Matt Lodge Discussion

[Foordy]

A gross generalization and way wide of the mark Foordy.

when you have been around here (and other league forums) as long as i have you'll realise i am spot on

 

[Foordy]

Secondly I find it disturbing that clearly someone inside the media or nrl clearly has such a strong hate for Brisbane that they would wait until the week the nrl kicks off to AGAIN bring the lodge issue to the forefront of the media. To me it’s a clear attempt to put lodge off his game and unsettle the brocnos right from the players to the sponsors and the staff and even the fans at a crucial time of the year. Luckily for us Wayne is a very no bulshit kind of a guy and will come out and blast those behind this or simply ignore it and not give the media the reaction they want. Hopefully our boys don’t let it get to them and put it off their game.

Let's hope it has the same affect as when the media tried to put Smith and the maroons of their games but airing the ACA Mckinnon interview (aka hatchet job) just before origin a few years ago ... the result was complete annihilation of the Blues (thye complete opposite of what the were hoping for)

 

[theshed]

The problem is that most, if not all of the people who get shot by police are criminals. Why aren't you asking why such a minority of people commit crimes at such a disproportionate rate?

Of course you can say they were innocent or born into terrible circumstances created by white people, but that wouldn't be true. Very few people shot by police are as innocent as the media make them out to be.

Again, assuming you are correct, it does not mater if they are criminals or not. The question is, were they behaving in a manner that justified the use of deadly force?

If the answer is no, that is a very big problem.

On top of that, your question of “why a minority of people commit crimes at such a disproportionate rate?” is very bothersome. If it isn’t their circumstances that causes this to be true, as you suggest, what exactly is it that you’re implying? Genetics?

 

[Kimlo]

Again, assuming you are correct, it does not mater if they are criminals or not. The question is, were they behaving in a manner that justified the use of deadly force?

If the answer is no, that is a very big problem.

On top of that, your question of “why a minority of people commit crimes at such a disproportionate rate?” is very bothersome. If it isn’t their circumstances that causes this to be true, as you suggest, what exactly is it that you’re implying? Genetics?

Cult thinks white men are hard done by.

 

[Cult]

Again, assuming you are correct, it does not mater if they are criminals or not. The question is, were they behaving in a manner that justified the use of deadly force?

If the answer is no, that is a very big problem.

On top of that, your question of “why a minority of people commit crimes at such a disproportionate rate?” is very bothersome. If it isn’t their circumstances that causes this to be true, as you suggest, what exactly is it that you’re implying? Genetics?

What matters is if they are attacking a police officer or civilian. Rarely is anyone shot with their hands up or on their knees and when they are the police officer is punished like they should. I personally think the problem is the amount of guns in the US. Police officers see someone reach into a pocket and automatically think the worst. And understandably so too. There's no way to be properly trained in a place like America. Unfortunately as it seems, black people make the mistake more often than others.

There is only a chance of being shot if you're an idiot who is either doing something wrong or not listening to instructions. Instead of black VS white why can't we argue innocent vs guilty people being shot?

Also I wasn't implying anything at all and any accusation of the sort is reaching.

 

[Cult]

Cult thinks white men are hard done by.

Excuse me staff member, shouldn't you be disputing points instead of speaking for me? Are you basing this comment on previous posts or the stats I have posted because if it's the latter you'd be wrong.

 

[theshed]

What matters is if they are able to attack a police officer. Rarely is anyone shot with their hands up or on their knees and when they are the police officer is punished like they should. I personally think the problem is the amount of guns in the US. Police officers see someone reach into a pocket and automatically think the worst. And understandably so too. There's no way to be properly trained in a place like America. Unfortunately as it seems, black people make the mistake more often than others.

There is only a chance of being shot if you're an idiot who is either doing something wrong or not listening to instructions. Instead of black VS white why can't we argue innocent vs guilty people being shot?

Also I wasn't implying anything at all and any accusation of the sort is reaching.

There is plenty of data available on the biases people have based on race when determining threats. The fact is, in studies that place people in the situation of very quick decision making, unarmed black people are far more likely to be erroneously labelled as armed/a threat. Somewhat interestingly, this bias is also displayed to some extent by black participants.

Now what causes this bias is purely speculation. Media’s portrayal of blacks, inbuilt racism, genetic tribalism, the real issue of higher crime rates in black communities, or one of or a combination of infinite other possibilities.

This of course means that police offices may not be anymore bias than the general pop (I don’t know, I’m not aware of data from these types of experiments comparing US police to the general pop). So it’s possible to say that any of us have the potential to react in the same way if we were in the shoes of the cops. I’m not going to hate on individual police officers for their very human errors.

The fact that it may be at least partially a subconscious reaction doesn’t take away from it being an issue that needs to be addressed though. Be it through better training, or more exposure to black communities. I’m not sure of the answer.

Of course, like with all stats the death by cop numbers should be looked at closer, and there should be mention of whether the police were in actual danger or not, wether the shootings were justified or not. So I agree to some extent “guilt and innocence” should be discussed if by guilt you mean they are guilty of endangering the lives of police or others. If you just mean they were guilty of committing a crime than that is irrelevant, the police are there to bring suspects in front of the legal system and not to dole out street justice.

Even taking that into account it definitely is a vs blacks issue. Perhaps not ‘white vs blacks’ but definitely a police or society vs blacks issue.

 

[Alec]

Blacks in America often have a bad culture. Very often no father figures, being brought up on Gangsta rap glorifying violence, and ghetto kids making fun of other blacks kids for being "white" if they try to study or make something of themselves.

 

[theshed]

Blacks in America often have a bad culture. Very often no father figures, being brought up on Gangsta rap glorifying violence, and ghetto kids making fun of other blacks kids for being "white" if they try to study or make something of themselves.

What’s your point?

 

[Cult]

There is plenty of data available on the biases people have based on race when determining threats. The fact is, in studies that place people in the situation of very quick decision making, unarmed black people are far more likely to be erroneously labelled as armed/a threat. Somewhat interestingly, this bias is also displayed to some extent by black participants.

Now what causes this bias is purely speculation. Media’s portrayal of blacks, inbuilt racism, genetic tribalism, the real issue of higher crime rates in black communities, or one of or a combination of infinite other possibilities.

This of course means that police offices may not be anymore bias than the general pop (I don’t know, I’m not aware of data from these types of experiments comparing US police to the general pop). So it’s possible to say that any of us have the potential to react in the same way if we were in the shoes of the cops. I’m not going to hate on individual police officers for their very human errors.

The fact that it may be at least partially a subconscious reaction doesn’t take away from it being an issue that needs to be addressed though. Be it through better training, or more exposure to black communities. I’m not sure of the answer.

Of course, like with all stats the death by cop numbers should be looked at closer, and there should be mention of whether the police were in actual danger or not, wether the shootings were justified or not. So I agree to some extent “guilt and innocence” should be discussed if by guilt you mean they are guilty of endangering the lives of police or others. If you just mean they were guilty of committing a crime than that is irrelevant, the police are there to bring suspects in front of the legal system and not to dole out street justice.

Even taking that into account it definitely is a vs blacks issue. Perhaps not ‘white vs blacks’ but definitely a police or society vs blacks issue.

I agree with this and I think each shooting should be looked at seperately. In a perfect world, nobody would be shot. But nobody would be committing crimes or are a threat.

What i was disputing was "if he was Sam Thaiday's complexion there is a good chance he would have been shot regardless of state.".

Consider the amount of crimes committed and the amount of people who are shot, it certainly isn't a good chance and the comment was a huge exaggeration.

 

[theshed]

I agree with this and I think each shooting should be looked at seperately. In a perfect world, nobody would be shot. But nobody would be committing crimes or are a threat.

What i was disputing was "if he was Sam Thaiday's complexion there is a good chance he would have been shot regardless of state.".

Consider the amount of crimes committed and the amount of people who are shot, it certainly isn't a good chance and the comment was a huge exaggeration.

Well that is something we can agree on. I actually found that comment ridiculous. I just assumed it was meant somewhat tongue in cheek. Though Americans definitely have been shot by police for less. His chances of getting shot if he was black definitely increase, but the occasions of actual police shootings in America are low enough to say it would’ve been very unlikely that he would be shot regardless of colour.

I wasn’t trying to reinforce that comment. I was pointing out the flaw in the logic of the numbers you provided.

 

[heartly87]

Man how stupidly. Those punches where pathetic. He could barely stand and that cuck let him throw wild hooks at his head and wrestle him like a sloppy fish. I don't care how big you are. That sober fellow could have punched the shit out of lodge. The media is a joke. Lodge was an idiot and has hopefully got himself together. I don't know what is worse the behaviour or the punches.

 

[Porthoz]

I absolutely believe there is a bias against black and hispanic people, but I do not believe it's based on racism, but rather circumstances where the percentage of black and hispanic population is more likely to be criminal, and more importantly a life threat to police officers.
That this results in incidents where an "innocent" black or hispanic gets shot, cannot be a surprise to anyone, and are, outside of rare and isolated racially motivated shootings, a consequence of the police officer's fear for his life (warranted or not).

The reasons behind this issue are many, rooted in a past of violent racial discrimination, a deep mistrust of authority, allied to the unwillingness and/or ability to invest in solutions that genuinely make gangs' (and the fear they cause amongst their own) existence impossible.

 

[theshed]

I absolutely believe there is a bias against black and hispanic people, but I do not believe it's based on racism, but rather circumstances where the percentage of black and hispanic population is more likely to be criminal, and more importantly a life threat to police officers.
That this results in incidents where an "innocent" black or hispanic gets shot, cannot be a surprise to anyone, and are, outside of rare and isolated racially motivated shootings, a consequence of the police officer's fear for his life (warranted or not).

The reasons behind this issue are many, rooted in a past of violent racial discrimination, a deep mistrust of authority, allied to the unwillingness and/or ability to invest in solutions that genuinely make gangs' (and the fear they cause amongst their own) existence impossible.

Yea, it’s the logical conclusion to race issues and gun control in America. Not surprising at all.

 

[Super Freak]

So how about that Matt Lodge video?

 

[TonyTheJugoslav]

I made a smart ass comment and l apologise for taking the discussion off course. My bad, l should know better.

 

[vertigo]

Going on the CCTV footage how many of us would choose to cop that for a $1.6M payout?

How many of us have copped worse than that? I'm tellin' ya I should be a billionaire

What in ****'s name is this?

I'm outta here like BP, this place is deranged.

 

[tommy]

What in ****'s name is this?

I'm outta here like BP, this place is deranged.

don't let the door hit you on the way out. :wave: