PRE-GAME PRE-GAME [Round 9, 2023] Broncos vs Rabbitohs

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BroncosFever said:
I know it looks like a shit show but it's actually a good opportunity for a few guys to step in and stand up.

The top clubs who win premierships usually have to go through these sort of situations, there's an opportunity there for a couple of players.
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I'm not worried about Madden in for Mam, he will do a job for one game. Haas on the other hand is just about irreplaceable.
 
Sproj said:
We are in a position where we can fight the charges and so we should. Well with Haas especially. Mam won’t get off because reasons but Haas should definitely challenge.
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If the MRC thought Payne's tackle was borderline wouldn't they have graded him lower than Ezra? Seems like it's not worth the risk of losing him another week to me. One week is okay. I thought it would be worse.

No one seems to understand how to grade these tackles. Least of all us fans. I guess, in your argument's favour if the Broncos were to be successfully in downgrading Payne, it might set a precedent. And, accepting it would also set a precedent.

If I were to try to form an opinion on this it would that the coaches and officials have a round table on what they hope to achieve with this and determine if it's fair and even possible.
 
McHunt said:
If the MRC thought Payne's tackle was borderline wouldn't they have graded him lower than Ezra? Seems like it's not worth the risk of losing him another week to me. One week is okay. I thought it would be worse.

No one seems to understand how to grade these tackles. Least of all us fans. I guess, in your argument's favour if the Broncos were to be successfully in downgrading Payne, it might set a precedent. And, accepting it would also set a precedent.

If I were to try to form an opinion on this it would that the coaches and officials have a round table on what they hope to achieve with this and determine if it's fair and even possible.
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The game needs to have a concreate ruling on this because right now this huge grey area around it still results in a sin binning from it which is a huge game changing penalty, it's unacceptable for them to not get to the bottom of it asap.
 
The disconnect is that the bunker didn't deem it to be a hip drop however the MRC did.

The only thing that happened in that time is that the details of RCG's injury came to light. It's not a sudden shock, they usually adjudicate based on injuries. If RCG isn't hurt, no problem. Not even a penalty. We're probably the only sport in the world to punish based on injury.
 
Mustafur said:
The game needs to have a concreate ruling on this because right now this huge grey area around it still results in a sin binning from it which is a huge game changing penalty, it's unacceptable for them to not get to the bottom of it asap.
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Seems like it's a work in progress. I'm not sure how "concrete" you can make it when it relies on a certain amount of subjectivity. Like distinguishing between intentional and careless. You can't put the judiciary in a position of needing to read the player's mind.

The judiciary is different from the ref. They have to time to deliberate and attempt to establish a standard. A referee is more subject to whim, going with the flow and is understood to make human errors - hence the appeal process.

I can certainly see an argument that Payne wasn't solely responsible for the position he was in at the completion of that tackle. The question then is: should he/could he have mitigated it? He had no control over Kobe's interaction. That's one vector.

If I were the club I would take it on the chin, but @Sproj is right that there's both a case to contest, and it's in the benefit of the competition to do so. The "early guilty plea" really sucks. Every player should have the right to please his case without being further penalized.

Otherwise, down the track fans will question why their player got two weeks and Payne only got one, and accuse the NRL of favouring the Broncos.
 
McHunt said:
Maybe get rid of the referees altogether and replace them with something else, for example umpires.
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I also noticed, that you did not answer the question as to which of the referee's decisions was the correct one.

I know you love the game, and I know you think challenging the integrity of the referees is the wrong way to go about improving the game, but many of us are of the opinion that criticism can bring improvement. However, in the current game Refs are beyond reproach. Klein made a mistake, and rather than owning up to it, he flubbed it completely. He won't face much of anything for this instance, and that is passively enabling him to continue with his poor judgements and not improve.

It could have cost the Broncos the game. It did not, but it could have. The intent is constructive criticism in the hopes of improving the game. The whole conspiracy side of things is just spice and a form of pressure towards making the league work towards eliminating these suspicions. I.e., get rid of the stink of betting agencies, honestly and critically assess referee performances instead of reactionary justifications of their errors, etc.

McHunt said:
If the MRC thought Payne's tackle was borderline wouldn't they have graded him lower than Ezra? Seems like it's not worth the risk of losing him another week to me. One week is okay. I thought it would be worse.

No one seems to understand how to grade these tackles. Least of all us fans. I guess, in your argument's favour if the Broncos were to be successfully in downgrading Payne, it might set a precedent. And, accepting it would also set a precedent.

If I were to try to form an opinion on this it would that the coaches and officials have a round table on what they hope to achieve with this and determine if it's fair and even possible.
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I think here you provide a good example of how the NRL really does need to improve. We, the fans, deserve to be better informed, and I hope the MRC provides a thorough analysis of these rulings. That way we will be able to know when our team will be fairly punished or not.

Your solution is a good one, and it is a good democratic way of solving the problem. However, as was pointed out earlier, the hip drop has been identified in the game for years now. It was issued as a memorandum at the beginning of the season, and we are now seeing a crackdown. A crackdown that is being poorly carried out in a reactionary manner and with little transparency. The NRL should have immediately requested this round table and nailed the details precisely.

The hip drop will, this season at least, be applied inconsistently, randomly, and with very little understanding overall if this continues. It will affect results, and therefore careers. For example, if Broncos lose next week, will we know it was due to Haas' absence? If Haas does challenge, will we know he was never going to win the Dally M? If a lesser-known player is suspended, will his performance that season be assessed differently due to playing less games, and will that affect potential contract negotiations?
 
If we were to somehow beat souffs without Haas and Mam, I’d say we are well into the premiership race, if we hadn’t already proved it.
I have Souffs as favourites to win the comp this year but I’d love nothing more then to see us get a win against all the odds.
My worry is that we are still such a raw side, I feel if we get pumped next week that could really hurt our chances through this tough run we have.
 
Organix said:
I also noticed, that you did not answer the question as to which of the referee's decisions was the correct one.

I know you love the game, and I know you think challenging the integrity of the referees is the wrong way to go about improving the game, but many of us are of the opinion that criticism can bring improvement. However, in the current game Refs are beyond reproach. Klein made a mistake, and rather than owning up to it, he flubbed it completely. He won't face much of anything for this instance, and that is passively enabling him to continue with his poor judgements and not improve.
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I didn't pay any attention to it.

I know how hard their job is. I know they make mistakes. I know the players cheat and lie. I know the fans get it wrong more than anyone. I know ex-players commentating are want to hyperbolize. I just go with the flow, accept whatever position gets meted out and move on. Bank errors in and against your favour are part of every sport. You can choose to get worked up in a frenzy over every instance or you can see it as inevitable.

So that's why I didn't answer. I happen to the think the refereeing in the NRL is pretty damn impressive and massively transparent. There are so many checks and balances - bunker, appeal, live slo-mos, thousands of fans watching live, press conferences explaining decisions (and occasionally admitting fault) - it's a waste of energy constructing conspiracy theories. No one is perfect.

The judiciary and MRC process, however, is not transparent. They could improve that.
 
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McHunt said:
I didn't pay any attention to it.

I know how hard their job is. I know they make mistakes. I know the players cheat and lie. I know the fans get it wrong more than anyone. I know ex-players commentating are want to hyperbolize. I just go with the flow, accept whatever position gets meted out and move on. Bank errors in and against your favour are part of every sport. You can choose to get worked up in a frenzy over every instance or you can see it as inevitable.

So that's why I didn't answer. I happen to the think the refereeing in the NRL is pretty damn impressive. There are so many checks and balances - bunker, appeal, live slo-mos, thousands of fans watching live, press conferences explaining decisions (and occasionally admitting fault) - it's a waste of energy constructing conspiracy theories. No one is perfect.
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I guess it all depends on how you engage with the sport. For many, constructing conspiracy theories around the sport is part of the enjoyment of it. I assume in your case, contradicting them or defending the league brings you something too, otherwise you would just ignore it. Furthermore, if theories weren't being generated, then no conspiracies would be actually found, and also a number of questionable actions would simply continue and drive the league towards collapse. For example, the Storm "two books" conspiracy being proven true. For that reason, we should continue with the "Salary Sombrero" conspiracy, IMO.

I agree it is impressive, but the refs should not be beyond reproach. Klein made a mistake last night, and it should be criticised, and he should be reprimanded for it. This is part of the checks and balances of any job as you said. It remains to be seen as to whether the fallout from our match will be subject to them. Until then, the fans should be free to theorise.
 
Organix said:
I agree it is impressive, but the refs should not be beyond reproach. Klein made a mistake last night, and it should be criticised, and he should be reprimanded for it. This is part of the checks and balances of any job as you said. It remains to be seen as to whether the fallout from our match will be subject to them. Until then, the fans should be free to theorise.
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They are subject to reproach through their own organizational structure. While they're expected to make mistakes - they're human - some can get them demoted, suspended or even sacked. They also have their own coaches.

Coaching staff

Here is the list of National Rugby League (NRL) referee coaching staff.
www.nrl.com www.nrl.com
 
Super fun fact: our forthcoming match against Souths will be Jock Madden's 2nd win out of 7 starts at five-eighth.
 
Good work nrl. Souffs will pull those sydney clubs closer to us now, sure Penrith and souths need the help given the last few years. And wtf is the challenge system? You get 1 more week if you fail? How fucked is that. Are they suddenly more guilty for daring to challenge the almighty nrl? What a complete mess of a corrupt system...

On the game, I hope Walters picks tapau to start, but doesn't name him till the last minute. Tell him first 15 mins of the game and the last 15 mins of the game he needs to bring his aggression. He's been great. Jensen plays the middle 50 mins, hethrington plays more minutes, and give paliaasia middle 20-30 mins. He's not great but he does do enough to hold the middle although would be tempting to bring in a bit more x factor like willison or piakura potentially.

I hope Walters puts a rocket up flegler (especially) and carrigan to say "who's gonna prove we are more than payne with this pack?!"

Madden for mam is obvious. And I hope he just runs, runs, runs like it sounds like he has in qld cup..
 
Lockysillegitimatechild said:
Good work nrl. Souffs will pull those sydney clubs closer to us now, sure Penrith and souths need the help given the last few years. And wtf is the challenge system? You get 1 more week if you fail? How fucked is that. Are they suddenly more guilty for daring to challenge the almighty nrl? What a complete mess of a corrupt system...

On the game, I hope Walters picks tapau to start, but doesn't name him till the last minute. Tell him first 15 mins of the game and the last 15 mins of the game he needs to bring his aggression. He's been great. Jensen plays the middle 50 mins, hethrington plays more minutes, and give paliaasia middle 20-30 mins. He's not great but he does do enough to hold the middle although would be tempting to bring in a bit more x factor like willison or piakura potentially.

I hope Walters puts a rocket up flegler (especially) and carrigan to say "who's gonna prove we are more than payne with this pack?!"

Madden for mam is obvious. And I hope he just runs, runs, runs like it sounds like he has in qld cup..
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Willison hasn't played in nearly a month.
 
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