Round 10 - Sea Eagles vs Broncos

[BroncsFan]

I look at the 5th tackle options early in the game and the inability to create any pressure or win any field position. I can't recall but was Milford doing the bulk of the kicking against the cows and/or titans?

Last night he seemed to be doing all the kicking at least early on... It's fine for him to come in and put up his floating bombs every now and then, but in recent weeks I thought Gamble was taking on a fair bit of the kicking and all the boring game management stuff to allow Milf to float around and pick his spots... did we suddenly decide to stop that and revert to Milf being halfback again?? I don't want him doing that role I want Gamble doing that and Milf chiming in and wrapping around the ruck to make extra numbers, etc.

I thought the middles were also dominated early on as well. It took a little while for Lodge to get up to speed compared to recent weeks, but Flegler was well below what Carrigan brings and will show how much we will miss him.

I don't recall Asiata being brought on until right at the end, which seems a ridiculous move when the middle is getting dominated.

Thought Kennedy went alright when he came on, so possibly he should move into the starting side and Haas to lock.. Flegler back to the bench and revert to his previous role

 

[Huge]

I look at the 5th tackle options early in the game and the inability to create any pressure or win any field position. I can't recall but was Milford doing the bulk of the kicking against the cows and/or titans?

Last night he seemed to be doing all the kicking at least early on... It's fine for him to come in and put up his floating bombs every now and then, but in recent weeks I thought Gamble was taking on a fair bit of the kicking and all the boring game management stuff to allow Milf to float around and pick his spots... did we suddenly decide to stop that and revert to Milf being halfback again?? I don't want him doing that role I want Gamble doing that and Milf chiming in and wrapping around the ruck to make extra numbers, etc.

I thought the middles were also dominated early on as well. It took a little while for Lodge to get up to speed compared to recent weeks, but Flegler was well below what Carrigan brings and will show how much we will miss him.

I don't recall Asiata being brought on until right at the end, which seems a ridiculous move when the middle is getting dominated.

Thought Kennedy went alright when he came on, so possibly he should move into the starting side and Haas to lock.. Flegler back to the bench and revert to his previous role

I've wanted Kennedy to start since the beginning of the season and love the idea of having four big men relentlessly hammering them early. We could even have Kennedy and Lodge, Flegler and TPJ and Haas at lock. Smash through the middle.

 

[BroncsFan]

I've wanted Kennedy to start since the beginning of the season and love the idea of having four big men relentlessly hammering them early. We could even have Kennedy and Lodge, Flegler and TPJ and Haas at lock. Smash through the middle.

I thought Flegler struggled to bend the line last night, it's something that we missed without Carrigan being there. Pat makes great meters all game and compliments Haas and Lodge. Felt Haas was a lone hand last night as Lodge took too long to get going and Flegler had no impact.

Flegler seems better starting from the bench when the opposition forwards are tired or he's coming up against the opponent's bench forwards as well.

 

[Huge]

I thought Flegler struggled to bend the line last night, it's something that we missed without Carrigan being there. Pat makes great meters all game and compliments Haas and Lodge. Felt Haas was a lone hand last night as Lodge took too long to get going and Flegler had no impact.

Flegler seems better starting from the bench when the opposition forwards are tired or he's coming up against the opponent's bench forwards as well.

Yes, I can see that has merit but I've also thought that he hardly ever seems in sync when he comes on as a replacement too. I've always thought he needed to start to be 'on the pace' or in sync if you like. His timing, ball handling etc just appears poor when he hasn't started game with everyone else. If I was coach I'd try and get him to do the first or second hit up, get him into the game earlier. Just my thoughts brother, not arguing with your point.

 

[Purple Pills]

In the next 2 weeks we play both the roosters and Melbourne.
The NRL is an utter joke in many regards and the draw is just another. In the first 12 rounds the reigning wooden spooners would have played the reigning premiers twice, parra twice and Titans twice, along with Penrith, south’s and the rooster once.
How the **** is that remotely fair?
Whilst we have played some of the top teams twice, we are yet to play a single game against the likes of the tigers, knights, sharks, st George or Warriors.
It’s time some questions start to get answered V lad.

The Panthers who is the one team that don’t need a leg up haven’t even played their biggest rivals and derby game against the Eels once.

In fact they don’t even get them until Round 16. Also look at their draw for the first 16 rounds in general. Farcical

 

[rnabokov]

So, good play like tackle busts? Tries? Line breaks? Try assists? So, as a player not up to top class fb play his stats should back that up I suppose...except they don't.

Of course you're going to say his stats don't mean anything but equally neither does Troybitch's. It's weird how good stats for a despised player don't matter but fir a favoured son, they mean a lot.

Just for the record, that shit fullback has 41 tackle busts in ten games. 4.1 per game.

Turbo has a better average but why? That's because his were gathered against the Titans, WestTigers, Warriors and Broncos. Against the quality team, Penrith he made 3 tackle busts and did bugger all else. Isaako on the other hand plays for the wooden spooners who have played against the premium teams and even against Penrith managed 4 tackle busts. So, he's going alright especially considering he's contributed 66 points out of our total of 146. That's 80 points amongst the other 22 odd team mates. Yep, he's shit .

Mate, it's not stats. His attacking stats are great. he just doesn't have a sufficiently acute footy brain to play a key, absolutely critical role of FB, which is more like a 2nd 5/8 in the best sides. Like some of the passes Turbo, and others at the top throw, the way they time their involvement and combine with their halves and hooker (not that we have one).

Isaako for centre where for mine he belongs, and try Herbie at the back

 

[rnabokov]

I thought Flegler struggled to bend the line last night, it's something that we missed without Carrigan being there. Pat makes great meters all game and compliments Haas and Lodge. Felt Haas was a lone hand last night as Lodge took too long to get going and Flegler had no impact.

Flegler seems better starting from the bench when the opposition forwards are tired or he's coming up against the opponent's bench forwards as well.

Spot on. Flegs is ideal for the bench. We really missed Carrigan's energy in attack and defence.

 

[Kimlo]

Flegler runs like a pillow for someone of his size and strength

 

[I bleed Maroon]

So after all that drama last night, sin bins, six agains and penalties galore, the only player we lose to suspension is Riki. I am so fucking pissed off man. We got straight up mauled and for what? Just another embarrassing kneejerk reaction from the NRL.

 

[Huge]

Mate, it's not stats. His attacking stats are great. he just doesn't have a sufficiently acute footy brain to play a key, absolutely critical role of FB, which is more like a 2nd 5/8 in the best sides. Like some of the passes Turbo, and others at the top throw, the way they time their involvement and combine with their halves and hooker (not that we have one).

Isaako for centre where for mine he belongs, and try Herbie at the back

Well I don't know what you watch but Isaako has thrown superb passes this season, has several try assists and your opinion is definitely not based on the evidence. Perhaps if he had quality, 6, 7 and 9 spine players he'd be scoring tries left right and centre. I really don’t know what some of you watch.

 

[Wolfie]

We had set plays in the last two games, in this game it looked like they forgot what game they where playing.

We dip far too much when things don't go our way, it's embarrassing how soft we are.

I didnt see much in the way of set plays tbh. I just see no structure at all. Probably a bit harsh on Kevvie, but i would have expected a little more by this stage. Not talking about anywhere near the finished article, just improvement. We are still leaking too many points and we need to start with our defensive structures and communication. You cant win anything if you cant defend.

 

[Wolfie]

Milf agenda? You think he put in ?
Well I don't, not at all, he resorted to the same thing he always does and that is kicking duties. It is his easy out. It is not an agenda it is a reality, no support play, sloppy passing, poor dedence, jogging back into line, less then 5 runs, how many touches did he have. He is not the reason we lost but his performance was unacceptable. His job is to get those structures going that the coach has worked out and if you think Kev has no set plays your kidding yourself. We have the worst spine going, that is why the set plays breakdown, just re watch the first half and you will see the timing was shot, Milf actually put his hands up like what am i supposed to be doing when Gamble went to pass to him. Somebody was completely missing on the set play Gamble tossed to nobody. We have a lot of issues and Kev aint it. ... YEt.

Yep, you have a Milford agenda and he did put in last night. Your criticisms of Milford could have been leveled at many others, but you pick Milford. I'd say that's an agenda.

I'm not going to fault his effort. I have in other games, i dont think he has been involving himself anywhere near enough, but i think last night he did at least raise his effort levels. And don't confuse effort with form either. His form is poor, he isn't executing what he needs to, that's different from not putting in.

Kid yourself all you want, we have shown nothing in terms of set plays and attacking and defensive structure. Teams with good structures don't get pumped as often as we do and don't look as clueless in attack as we do. Its no good doing it against Penrith then getting carved up against team like the Gold Coast ( and yes, i know we won but they cut through us at times like a hot knife through butter ). We have had 290 points put on us already this year, that's 1 less than this time last year so hardly any improvement in defence at all. We have scored 146 points so far this year, so we are about 2 converted tries better off than 2020. That's a little better, but not a great deal better. I'm not really bothered if people think i'm wrong or want to have a pop at me for it, but i don't think Kevvie has the answers. I do think he has a good football mind, and he can coach certain areas as he showed alongside Bennett at times, i just dont think he is a head coach. His record just gives me very little confidence and i'm not just talking about what he is doing this year.

 

[heartly87]

Yep, you have a Milford agenda and he did put in last night. Your criticisms of Milford could have been leveled at many others, but you pick Milford. I'd say that's an agenda.

I'm not going to fault his effort. I have in other games, i dont think he has been involving himself anywhere near enough, but i think last night he did at least raise his effort levels. And don't confuse effort with form either. His form is poor, he isn't executing what he needs to, that's different from not putting in.

Kid yourself all you want, we have shown nothing in terms of set plays and attacking and defensive structure. Teams with good structures don't get pumped as often as we do and don't look as clueless in attack as we do. Its no good doing it against Penrith then getting carved up against team like the Gold Coast ( and yes, i know we won but they cut through us at times like a hot knife through butter ). We have had 290 points put on us already this year, that's 1 less than this time last year so hardly any improvement in defence at all. We have scored 146 points so far this year, so we are about 2 converted tries better off than 2020. That's a little better, but not a great deal better. I'm not really bothered if people think i'm wrong or want to have a pop at me for it, but i don't think Kevvie has the answers. I do think he has a good football mind, and he can coach certain areas as he showed alongside Bennett at times, i just dont think he is a head coach. His record just gives me very little confidence and i'm not just talking about what he is doing this year.

No I have an opinion regarding Milford, he is not up to grade and he is not putting in. If you think what he did out there was having a proper go then I don't know what to say. It was mediocre crap and not good enough. I have no power for any agenda to do anything mate. But if I did my number one agenda would be to move the bloke on. I am not kidding myself at all, we lack the fabric in this team to get a game plan done. It's not a new issue at all. It was showing at the end of Bennets time here and showed with Pies. We have a spine that struggles to work a game plan. Our timing is all over the place, that is a player issue, play is not crisp or fluid and the result is players retreating into their shell instead of working to the game plan.

I agree there are more people not performing then him. But most of them are not in key postitions, have been in said position for 6 years and are being paid a mil a year.

The defense issue is a league issue, it's got more to do with the current rules then simple structures. A team like Souths can have 50 put on them easily, scores of 40+ are common in the modern game.

 

[eazy-duzzit]

And for those self-professed 'balanced' posters in this thread saying people are blaming the refs for the result, I don't think most people are but I would like your genuine thoughts on a couple of things last night:

1. The was it even really penalty worthy call back after giving a FULL set of six to Manly.
2. Gamble being penalised for tackling too hard.
3. The Manly player running off the mark and playing it sideways and receiving a penalty.
4. The Manly held-up no try and clearly going into touch but getting the ball back.

Thoughts on these key moments? Were they the correct calls?

It's mindblowing people going out of their way to downplay Sutton's influence on the game. Yes we played shit and still would've lost based on the effort put forward by the boys, BUT we weren't even given a chance to compete. Felt like Sutton applied two different interpretations of the rules against the teams

 

[Mr Fourex]

I get the Milford agenda, but he isnt the coach, he doesnt set the team up, thats Kevvie and the coaches. Last night was nothing to do with whatever Milfords failings are ( and tbf, i thought he actually put in a fair bit, he just wasnt great ). Firstly, the way we were on the end of refs decisions had an impact, but what we shouldnt forget is that across the board we just played dumb footy. Johns and Slater made the point Manly played with set plays and structures. We dont. We just go out on to the field and hope things come off. We dont have a game plan.

The mess we are in now is not a simple as lets blame Milford for everything and bag him at every opportunity the same as that wasnt the case for Boyd when it was happening with him. We rely on Kevvies passion and commitment, and while that will get you so far, it has to be combined with some solid attacking and defensive structures and set plays. Thats the thing i'm most critical of Kevvie for at the moment, we dont look like those are being developed.

Thank you...well said.

 

[Alec]

Broncos haven't had any real quality attacking structures since possibly 2015, and before that probably 2011. 2 years out of the last 10. That's under Seibold, Griffin, Bennett and Walters so far. Maybe the club is cursed right now.

 

[Wolfie]

No I have an opinion regarding Milford, he is not up to grade and he is not putting in. If you think what he did out there was having a proper go then I don't know what to say. It was mediocre crap and not good enough. I have no power for any agenda to do anything mate. But if I did my number one agenda would be to move the bloke on. I am not kidding myself at all, we lack the fabric in this team to get a game plan done. It's not a new issue at all. It was showing at the end of Bennets time here and showed with Pies. We have a spine that struggles to work a game plan. Our timing is all over the place, that is a player issue, play is not crisp or fluid and the result is players retreating into their shell instead of working to the game plan.

I agree there are more people not performing then him. But most of them are not in key postitions, have been in said position for 6 years and are being paid a mil a year.

The defense issue is a league issue, it's got more to do with the current rules then simple structures. A team like Souths can have 50 put on them easily, scores of 40+ are common in the modern game.

Defence issue is clearly an issue at Brisbane. Other teams are better coached and adapt. Its not like us getting toweled up is a one off. We have been getting toweled up for a long time now. Every team gets the odd beating, we get hammered way too much. You cant just put it down to the rule changes. Seibold was a big part of it, and Kevvie hasnt improved it either. I like Kevvie, but i've been pretty consistent with my view about him even before he coached here, i dont believe he is good enough to be a head coach in the NRL. If he wasnt a Broncos legend there is no way in hell we would have looked at him for the job.

In regards to Milf, if he didnt bother you so much you wouldnt constantly criticise him over others. Most halves would struggle on the back of the possession we got last night, but previously to that i dont think anyone is saying he has been good either over the last couple of years. I dont see the point of going on about his salary either tbh. Thats what we offered him, he took it. What seems to get overlooked is, as i said before, he got it on the back of not being the main play maker, not being a game manager, he got it on the back of being a player who could change a game by being a bit of an x-factor. After hunt left, we still wanted him to be that player, but we also wanted him to be Cooper Cronk as well. That player has never existed in the game and never will.

 

[tommy]

Defence issue is clearly an issue at Brisbane. Other teams are better coached and adapt. Its not like us getting toweled up is a one off. We have been getting toweled up for a long time now. Every team gets the odd beating, we get hammered way too much. You cant just put it down to the rule changes. Seibold was a big part of it, and Kevvie hasnt improved it either. I like Kevvie, but i've been pretty consistent with my view about him even before he coached here, i dont believe he is good enough to be a head coach in the NRL. If he wasnt a Broncos legend there is no way in hell we would have looked at him for the job.

In regards to Milf, if he didnt bother you so much you wouldnt constantly criticise him over others. Most halves would struggle on the back of the possession we got last night, but previously to that i dont think anyone is saying he has been good either over the last couple of years. I dont see the point of going on about his salary either tbh. Thats what we offered him, he took it. What seems to get overlooked is, as i said before, he got it on the back of not being the main play maker, not being a game manager, he got it on the back of being a player who could change a game by being a bit of an x-factor. After hunt left, we still wanted him to be that player, but we also wanted him to be Cooper Cronk as well. That player has never existed in the game and never will.

I’m almost certain when milf signed that mil$ contract he did it with the understanding he would take the role of main playmaker, if memory serves. Absolutely his pay packet can be pointed at as to why he’s a failure imo.