The Premier League thread 07/08

Leo said:
robbie mustoe said:
I cannot believe you guys still think Alonso is good. He has been atrocious for so long now, what does he have to do?

As far as my Liverpool bias goes, sure I admit that I hate them, but I think I can still admit it if their players are good. Torres and Agger for instance, are top class IMO. But players like Xabi, Pennant, Kuyt and Babel just do not produce the goods often enough for them ever to be part of a premiership winning squad. Liverpool fans claim they want to be challenging for the premiership but then continue to tolerate players that belong at aston villa and man city.

As a Liverpool fan I largely agree (though IMO you are very wrong about Babel - will be a top top player in a few years). Nothing wrong with Alonso either, much better than Carrick. In general though we sign too many players who simply are not worthy of winning a premiership (Pennant, Benayoun, Voronin etc.). And now news of chasing Gareth Barry? He's a big fish in a small pond. We play in big ponds and need big pond fish, which Barry is not. If you ask me we should be going after Lucas Podolksi. In fact, I'm considering running for chairman of LFC and campaigning on signing Podolski and selling Pennant and Benayoun icon_thumbs_u

Babel may be a top class player in a few years but it will not be in the Premiership. Half of Liverpool's problem is Benitez's transfer policy. He signs players that are overly technical and require time to execute. Alonso is one of these. I used to watch him in La Liga and the UCL and think he was good, but it has been at least 18 months since I saw him turn in a good performance for 'pool in the EPL, he has been woeful and he freely admits it.

Obviously the likes of Barry is just another example of Liverpool's fake ambition. Rafa will sign 5 more so-so players and all of the thieves will start crowing about how they are going to romp in the Premiership. They will again finish fourth and the merry-go-round will start all over again. Not complaining though, I find it pretty funny.
 
Alonso's best matches are for Spain and in Europe as he gets the time on the ball to execute, which he can do superbly and does so in the EPL but pretty inconsistently. Lots of talent but he has never really shown it since he moved to England. Houllier was the same as Benitez with signing the 2nd instead of 1st tier players outside of Torres, Gerrard, Reina, Carragher, Agger they lack true class and continuing to sign guys like Beneyoun, Voronin, Pennant just gives them more average players to choose from and then rotate.
 
FCB BB AKA MB said:
Alonso's best matches are for Spain and in Europe as he gets the time on the ball to execute, which he can do superbly and does so in the EPL but pretty inconsistently. Lots of talent but he has never really shown it since he moved to England. Houllier was the same as Benitez with signing the 2nd instead of 1st tier players outside of Torres, Gerrard, Reina, Carragher, Agger they lack true class and continuing to sign guys like Beneyoun, Voronin, Pennant just gives them more average players to choose from and then rotate.

Hmmm, i don't think his signings have been all that bad TBH.

Torres
Mascherano
Reina
Agger
Skrtel
Babel
Alonso
Garcia

Sure we've spent money on lesser players, but we needed to build up our squad after ridding ourselves of all the deadwood from GH's era.
 
ningnangnong said:
FCB BB AKA MB said:
Alonso's best matches are for Spain and in Europe as he gets the time on the ball to execute, which he can do superbly and does so in the EPL but pretty inconsistently. Lots of talent but he has never really shown it since he moved to England. Houllier was the same as Benitez with signing the 2nd instead of 1st tier players outside of Torres, Gerrard, Reina, Carragher, Agger they lack true class and continuing to sign guys like Beneyoun, Voronin, Pennant just gives them more average players to choose from and then rotate.

Hmmm, i don't think his signings have been all that bad TBH.

And there-in lies the problem IMO. We should demand more than 'all that bad'. Tevez, Rooney, Ronaldo, Vidic? Signings that weren't all that bad? Nope, they are great signings (albeit they are grade-A wankers). The champions are buying the best while we aren't doing too badly. Not doing too badly is for shit teams like Middlesbrough and marginally less mediocre ones like Everton. Gareth Barry, Benayoun, Pennant aren't all that bad a player, but they aren't Premiership winners.

Vote 1 Lucas Podolski icon_thumbs_u
 
Leo said:
ningnangnong said:
FCB BB AKA MB said:
Alonso's best matches are for Spain and in Europe as he gets the time on the ball to execute, which he can do superbly and does so in the EPL but pretty inconsistently. Lots of talent but he has never really shown it since he moved to England. Houllier was the same as Benitez with signing the 2nd instead of 1st tier players outside of Torres, Gerrard, Reina, Carragher, Agger they lack true class and continuing to sign guys like Beneyoun, Voronin, Pennant just gives them more average players to choose from and then rotate.

Hmmm, i don't think his signings have been all that bad TBH.

And there-in lies the problem IMO. We should demand more than 'all that bad'. Tevez, Rooney, Ronaldo, Vidic? Signings that weren't all that bad? Nope, they are great signings (albeit they are grade-A wankers). The champions are buying the best while we aren't doing too badly. Not doing too badly is for shit teams like Middlesbrough and marginally less mediocre ones like Everton. Gareth Barry, Benayoun, Pennant aren't all that bad a player, but they aren't Premiership winners.

Vote 1 Lucas Podolski icon_thumbs_u

Podolski would be fantastic for Liverpool but do you think you can pry him away from Bayern?
 
Scotty said:
Leo said:
ningnangnong said:
FCB BB AKA MB said:
Alonso's best matches are for Spain and in Europe as he gets the time on the ball to execute, which he can do superbly and does so in the EPL but pretty inconsistently. Lots of talent but he has never really shown it since he moved to England. Houllier was the same as Benitez with signing the 2nd instead of 1st tier players outside of Torres, Gerrard, Reina, Carragher, Agger they lack true class and continuing to sign guys like Beneyoun, Voronin, Pennant just gives them more average players to choose from and then rotate.

Hmmm, i don't think his signings have been all that bad TBH.

And there-in lies the problem IMO. We should demand more than 'all that bad'. Tevez, Rooney, Ronaldo, Vidic? Signings that weren't all that bad? Nope, they are great signings (albeit they are grade-A wankers). The champions are buying the best while we aren't doing too badly. Not doing too badly is for shit teams like Middlesbrough and marginally less mediocre ones like Everton. Gareth Barry, Benayoun, Pennant aren't all that bad a player, but they aren't Premiership winners.

Vote 1 Lucas Podolski icon_thumbs_u

Podolski would be fantastic for Liverpool but do you think you can pry him away from Bayern?

Toni and Klose occupy the Bayern frontline and Podolski is making some noise at Allianz. He recently refused to rule out a summer transfer move. It's probably a little bit of a tactic on his behalf but if we showed genuine interest in him and pursued him I don't see why not. You add him with Babel and Torres and you play a 4-5-1/4-3-3 system similar to what Lyon and Barca use. Podolski gives you options in deadball situations being a leftie and his style in general should create a good mix of options in the front three. Also Podolski is 23 this year, Torres 24 and Babel 22. There's your forward line for at least 5 years and probably more and then you can just work on fixing the midfield. Gerrard in the hole behind and Mascherano as the holding player - just need a proper playmaker in between the two - Luka Modric perhaps? Alonso to provide cover and Benayoun and Pennant to provide $2 of the funds to get Podolski.

I seriously think I should be doing Parry's job! [icon_razz1
 
Leo said:
ningnangnong said:
FCB BB AKA MB said:
Alonso's best matches are for Spain and in Europe as he gets the time on the ball to execute, which he can do superbly and does so in the EPL but pretty inconsistently. Lots of talent but he has never really shown it since he moved to England. Houllier was the same as Benitez with signing the 2nd instead of 1st tier players outside of Torres, Gerrard, Reina, Carragher, Agger they lack true class and continuing to sign guys like Beneyoun, Voronin, Pennant just gives them more average players to choose from and then rotate.

Hmmm, i don't think his signings have been all that bad TBH.

And there-in lies the problem IMO. We should demand more than 'all that bad'. Tevez, Rooney, Ronaldo, Vidic? Signings that weren't all that bad? Nope, they are great signings (albeit they are grade-A wankers). The champions are buying the best while we aren't doing too badly. Not doing too badly is for shit teams like Middlesbrough and marginally less mediocre ones like Everton. Gareth Barry, Benayoun, Pennant aren't all that bad a player, but they aren't Premiership winners.

Vote 1 Lucas Podolski icon_thumbs_u

I'm sure Torres, Mascherano, Agger and Reina all come under the same category as those chaps you have mentioned.

Man Utd have much more money than us, so it is pointless to compare their signings to ours. [icon_razz1
 
ningnangnong said:
Leo said:
ningnangnong said:
FCB BB AKA MB said:
Alonso's best matches are for Spain and in Europe as he gets the time on the ball to execute, which he can do superbly and does so in the EPL but pretty inconsistently. Lots of talent but he has never really shown it since he moved to England. Houllier was the same as Benitez with signing the 2nd instead of 1st tier players outside of Torres, Gerrard, Reina, Carragher, Agger they lack true class and continuing to sign guys like Beneyoun, Voronin, Pennant just gives them more average players to choose from and then rotate.

Hmmm, i don't think his signings have been all that bad TBH.

And there-in lies the problem IMO. We should demand more than 'all that bad'. Tevez, Rooney, Ronaldo, Vidic? Signings that weren't all that bad? Nope, they are great signings (albeit they are grade-A wankers). The champions are buying the best while we aren't doing too badly. Not doing too badly is for shit teams like Middlesbrough and marginally less mediocre ones like Everton. Gareth Barry, Benayoun, Pennant aren't all that bad a player, but they aren't Premiership winners.

Vote 1 Lucas Podolski icon_thumbs_u

I'm sure Torres, Mascherano, Agger and Reina all come under the same category as those chaps you have mentioned.

Man Utd have much more money than us, so it is pointless to compare their signings to ours. [icon_razz1

Man U spend more money on less signings than Liverpool, because pool by tonnes of mediocre crap like Djouf, Cherou, Finnan, Dudek, Westerveld, Pennant, Zenden, Crouch, Benayoun. They have only spent serious money 3 times; Torres, Reina and Masch and they are great. They could have saved alot of time and heartache and spent far less on crap that they didn't need and buy genuine articles like Tevez, Vidic etc.
 
Liverpool fans need to stop saying that their side doesn't spend much money. They easily spend enough that they shouldn't be scrapping it out for fourth and being out of the race by Christmas. However, as long as Benitez is there they have 0% chance of getting anywhere near the EPL title anyway. Having said that, I predict they will sack him in the off season.

Also, stop looking at the 1 great signing and 4 decent signings the fat bastard has made and have a look at the ridiculous amount of mid-table dross he has pumped into that laughing stock of a club.
 
robbie mustoe said:
Liverpool fans need to stop saying that their side doesn't spend much money. They easily spend enough that they shouldn't be scrapping it out for fourth and being out of the race by Christmas. However, as long as Benitez is there they have 0% chance of getting anywhere near the EPL title anyway. Having said that, I predict they will sack him in the off season.

Also, stop looking at the 1 great signing and 4 decent signings the fat bastard has made and have a look at the ridiculous amount of mid-table dross he has pumped into that laughing stock of a club.

If I were you, I'd be more worried about my own backyard [icon_wink
 
I cannot believe Liverpool drew that game this morning, like Craig Foster said it was pathetic to watch a side with a fair amount of talent reduced to playing such rubbish football. Sure they got a result but it was so thoroughly undeserved, Arsenal should have had a pen when Kujt pulled down Hleb and if it wasn't for Bendtner playing GK for Pool it should have been another. I hate the pathetic style Rafa gets them playing away from home in the CL it makes the game so much worse to watch when there is one side playing and one side full of good players just sitting on their hands. It is a pity sides like Arsenal get punished for playing beautiful football, 61% possession FFS!
 
FCB BB AKA MB said:
I cannot believe Liverpool drew that game this morning, like Craig Foster said it was pathetic to watch a side with a fair amount of talent reduced to playing such rubbish football. Sure they got a result but it was so thoroughly undeserved, Arsenal should have had a pen when Kujt pulled down Hleb and if it wasn't for Bendtner playing GK for Pool it should have been another. I hate the pathetic style Rafa gets them playing away from home in the CL it makes the game so much worse to watch when there is one side playing and one side full of good players just sitting on their hands. It is a pity sides like Arsenal get punished for playing beautiful football, 61% possession FFS!

I'll take success over 'beauty' anyday.

People always side with Arsenal in situations like this, why can't anyone praise the defensive performance of Liverpool? They had a plan to go there and play on the break which obviously worked. Arsenal couldn't break through for a second goal, i couldn't give shit if they play football that's nice to watch.
 
ningnangnong said:
FCB BB AKA MB said:
I cannot believe Liverpool drew that game this morning, like Craig Foster said it was pathetic to watch a side with a fair amount of talent reduced to playing such rubbish football. Sure they got a result but it was so thoroughly undeserved, Arsenal should have had a pen when Kujt pulled down Hleb and if it wasn't for Bendtner playing GK for Pool it should have been another. I hate the pathetic style Rafa gets them playing away from home in the CL it makes the game so much worse to watch when there is one side playing and one side full of good players just sitting on their hands. It is a pity sides like Arsenal get punished for playing beautiful football, 61% possession FFS!

I'll take success over 'beauty' anyday.

People always side with Arsenal in situations like this, why can't anyone praise the defensive performance of Liverpool? They had a plan to go there and play on the break which obviously worked. Arsenal couldn't break through for a second goal, i couldn't give shit if they play football that's nice to watch.

I am a neutral here and the way Liverpool played disgusted me. I like Liverpool and enjoy watching them except in this situation they were atrocious this morning. Yes sure they did well to hold out for only the 1 goal but it clearly should have been 2 and could have been 5 or 6.
 
If Arsenal aren't good enough to get more goals after dominating a game like they did this morning I don't see how it's our fault. It's been their problem throughout the season (particularly over the last couple of months). They continually dominate games but can't put the opposition away. And yet somehow it's our fault?!!

Sure we'd all like to see our teams playing free-flowing attractive football, but in the end, it's results that count. And if playing 'rubbish football' gets us through to the next round and beyond, despite how undeserved it may be, I personally couldn't give a flying rats because ultimately, it's all about winning for me.
 
Look I want me team to win regardless of the way they do it, I see your positions clearly and that is fine. I was just saying from a neutrals point of view a team with a decent roster as they have could produce something worth watching.
 
FCB BB AKA MB said:
Look I want me team to win regardless of the way they do it, I see your positions clearly and that is fine. I was just saying from a neutrals point of view a team with a decent roster as they have could produce something worth watching.

We were going to entertain but we are smart enough to realise that we can't produce anything that could possibly compete with the sight of Nicolas Bendtner saving his team-mates shots icon_thumbs_u
 
FCB BB AKA MB said:
Look I want me team to win regardless of the way they do it, I see your positions clearly and that is fine. I was just saying from a neutrals point of view a team with a decent roster as they have could produce something worth watching.

Mate I can definately see your point of view too - but I find criticism like this a bit hard to swallow at times when there are plenty of other teams throughout Europe who employ the exact same tactics, but they don't get the same sort of criticism like that twat Foster came out with this morning. I didn't hear Foster on his bandwagon when we used the exact same tactics in knocking out Inter. Only difference between the two games was the players performance in the Inter match was better than in the Arsenal one.
 
The referee's along with Inter's horrid tactics helped the Pool a lot as well, however they thoroughly outplayed what was in front of them. There are other teams who play like that in Europe I just don't think there are teams of their caliber that do. Its Rafa's way and hey its effective and thats all that should really matter, unless your like me and are just watching the game for the love of it.
 

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