EXCELLENT points:

"I don't know whether too many people tipped us to make the eight this year. I don't know why all of a sudden we've been a huge failure," Henjak said.

"Our expectations are we want to win the competition every year, but we had a lot of things go against us this year.

"We lost a lot of good players last year, we had the youngest team in the competition, we lost our best strike player before the season even kicked off, we lost our captain at a crucial part of the year again.

"I don't know how I've become a really ordinary coach in five weeks time.

"In our last game, we were playing for a spot in the semi finals. Five weeks before that, in everyone's eyes we were a real chance of winning the competition.

"In five weeks time, I don't know what's changed."

"I know we made a decision a couple of years ago to go down this path, probably realised that this year was going to be the hardest of those years and it turned out it was a difficult year, made more difficult by things you'd hope don't happen.

"Of course it was going to happen [eventually missing the finals]. I hope it doesn't but it will more than likely happen again at some stage. But people need to be realistic about this footy team and where we are at the moment."

 

[Mister Wright]

Yeah, it's been a total over-reaction. I'm sure if Bennett had of missed the finals in 2007 there would have been some made up articles in the Courier Mail criticizing him.

 

[Raw Boned Youngster]

The important point is about the stability of the group.
If there is disharmony or disrespect or disanything in the squad, something has to give.
In the scheme of things and the power pyramid, Ivan would certainly be the one to be cut loose.
The problem is that if a replacement was appointed, it would be for a brief tenure as Locky appears destined to be offered the chalice. That probably wouldn't be too appealing to too many potential applicants.

 

[Huge]

The obvious problem should be addressed first.
Why do we have the youngest and most inexperienced team and who took the decision ???
Why are we in a competition if our goal was to build rather than compete for the title ??
When did first grade Nrl become a training ground for the future ??
Why did we choose to field a novice team led by a novice coach ??

I'm sick to death of this pathetic excuse being trotted out each week to defend the piss poor result this year and to cover up the glaring deficiency of the management.

We pay for and support a professional first grade standard team to represent Brisbane and environs but we are given a team of juniors and a management who did not spend the cap limit so that the (financial statement)numbers looked better. We obviously had money in reserve as we bought Tronc mid season and everyone knows NRL standard front-rowers do not come cheaply.

It also high-lighted the poor planning when Tronc became our first picked prop. It begs the question, how bad would we have been in the go-forward department were it not for the lucky pick-up that Tronc was ?

Henjak and Cullen can offer these shit excuses each week but I for one will never blame anyone else but them. Absolute bullshit...they chose this path but now want to blame other things for the results. Weak as piss.

 

[Anonymous person]

Why do we have the youngest and most inexperienced team and who took the decision ???
Why are we in a competition if our goal was to build rather than compete for the title ??
When did first grade Nrl become a training ground for the future ??
Why did we choose to field a novice team led by a novice coach ??

1. kinda happens when all your old players leave
2. our goal is to win every year, like henjak said
3. since players started playing in the NRL from the age of 17
4. because we only had novice players and a novice coach

We obviously had money in reserve as we bought Tronc mid season and everyone knows NRL standard front-rowers do not come cheaply.

when theyre someone whos been playing overseas, hating it and wants to come back - specifically to brisbane because he grew up here and his family all live here - midseason, yes, they do.

 

[Huge]

I agree with you AP..right again, I'll simply change my opinion to align with yours

 

[Anonymous person]

I agree with you AP..right again, I'll simply change my opinion to align with yours

you asked questions, i answered them. boohoo.

 

[Huge]

Answer question...failed to do so. When you do answer the questions I will respond...otherwise your right as usual.

 

[Anonymous person]

Answer question...failed to do so. When you do answer the questions I will respond...otherwise your right as usual.

put that head further in the sand, i can still hear you.

 

[Fozz]

Answer question...failed to do so.

Is that you, Yoda?!??

 

[Flutterby]

I thought AP's answers were pretty much spot on. Here's another answer for you re why we didn't spend all of our cap (the answer is twofold)

a) because a large proportion of the cap had been set aside for Karmichael Hunt, who dicked the club around for most of last year and then left to play Union/AFL

b) because the players (or type therefore) we needed and wanted either weren't available or wanted more than we could afford to pay them - no point spend the money senselessly/wastefully just because we have it; far better to keep it in reserve for any mid-season signings that may come up, as happened with Tronc. {as an aside, when Tronc came back he was signed for match payments only - hardly a massive spend}

But no doubt you will also choose to ignore this as any kind of answer.

 

[Huge]

I read your response and have not ignored it. What you and AP consider an answer is different to that which I consider to be an answer.

Henjak stated that this was the direction we( BRONCOS) consciously took. He also stated we were aware that this season would be our worst result.

In other words we chose a direction which we knew would result in a season of failure. That does not strike you as odd but it sure as hell shits me. If your happy with the direction the club has taken then that's fine for you. It is not for me though.

Someone or some group decided to go down this youth at all costs path, I feel it to be a stupid decision.

For me a team should be a blend of youth and experience and as is clearly evidenced by the current successful teams left in the comp.

We had as much money as any other team and with a much more attractive club to go to. If we were unable to attract and sign the good players that were around and needed by our side then clearly the administration was at fault. No excuses can be offered as we had the same or better chance to sign good players over the last 2 seasons.

Total bullshit to say that there were no players available, absolute crap. The fact that we had no go forward was high lighted by the signing of Tronc. A lucky result only. Had we not fluked signing Tronc we would have had virtually no big men.

I'm not ignoring anything, I see with my own eyes ineptitude in player acquisition and retention.

 

[Anonymous person]

I read your response and have not ignored it. What you and AP consider an answer is different to that which I consider to be an answer.

Henjak stated that this was the direction we( BRONCOS) consciously took. He also stated we were aware that this season would be our worst result.

In other words we chose a direction which we knew would result in a season of failure. That does not strike you as odd but it sure as hell shits me. If your happy with the direction the club has taken then that's fine for you. It is not for me though.

Someone or some group decided to go down this youth at all costs path, I feel it to be a stupid decision.

For me a team should be a blend of youth and experience and as is clearly evidenced by the current successful teams left in the comp.

an answer is an answer. just because someone doesnt give the answer you want doesnt mean you ignore it.

yes, the broncos organisation consciously took the direction of 'rebuilding' the team with young players. Losing Hunt wasnt part of that decision though. losing Hodges before the season wasnt part of that decision. Losing Hannant wouldnt have been part of that decision. these things all happened without warning, and there was nothing the Broncos couldve done to prevent them happening. if we still had those players, we would have had a good mix of experienced players and new players. it wasnt a 'youth at all costs' path - it was a bring in new players path. the fact that we lost our experienced guys all of a sudden and against our will, then had injuries all year, doesnt mean that thats what we wanted to happen.

he didnt say that he knew it would give us a season of failure. as he did say, their expectations are to win the competition every year. does that really sound to you like he was expecting a year of failure? if we had Hunt/Hannant/Hodges, and didnt lose Lockyer for like 7-8 matches, we wouldve made the finals. 100% guaranteed. then we wouldnt be having this discussion.

previously the broncos were the 'dads army' team. they just held onto players that they shouldve let go (brad thorn rings a bell) years ago, then when they all left we were left with nothing. didnt we lose like 9 players after 2000? the team that played the world club challenge barely even resembled the team that won the premiership 6 months earlier. the Brisbane Lions did the same thing - they went after one more premiership by holding onto all the guys who won the previous 3, instead of bringing in some youth, and they paid the price. it wrecked their team for a few years after that.

the broncos over the last 2 years have tried to bring in youth while keeping experienced guys there. injuries and players shafting us and leaving have made that a lot harder than it was going to be.

 

[Flutterby]

Henjak stated that this was the direction we( BRONCOS) consciously took. He also stated we were aware that this season would be our worst result.

He also stated "Our expectations are we want to win the competition every year" - hardly planning for a season of failure. No-one planned that Hodges would miss the entire season and no-one planned that Locky would miss the last 3/4 weeks. And no-one planned that Hunt would be a dick when it came to contract negotiations or that Hannant would just follow the money. That's a whole heap of the experience part of the youth/experience blend right there that happened purely from bad luck.

If your happy with the direction the club has taken then that's fine for you.

Actually I am pretty happy with the directly the club has and is taking in developing for future and long-term success, not just the here and now short term success that a rare and far between bought premiership is.

Total bullshit to say that there were no players available, absolute crap.

Really? Tell me which top line forwards were available for us to buy for 2010